FN Five-seveN Why aren't we all carrying one?

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In my opinion the 5.7 round is better than it's detractors say it is, but I still wouldn't choose it as a self defense weapon. The comparison to .22 magnum isn't really valid, if you actually look at the data it's usually comparing 5.7 out of a pistol to .22 magnum out of a long rifle barrel. When you look at energy levels it falls a little short of most 9mm loads. I know muzzle energy isn't the best way to quantify the effectiveness of a cartridge, but the amount of kinetic energy is still an important factor in a bullet's performance. I also think that when the weight of the bullet is this light its construction is even more important. The biggest problem with the 5.7 is its lack of penetration, I think it would be interesting to test it's performance with bullets similar to the "controlled expansion" bonded softpoint or solid copper hollowpoint rounds that are used in some .223.

But there really isn't anything out there like that now, and combined with it's unproven status it's not really something I would choose as a defensive weapon.
 
i saw on gunbroker AP rounds for the 5.7 it was one box of 50 for 475.00 the ammo they sell in stores is pointless because its not real 5.7 ammo. The p90 is short barrel and when you look at FN rifles none of them are in 5.7.
 
i saw on gunbroker AP rounds for the 5.7 it was one box of 50 for 475.00 the ammo they sell in stores is pointless because its not real 5.7 ammo. The p90 is short barrel and when you look at FN rifles none of them are in 5.7.
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:scrutiny: What?? :rolleyes:
 
The p90 is short barrel and when you look at FN rifles none of them are in 5.7.
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They claim they will offer their Patrol Bolt Rifle in 5.7 sometime late this year or early next. Be an interesting varmint gun. I have a lot of the ammo already, if the rifle isn't too pricey I'll consider one. Be interesting to see how the round would perform with a long barrel on yotes and other small varmints.
 
I believe there was a 2003 or 2004 ban on AP 5.7 ammunition to the general public. The stuff you see on gunbroker is preban ammo and is very very pricey indeed. More for collecting than shooting I reckon.
 
They claim they will offer their Patrol Bolt Rifle in 5.7 sometime late this year or early next. Be an interesting varmint gun. I have a lot of the ammo already, if the rifle isn't too pricey I'll consider one. Be interesting to see how the round would perform with a long barrel on yotes and other small varmints.
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Who in God's name would design a "Patrol" rifle chambered in 5.7mm? Officers have enough trouble getting their 5.56 rifles to perform adequately especially when shooting through materials such as car windshields. I know of several cases where officers shot at a perp through a windshield with their M4s using Hornady OTM, M855, and Winchester SP ammo and the perp only suffered superficial fragments to the face and he kept on fighting.

Right now there are a number of large agencies that are pushing for 6.8 SPC rifles, .308 rifles, or another alternative that will go through such barriers much better than the light, low sectional density bullets of the 5.56. The 5.7mm is FAR worse.
 
Who in God's name would design a "Patrol" rifle chambered in 5.7mm?
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That's just the name of FN's current bolt action rifle product line, I can't imagine they would try to position it as an actual duty weapon.
 
5.7 ammo isn't cheap and neither is the gun. not a fan of 6.8 spc, .308 , rather have a 9mm out of a 16" barrel. how do you like the term .357 rifle? that takes glock hi cap mags. if i lived in the boons like some of yall do making moonshine i would own a bolt-action rifle bottom line and a .454 but i live in the city and the city requires hollowpoints and hi cap mags.
 
like i said before if i lived in the boons with yall i would take a bolt action rifle for range because most of the shots out in the boons are long range shots. but where i live in south florida mostly city i would say you want a pistol round in a rifle. hence gives you a carbine kel-tec s2k, you would really want a .308 or 6.8 in your house or trunk? i know im never going to take a shot from more then 50 yards out. and nine millys are cheaper. thats why im thinking about a super nova shotgun as my main but not sure about 12 gauge ammo costs.
 
would own a bolt-action rifle bottom line and a .454 but i live in the city and the city requires hollowpoints and hi cap mags.
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Well, I don't think you should be taking shots at people 200 yars away even if you do live in a rural area.(Maybe it's different way out in the mountains though). Hollowpoints(as long as they still get adequate penetration) will still be the best stoppers no matter where you live, and hi-capacity magazines and long range shots are not mutually exclusive.(See CMP matches for example)
 
It is amazing that you guys (most on this thread - but not everyone) who hate the round so much carry this thread 4 pages. Ya'll never get tired of the hatin' - this happens everything there is a thread on this round. It's never about others who own the gun chimin' in - they don't usually because they get tired of this as well
 
My local gun dealer simply will not sell them.....because he has been contacted by a couple of DEA offecers about two that were investigating drug crimes that were committed by individuals having them. He will not even stock them any more.
 
It is amazing that you guys (most on this thread - but not everyone) who hate the round so much carry this thread 4 pages. Ya'll never get tired of the hatin' - this happens everything there is a thread on this round. It's never about others who own the gun chimin' in - they don't usually because they get tired of this as well
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Take the 'spray 'em down' evangelists away, and chances are the 'haters' will vanish too.

This isn't a 'I like my 5-7 thread' - it's a 'you all should have one' evangelising thread, and evangelism elicits a backlash, and rightly so when the claims are as ludicrous as have been made.
 
It is amazing that you guys (most on this thread - but not everyone) who hate the round so much carry this thread 4 pages. Ya'll never get tired of the hatin' - this happens everything there is a thread on this round. It's never about others who own the gun chimin' in - they don't usually because they get tired of this as well
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I don't hate it. I think it would be a great small game cartridge. What I have a problem with is using it for animals that exceed 100lbs which some people on this thread say it would be good for. The 5.7mm is probably on par with the .22 Hornet which has a long history of being a VERY poor cartridge for hunting deer. In addition to gel tests, hunting is also a great way to measure cartridge effectiveness because a deer does not fall down once it realizes it's been shot.....it falls down when it cannot physically stand up anymore. Most people will fall down after being shot with a pellet gun. Your self defense cartridge should be based on that smaller percentage of people who will not fall down when shot, but will keep trying to kill you until you rob their body of neuro connections or oxygenated blood. Someone shot in the chest with a .22lr will die unless there is a medical intervention. However, that person may take anywhere from 30sec to several days to die depending on what is hit. Using a larger caliber will increase the probability of killing the bad guy rapidly and/or increase the speed of their incapacitation. It also gives you a margin of error with your shot placement. The smaller your caliber, the more precise you have to be in order to effectively stop someone and in the chaos of a gun fight precision isn't very practical. This has been well documented.

I've linked to many expert opinions in this thread to show how poor the 5.7mm is as a self defense cartridge. Yet, we have not seen a single opinion from someone who researches this subject for a living that promotes the 4.6 or 5.7. Simply put, they do not exist. There is no backing for these PDW cartridges from anyone in the ballistics or tactical field. Using a PDW caliber in a handgun in the words of Dr. Fackler, "It is likely to get you killed".
 
Actually - I'm gonna quote a guy who just responded to another 5.7 related thread over at Glocktalk, whom I agree with 1000%:

m2 carbine said:
i wish people that post in these 5.7x28 threads would preface their post with such as,
i own and shoot the 5.7x28.
I own the pistol and rifle.
I reload for the 5.7x28
i've shot a friend's fn 5.7 a few times.
I once handled a fn 5.7 at a gun show
i saw a fn 5.7 in a show case
or,
all i know is what i think i know from reading something about the 5.7x28.
And the ever favorite,
the 5.7x28 is the same as the 22 mag.:upeyes:

This way a lot of time could be saved by skipping over the irrelevant posts.:)
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Actually - I'm gonna quote a guy who just responded to another 5.7 related thread over at Glocktalk, whom I agree with 1000%:
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....and sometimes the facts of medical science, and actual world results get in the way of the fatuity of wanting to believe in something with nothing coherant to back it up.

Trends in equipment are a function of necessity. In firearms history it is a constant cycle of peace time firearms developement going smaller, because it "seems" to make little difference in theory. However, when war comes there are numerous examples of armies returning to larger calibers to improve effects. This thread is eight pages long now and I'm not going to repeat word for word expert opinions or historical examples to make my point over, and over again. You 5.7mm owners have not only invested a considerable amount of money, but you have invested your confidence into it too. I'm sure the 5.7 crew at FN forums will pat you all on the back and help you feel better about your investment. I have nothing to gain but the brief possibility of maybe saving a good guy's life should he encounter a determined attacker who has the will to not fall down after being shot.
 
i own and shoot the 5.7x28.
I own the pistol and rifle.
I reload for the 5.7x28
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I'm all of those, still won't carry it as my self defense weapon but don't think that people who DO are crazy. As with any gun fight the most important thing to have with you is a gun. If you bring a 5.7 because you like it where otherwise you might bring nothing, the 5.7 is indeed what you want.

Any gun beats no gun.
 
If you bring a 5.7 because you like it where otherwise you might bring nothing, the 5.7 is indeed what you want.
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Even I will concede that this is the primary reason to carry a Five-seveN; something beats nothing, any day of the week. But, there's guns that are smaller, lighter, more powerful, etc; if restricted to things of similar size, there's more powerful and reliable items, and if not, there's items still smaller and stronger, and so it goes.

But, something beats nothing; but I'd rather have a different something.
 
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