First time hunter questions (long winded)

[mummac]

If you guys have a free moment, I'd like to ask a few questions. I've done some searching on this forum and still have some unanswered questions. I usually put quite a bit of research into new hobbies and this subject seems best learned by asking the experienced rather than just reading books and websites.

I'm currently taking a hunter education class as this is my first year hunting. Also, I know a few hunters that I’ll buddy-up with to learn the ropes. So don’t worry, I’m not going out totally green all on my own.

1. How necessary is camouflage?
I'm wondering how necessary camouflage is. How much of a disadvantage will I be at just wearing jeans and an orange t-shirt for deer/hog hunting in Florida. The guy teaching the hunter ed class today was ranting fire and brimstone about people getting shot by accident. It made me want to buy a safety orange jump suit.

2. Is 7.62X39mm ethical for FL deer and hogs?
I'm no stranger to the woods around here and have seen tons of deer before. They don't seem to get that big. I've been eyeing a CZ 7.62X39 carbine and hunting this year seems like a good excuse to buy it. Otherwise, I have no problem getting something bigger. I’m thinking .308, .270 or maybe .30-30… or a shotgun. I have a lever-action .357mag that I’m a fairly decent shot with, so is that an option too? This is my biggest dilemma of the whole ordeal.

3. Deodorant?
I don’t see myself buying deer scent or anything, but should I avoid wearing deodorant and using shampoo or will my BO be worse for the deer to smell. This seems like a silly question, but I’ve been wondering about it.

4. What do I do if I shoot something and it doesn’t die right away?
What is the ethical means of putting an end to it? Should I have a sidearm for a close up head shot? Use a knife? I’ve read that waiting 20 minutes is standard practice before approaching a kill as to not spook it if it’s just wounded. Does that sound right to you guys?

5. What about snacks?
Will the smell of food be bad in any way?

Most of this will probably also be answered in the class or by people I know. I’m just getting kind of anxious for answers.

 

[Itote]

Camo helps but is not totally neccessary,unless maybe you bow hunt.More of a personel choice I guess.

If your gonna be hunting on a management area during any season other than archery you have to wear 500sq. in. of daylight orange anyhow,again,personel choice.

7.62x39 fine for deer and hogs. Remington makes them in their core-lokt line unless im mistaking. Cant use ball (fmj) ammo for deer but ok for hogs on private property.

Deodorant will freak a critter out as quick as people musk so hunt the wind or use unscented deodorant or scent control clothing if you so wish.

Taking a snack with you aint gonna hurt nothin and if you should get turned around you'll be proud to have it by daylight the next morning.

Just my 2 cents. Opinions will vary. If i can be of any assistance let me know. I live in Polk City, bout 35-40 miles from Tampa.

 

[mummac]

Thanks for the advice.

 

[Art Eatman]

Birds see colors. Deer, hogs, coyotes, etc., see the world in various shades of grey. Camo's not needed, but dull, earth-toned clothing is just fine.

As far as safety from other hunters, it's generally a trivial problem on private lands. What's most helpful is to coordinate with other hunters about who's gonna be where--and staying with agreements.

While I consider the AK round marginal, it's mostly a distance thing. The cartridge is right at the .30-30 for performance, so anything inside 100 yards oughta be okay--except maybe a really large hog in the over-200 pound class. (Shoats are more tender and tasty.)

Scent: Always consider the wind. No matter what you do, a deer will notice your smell. It helps to not use scented soaps in bathing or clothes-washing, of course; RightGuard, etc. is a no-no. The ideal setup is to have the wind in your face and the sun behind you. (Then you hope Mr. Bucky cooperates.)

If an animal doesn't just fall down Dead Right There (DRT), yeah, a 10- or 20-minute wait keeps him from moving on and lets him bleed out nearby. If you approach an apparently-dead animal, a neck shot behind the ear is as good a coup-de-grace as anything. (I've rarely bothered with carrying a pistol for that need.)

Snacks Are Good. I'd keep them in a ZipLoc bag in the fanny pack or day pack...

, Art

 

[dakotasin]

1. camo's not necessary. the only reason i wear it is because it is next to impossible to get cold weather gear that isn't camo'd. it is state law here to wear orange, anyway.

2. i don't know. i do know that fmj bullets are a very bad idea (and probably illegal), though.

3. wear it. wash your hair, too. just avoid the real strong perfumed types.

4. if you shoot something properly, and it does not die right away, give him a few minutes and then go get it - it will die on its own in short order. if you make a bad shot on something (but still hit it), you must go find it. start looking for blood, hair, tissue, and tracks, and track the critter down and put it down as quickly as you can. anytime you shoot, you need to go to that spot and check for signs of a hit.

5. eat if you are hungry.

it has been my experience that deer need to have at least 2 senses assaulted before they'll spook... hear, smell, and sight. if the deer sees you, but can't smell you and doesn't hear you move, then you are ok. if he smells you, but can't see or hear you, you'r ok... but, if you put any 2 of those together, he's gone right now.

if the deer only sees you, it will make him nervous and put him on alert, making the next few seconds very critical - but he won't leave in a hurry unless you make another mistake.

 

[DigMe]

It's been my experience that you could dress up in a day-glow orange clown suit and it wouldn't make a difference as far as hogs go. Hogs will smell you long before they see you and they often will not spook at visual stimulus. I've also rode up on them in a loud 4-wheeler or clomped loudly upon them through the woods. Hogs are unpredictable in their behavior but generally are not as easily spooked as many other animals. One thing with them though is I try to walk against the wind when I'm stalking through the woods looking for hogs.

For deer it's not as big of a deal as some animals either but it's good to wear something patterned that breaks up your outline IMO. I try not to deer hunt without camo personally but it's been done plenty. Now turkey is a whole different story...if you ever go turkey hunting make sure your underwear and socks are camoed too...you may even want to invest in camo contacts for your eyeballs.


brad cook

 

[mummac]

Again, thanks for all the replies.

 

[Zeke Menuar]

You may wish to consider a M38 Mosin-Nagant for a hog and whitetail gun. Accurate out to 150yds or more. The 7.62x54R round is very inexpensive and is just below 30-06 in power. Wolf makes a 200gr soft-point round that is perfect for what you want. M38 Mosins go for about $100 or so. Oh yeah, Mosins are virtually indectructable.

ZM

 

[mustanger98]

1. How necessary is camouflage? I'm wondering how necessary camouflage is. How much of a disadvantage will I be at just wearing jeans and an orange t-shirt for deer/hog hunting in Florida. The guy teaching the hunter ed class today was ranting fire and brimstone about people getting shot by accident. It made me want to buy a safety orange jump suit.

I don't consider cammo necessary at all. As was stated, deer/hogs/coyotes are colorblind and see the world in shades of grey. Actually, it's more like a range from white to black. The won't see orange as orange. I wear jeans hunting all the time. Avoid colors that look like the deer. You hunter ed instructor is right about people being accidentally shot. Do wear the legal amount of orange.

2. Is 7.62X39mm ethical for FL deer and hogs? I'm no stranger to the woods around here and have seen tons of deer before. They don't seem to get that big. I've been eyeing a CZ 7.62X39 carbine and hunting this year seems like a good excuse to buy it. Otherwise, I have no problem getting something bigger. I’m thinking .308, .270 or maybe .30-30… or a shotgun. I have a lever-action .357mag that I’m a fairly decent shot with, so is that an option too? This is my biggest dilemma of the whole ordeal.

I've never used 7.62x39mm on deer, but I would say out to 100yds on smaller deer with SPs, you're probably fine with it. I personally lean towards a .30-30 (150gr or 170gr SP) out to 150yds. The lever action .357mag, with 158-180 HP-XPTs inside 100yds is an option on the size deer you describe. However, with any rifle/cartridge, shot placement is the key.

3. Deodorant? I don’t see myself buying deer scent or anything, but should I avoid wearing deodorant and using shampoo or will my BO be worse for the deer to smell. This seems like a silly question, but I’ve been wondering about it.

Don't worry about that. The deer will smell you either way. I suggest you figure the area you're hunting and set up downwind of where you expect the deer to be. Also, they have that "Scentblocker" line of clothes now, but I don't have any experience with that.

4. What do I do if I shoot something and it doesn’t die right away? What is the ethical means of putting an end to it? Should I have a sidearm for a close up head shot? Use a knife? I’ve read that waiting 20 minutes is standard practice before approaching a kill as to not spook it if it’s just wounded. Does that sound right to you guys?

Well, like I said before, shot placement is key. If you put your bullet through the upper lungs, they'll fill up with blood. Between that, the hyperbolic shock, and the spinal damage from the bullet hitting that high, the deer should be down in its tracks and dead within about a minute. A sidearm for if that didn't go quite according to plan? Sure. Or you can just use your rifle for that and save carrying two different guns and ammos. Thing is, a wounded deer can thrash and squall and that ain't pretty and it can get to you. So whatever you do, you MUST keep your composure. I've been advised to wait 15-20 minutes too. It just gives everything a few minutes to calm down. When you approach your kill, approach from behind and poke it with a stick or your rifle barrel. If it jumps up and runs, it won't run over you.

5. What about snacks? Will the smell of food be bad in any way?

Consider the smell of the snacks you're carrying. Deer like apples, but if you're hunting in an area where there are no apple trees... A snickers bar will keep you from getting hungry, but a deer can smell those from 500yds and they know they don't grow on trees. Mostly just try and figure where you are and what smells won't be too out of place there. But, this is kinda like I said about deodorant and shampoo- try to get downwind of where you expect the deer to be.

I hope this helps.

 

[mummac]

Zeke wrote:

You may wish to consider a M38 Mosin-Nagant for a hog and whitetail gun. Accurate out to 150yds or more. The 7.62x54R round is very inexpensive and is just below 30-06 in power. Wolf makes a 200gr soft-point round that is perfect for what you want. M38 Mosins go for about $100 or so. Oh yeah, Mosins are virtually indectructable.

I have a M44. The few times I've shot it, my groups weren't that great. At 100 yards, I was shooting about an eight inch spread from a rest with really cheap mil-surp ammo. If I practice and get some good hunting ammo, I'm sure I could tighten that quite a bit, but still don't want to haul that thing around in the woods.

I also have one of those Spanish Civil Guard Mausers in .308 with a synthetic sport stock. I'm really not confident with it enough to use it in a situation I'm completely unexperienced in.

Actually, right before this post, I drove to the gunshop and ordered the CZ 527 carbine in 7.62X39. The guy tried his darnedest to sell me one in .223, but I stuck with the russian round.

My whole reasoning for this rifle is to get something that is super easy to shoot. Also, it's a great excuse to get a new rifle as I don't have a bolt gun in that round. The CZ is really light too.



Mustanger98 wrote:

So whatever you do, you MUST keep your composure. I've been advised to wait 15-20 minutes too. It just gives everything a few minutes to calm down. When you approach your kill, approach from behind and poke it with a stick or your rifle barrel. If it jumps up and runs, it won't run over you.

Duely noted. I didn't think about standing behind it. Great advice.

 

[mustanger98]

mummac, I don't know if you're into handloading or not, but if you can, look at the data for the 7.62x39mm round in Hornady's 5th Edition load manual. Also, note the speeds in volume 1 and check the tragectory/ft.lbs. at those speeds in Volume 2. Compare with .30-30Winchester too just for the sake of comparison.

 

[Sunray]

mummac. It's nice to see a new guy that thinks.
1. Depends on the kind of hunting, but it doesn't hurt. Deer and most other game will see movement before anything else. If they don't smell you. A deer can smell you from a mile. Scent blocks are cheap.
2. Yep, with the right bullet the 7.62x39 will drop a deer. Ballistically, it's about the same as a .303 British, but with a lighter bullet. Shot placement is critical. Mind you, shot placement is critical with any round. Your .357 will do, but it's not the best. A bolt action scoped .308 will be better and it'll give you a reason to buy another rifle. Think Savage. Best out of the box accuracy for the money.
3. You smell of one thing to any game. Trouble. Use the scent blockers. No deoderant for chasing skirts. Pay attention to the wind.
4. If you know your shot went into the heart/lung area, sit for 30 minutes. You have no need for a back up anything. You have a rifle.
Practice shooting with the ammo you intend to hunt with, standing, at 100 yards, at a 9" pie plate until you can hit it every time, then you're ready to hunt. Think 5 rounds on the plate in 2 minutes.
5. Granola bars. And take a canteen. Dehydration sucks.

 

[cooch]

An issue with clothing that hasn't been mentioned...

Noise.

Stay away from nylons and any material that makes more noise than average when you brush it with twigs pushing through scrub. (Brush, whatever.......)
It's a good reason why wool and various synthetic fleece materials have become popular as specialist hunting gear.

Cheers.......... Peter

 

[Art Eatman]

cooch is for-sure right about noisy clothing. I like old, nearly worn-out khakis for my walking hunting. Much less of that "weep, weep, weep" sound in moving through brush.

Again, walking hunting in dry-ish to desert country: My preference in boots is something like Russell Birdhunters or a Wellington with flat, crepe soles. Aside from being lightweight and quiet, they don't track so much dirt/mud into vehicles or camp--or momma's kitchen. You can hear a waffle-stomper guy a mile away...

The last mule deer I killed, I'd just crossed a rocky creek bottom and, easing along, walked to within 30 yards of him before he raised his head to see what was the little disturbance to his midday nap in the sun...

, Art