FOPA of 1986 in danger

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LAR-15

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The antis want to roll back gains hard fought for in 1986.

Lots of folks say the FOPA of 1986 was a dumb law that should be repealed.

These folks are either anti gunners or ignorant.

The FOPA made record keeping violations a misdemeanor rather than a felony as previously in the law. Anti gunners want to repeal that in this congress.

Yeah lets go back to 1985............:rolleyes:
 
Yes Let's!!!!

In 1985 you could still file the pape work to make and register a machinegun. So I wouldn't mind that trade since I'm not an FFL:evil: !

Still 2 Many Choices!?
 
It wouldn't be all bad news...

If we coudl get some savvy politcos to tell the Antis that the FOPA '86 is "All or nothing", then we could open up the MG registry again.

Then we get the same politicos to quietly sneak in legislation or ATF policy to not prosecute record keeping errors unless there is a history or evidence of willfully trying to conceal transactions.

It would take some tricky politcal maneuvering, but stranger things have happened.
 
Thefabulousfink said:
It wouldn't be all bad news...

If we coudl get some savvy politcos to tell the Antis that the FOPA '86 is "All or nothing", then we could open up the MG registry again.

Then we get the same politicos to quietly sneak in legislation or ATF policy to not prosecute record keeping errors unless there is a history or evidence of willfully trying to conceal transactions.

It would take some tricky politcal maneuvering, but stranger things have happened.
Click to expand...

Pro-gun people don't do things that way.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thefabulousfink
It wouldn't be all bad news...

If we coudl get some savvy politcos to tell the Antis that the FOPA '86 is "All or nothing", then we could open up the MG registry again.

Then we get the same politicos to quietly sneak in legislation or ATF policy to not prosecute record keeping errors unless there is a history or evidence of willfully trying to conceal transactions.

It would take some tricky politcal maneuvering, but stranger things have happened.
Click to expand...
Pro-gun people don't do things that way.
Click to expand...

Maybe they should learn.
 
Pro-gun people don't do things that way.
Click to expand...

Heh heh, politics is dirty business. Any political advocate who doesn't play hardball gets smacked down. I know I'd like one of those .17 HMR belt-fed machine gun AR uppers! And the ATF already crushes FFLs who make even the most innocuous paperwork mistakes.
 
"If we coudl get some savvy politcos to tell the Antis that the FOPA '86 is "All or nothing", then we could open up the MG registry again."

+1
 
The Hughes Amendment will stay on the books because no gun owners want it repealed.

That's the truth.
 
The way things go with gun rights: Whatever's lost is never regained, whats gained is easily lost.
They'll most likely repeal the fopa protections and keep the MG ban, you can rest assured of that. You'll have a hard time finding enough politicians to say "Im for putting machine guns on our streets" to make it happen any other way.:banghead:
 
Vote for me for Congress, and I promise not to vote for a single new law, no matter how much sense it seems to make. Furthermore, I'll actively work to repeal every existing law I possibly can (such as the FOPA of 86, or the GCA) , in addition to sabotaging every single bill thats proposed, by inserting ridiculous clauses. If you think you're getting that extra $0.30 to keep your kid's milk cold in your government provided school lunch, I hope you're prepared to recognize the Flying Spaghetti Monster as the offical state religion.

I'm Vitamin G, and I approve this message.
(and may you be touched by his noodly appendage)
 
The Hughes Amendment will stay on the books because no gun owners want it repealed.

That's the truth.
Click to expand...

Maybe a majority don't want it repealed. But I'm a gunowner. And the owner of a machinegun currently valued around 5K that I have less than 1K invested in...including the transfer tax.

I'd get rid of that piece of malignant law in a heartbeat.

You've got a logical fallacy going there. The good parts of FOPA are in danger even though no gun owners want it repealed. The bad part of FOPA will stay because no gun owners want it repealed.
 
"Im for putting machine guns on our streets"
Click to expand...

However, if you said, "it merely a collector's clause". It'd go over because people would go, "oh, you know for people who collect guns for historical purposes."
 
Do those of you that want the FOPA repealed really want to go back to signing the FFL's bound book for every single box of ammo you purchase? Before 1986, you couldnt mailorder ammo, you had to buy it in person.

Kharn
 
If they repeal the FOPA they won't reverse the MG ban, just negate all the good parts.

Believe me, the good parts outweigh the badness of the MG ban by a long shot.
 
Zundfolge : Believe me, the good parts outweigh the badness of the MG ban by a long shot.
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This is the mentality that has got the 2nd amend in the trouble it is in right now.
The none machine-gun people gave up machine-guns so they could remove asinine gun control laws that should have never been put on the books in the first place. The gun haters knew they had a tool to go after a group of guns and they did.
Then the gun haters went after the so called assault weapons.
Gun hater will attack and attack the right to bear arms until it is gone.
Gun owners that assist the gun haters by giving up some guns to save the ones they like are only helping the gun haters along.
Shall not infringe means do not screw with my right.
 
This is the mentality that has got the 2nd amend in the trouble it is in right now.
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Its not a "mentality", its an accurate assessment of reality.

We are better off as far as gun rights are concerned with the entire FOPA in force (including the evil MG ban) than we will be if the revoke the entire thing. Even if the revoking of the '86 FOPA included the MG ban (which I doubt it will) the RKBA will be in WORSE shape afterward.

I won't be "happy" until every anti gun law back to and including the 1911 Sullivan Act are done completely away with, but the reality is that is just not going to happen.



The "All or nothing" attitude you seem to be displaying is more likely to get us nothing. We got into this mess incrementally so we have to get out of it incrementally OR we can go to war with the anti gun movement (which I don't see succeeding any better).


Shall not infringe means do not screw with my right.
Click to expand...
I agree with the sentiment, but what exactly are you saying? If you think you can work within the system with an all or nothing attitude you'll just simply lose. That leaves the alternative of working outside the system (which means killing people and blowing things up).

I don't believe that if the RKBA movement starts killing people that we'll advance the cause. We'll only turn every fence sitter into an anti by proving that gun owners are only blood thirsty brutes.
 
Zundfolge said:
We got into this mess incrementally so we have to get out of it incrementally
Click to expand...

See, the problem there is to get out of it incrementally, you actually have to move in the more gun rights direction.
 
See, the problem there is to get out of it incrementally, you actually have to move in the more gun rights direction.
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True, but we also have to keep from moving in the less gun rights direction.

An end to the '86 FOPA even with the end of the MG ban part would be a net loss ... we would be moved into a less gun rights direction.


One problem here is that I think most people in these forums think that the closing of the NFA registry to new machine gun registrations is all there is to the FOPA.

Prior to the FOPA:
  • Sales of ammo were heavily regulated and registered (IIRC buying ammo mailorder was verboten).
  • The Federal Government had the legal right to register guns and/or gun owners.
  • No federal protection for those traveling with firearms.
  • FFLs could be searched at any time for no reason and without a warrant (now they can only be searched once a year).

The only bad parts of the FOPA are the closure of the NFA registry to new MGs and ten years later the Lautenberg Amendment.

I guarantee you that if the Dems repeal the FOPA they will NOT repeal the closure of the NFA registry, nor will they repeal the Lautenberg Amendment.
 
Zundfolge said:
True, but we also have to keep from moving in the less gun rights direction.
Click to expand...

If that's all anyone is going to do, you're just delaying the inevitable.


Zundfolge said:
I guarantee you that if the Dems repeal the FOPA they will NOT repeal the closure of the NFA registry, nor will they repeal the Lautenberg Amendment.
Click to expand...

There's a Republican president in office, in case you've forgotten. I hear he's pro-gun.
 
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