Birch Knoll
Member
Actually, getting a carry permit in CT is pretty easy. Although they are technically a may-issue state, they are in practice a shall-issue state.
Forgot my permit. What could happen?
- Thread starter Nashvegas
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NavyLCDR
member
Dnaltrop said:
Wow. That's tough! Lose a concealed carry permit for 4 years just do to a charge? What do you get with a conviction? Holy smokes. And lose your right to open carry in Oregon for 4 years, when no license is required to open carry in Oregon (except in a few cities) just because of a misdemeanor charge?!? Wow.
Who told you this? A CCW instructor? Gun store employee? LEO?
EDIT:
Well. heck. Seems like you were correct regarding the losing the concealed handgun license in Oregon for only being charged. However, you don't lose it for 4 years if you are found not guilty. You lose it for 4 years only if you are convicted. Talk about guilty until proven innocent.
It does not affect open carry, though... except in those cities where a license is required.
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westhope
Member
Minnesota has this provision written into their carry law (624.714)
"(b) A citation issued for violating paragraph (a) must be dismissed if the person demonstrates, in court or in the office of the arresting officer, that the person was authorized to carry the pistol at the time of the alleged violation."
Paragraph "a" being that you must show your carry permit when requested by a peace officer.
Another thanks to the author's of Minnesota's carry bill.
"(b) A citation issued for violating paragraph (a) must be dismissed if the person demonstrates, in court or in the office of the arresting officer, that the person was authorized to carry the pistol at the time of the alleged violation."
Paragraph "a" being that you must show your carry permit when requested by a peace officer.
Another thanks to the author's of Minnesota's carry bill.
Dnaltrop
Member
http://www.mcso.us/public/forms/chl/CHLApplicationDEC11.pdf
The form for convenience. and yes... You need to beat the conviction to get it back and keep your rights intact. Prima Facie evidence sucks.
Weird little state I live in, 'aint it neighbor? I find your "sales tax" equally baffling at times, and lets not speak of when I pull up to the pump in Washington and sit there like a moron because Oregon mandated that Pump attendants have to pump your gas for the Job security here.
It's really dependent on what part of the state you are in, I wouldn't be too Worried about it in Southern Oregon... In Beaverton/Hillsboro police will LITERALLY write you for 2-3 over the speed limit, they'd nail you to a tree in seconds. (They are NOTORIOUS for hard-assery)
The form for convenience. and yes... You need to beat the conviction to get it back and keep your rights intact. Prima Facie evidence sucks.
Weird little state I live in, 'aint it neighbor? I find your "sales tax" equally baffling at times, and lets not speak of when I pull up to the pump in Washington and sit there like a moron because Oregon mandated that Pump attendants have to pump your gas for the Job security here.
It's really dependent on what part of the state you are in, I wouldn't be too Worried about it in Southern Oregon... In Beaverton/Hillsboro police will LITERALLY write you for 2-3 over the speed limit, they'd nail you to a tree in seconds. (They are NOTORIOUS for hard-assery)
bergmen
Member.
In California there is no explicit legal requirement that a CCW holder must have possesion of the license on-person to carry concealed. It is advised by our issuing authority (Mendocino County Sheriff) to have it in possession but there is no law requiring it.
Dan
Dan
Looks like Washington's is a civil infraction. $250 plus court costs for the OP situation.
RCW 9.41.05
1(b) Every licensee shall have his or her concealed pistol license in his or her immediate possession at all times that he or she is required by this section to have a concealed pistol license and shall display the same upon demand to any police officer or to any other person when and if required by law to do so. Any violation of this subsection (1)(b) shall be a class 1 civil infraction under chapter 7.80 RCW and shall be punished accordingly pursuant to chapter 7.80 RCW and the infraction rules for courts of limited jurisdiction
RCW 7.80.120(a)
The maximum penalty and the default amount for a class 1 civil infraction shall be two hundred fifty dollars, not including statutory assessments
Or come up to Alaska where we don't need a license/permit to carry open or concealed!
wyohome
Member
Same here in Wyoming since July of last year. I never did bother to get a permit, now I do not need one. A LE friend once told me in about 85% of all stops there was a weapon of some type inside the car. How he knew this I have no idea, but I know of very few people that ever got a permit.
lemaymiami
Member
The premise for this thread sounds like the setup for one of those movies aimed at teenagers...
Seriously though, wish I had a nickel for every otherwise law abiding individual I ran into as a cop that didn't have their driver's license or other important paperwork with them... As far as I was concerned I played it by ear. On more than one occasion someone's parents brought their son's I.D. to wherever it was needed or we moved our location to the individual's residence so that we could clear up any questions. You pretty quickly get a feel for whether the folks you're dealing with are straight or lying like used car salesman (but I've also been fooled on occasion).
This, of course, was long before concealed carrry permits were as common as they are today. Current officers can probably tell you very quickly whether weapons license info is available if all you have is name and identifying data in one state or another. For what it's worth, I've done that same thing on more than one occasion myself (and once or twice it was while I was still a cop...). Felt pretty foolish when asked for ID to go with a check I'd just written and realized my wallet was still at home....
Seriously though, wish I had a nickel for every otherwise law abiding individual I ran into as a cop that didn't have their driver's license or other important paperwork with them... As far as I was concerned I played it by ear. On more than one occasion someone's parents brought their son's I.D. to wherever it was needed or we moved our location to the individual's residence so that we could clear up any questions. You pretty quickly get a feel for whether the folks you're dealing with are straight or lying like used car salesman (but I've also been fooled on occasion).
This, of course, was long before concealed carrry permits were as common as they are today. Current officers can probably tell you very quickly whether weapons license info is available if all you have is name and identifying data in one state or another. For what it's worth, I've done that same thing on more than one occasion myself (and once or twice it was while I was still a cop...). Felt pretty foolish when asked for ID to go with a check I'd just written and realized my wallet was still at home....
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Owen Sparks
member
- Joined
- May 27, 2007
- Messages
- 4,523
The problem with licenses is that it puts the burden of proof on the accused.
There is no good reason with modern technology that the police need anything more than your name, DOB or SS# to find out everything they need to know within seconds.
All licensed drivers and CCW holders are already in a data base somewhere.
Carrying a physical ID card is really not necessary in the computer age. A simple phone app could be adapted to allow law enforcement to verify your identification by bringing up your picture, criminal record and all pertinent information from the states data base just by typing in your name and numbers without having to see a physical card. This type of ID could not be forged either. The only “advantage” to the card system still has is that it generates revenue for the government when people forget them.
There is no good reason with modern technology that the police need anything more than your name, DOB or SS# to find out everything they need to know within seconds.
All licensed drivers and CCW holders are already in a data base somewhere.
Carrying a physical ID card is really not necessary in the computer age. A simple phone app could be adapted to allow law enforcement to verify your identification by bringing up your picture, criminal record and all pertinent information from the states data base just by typing in your name and numbers without having to see a physical card. This type of ID could not be forged either. The only “advantage” to the card system still has is that it generates revenue for the government when people forget them.
bergmen
Member.
Very, very well said! I agree completely.
The patrolling LEO's have no difficulty at all in seeing if there are outstanding arrest warrants for anyone they pull over on the road, they can be ready with the 'cuffs in a few minutes if necessary. Why can't they do the same for any other form of necessary identification?
Dan
Owen Sparks
member
- Joined
- May 27, 2007
- Messages
- 4,523
How long would it take to type in your name, DOB and SS#? Not very long.
Besides, isn't that what they do anyway when they take your drivers license and go back to the cruiser? This could all be done with a hand held device without ever leaving the suspect unattended. That has to be safer and faster than going back to the car to call it in over a radio. This would be as simple as a google search and state issued ID cards and licenses could be a thing of the past.
Besides, isn't that what they do anyway when they take your drivers license and go back to the cruiser? This could all be done with a hand held device without ever leaving the suspect unattended. That has to be safer and faster than going back to the car to call it in over a radio. This would be as simple as a google search and state issued ID cards and licenses could be a thing of the past.
209
Member
Were I the responding officer if you were here in my state, I'd run a check on your permit. If it was good and you were carrying a decent gun, we'd be good. Just kidding...
Seriously, at least here, I can check on a permit and if it comes back good, I'm happy. But that's just me. And I can't even say it'd be an arrestable offense anyway although a strict interpretation of one of the many laws may be construed that way by an officer. I'm sure someone somewhere in this state could twist it into a Breach-type case since you suggest someone saw your gun and became alarmed enough to call the cops. I can't see me doing it given the situation as you explained it though. I may explain why you should have permit with you and running it may suck up some time for both of us, but I seriously doubt it would go much further than than that. Your mileage may, and probably will definitely, vary depending on the officer who shows up though.
I'd be interested as to the TN law though, since that may well be my retirement location.
Just kidding...Seriously, at least here, I can check on a permit and if it comes back good, I'm happy. But that's just me. And I can't even say it'd be an arrestable offense anyway although a strict interpretation of one of the many laws may be construed that way by an officer. I'm sure someone somewhere in this state could twist it into a Breach-type case since you suggest someone saw your gun and became alarmed enough to call the cops. I can't see me doing it given the situation as you explained it though. I may explain why you should have permit with you and running it may suck up some time for both of us, but I seriously doubt it would go much further than than that. Your mileage may, and probably will definitely, vary depending on the officer who shows up though.
I'd be interested as to the TN law though, since that may well be my retirement location.
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In Washington State it's a Class 1 Civil Infraction, maximum penalty is $250.
RCW 9.41.050(1)(b) If they can properly ID you they can issue you the NOI and release you on your signature.
RCW 9.41.050(1)(b) If they can properly ID you they can issue you the NOI and release you on your signature.
cleardiddion
Member
Glad I live in WY (though the 40-70mph wind sucks) where if I as in the same situation it wouldn't matter since constitutional carry is granted to WY citizens.
PowerG
Member
A lot of people are saying the law allows open carry in MS, but this is based on an interpretation that AFAIK has NOT been tested in court, and people have been confronted over OC and a few arrested-it depends on the jurisdiction you are in. I certainly welcome anyone volunteering as a test case to get a ruling, but wouldn't advise it.
Happysniper1
Member
Just for general consumption, here are the applicable rules in Nevada:
NRS 202.3667 states that a CCW permitee MUST carry his/her permit (or copy -photocopy that is- of his/her permit) AND proper identification (like driver's license, passport ID, etc) at all times when in possession of a concealed firearm, and any violation of this law comes under NRS 202.350 which defiles the illegal possession of a concealed firearm (NRS202.305 subparagraph [d] part {3}) as a CATEGORY C FELONY (and shall be arrested, weapon confiscated and destroyed); if the subject is a CCW permitee without his/her permit, it is a gross misdemeanor (in NV all misdemeanors are arrestible offenses) and subject to a $25 civil penalty for each violation AND (at the discretion of the arresting officer) forfeiture of the firearm (confiscation and destruction).
IN OTHER WORDS, if a cop gets called for a "man with a gun" report, and you either (A) don't have your CCW permit with you, or (B) don't have other ID on you, or (C) Both, then you get fined and can be arrested on misdemeanor possession of a concealed weapon; if you don't have a CCW, it is felonious possession. Since the cop had to respond to a citizen's call-in, your chances of getting off without being arrested are nil, even with a CCW permit, because he has to do the paperwork on the call anyway.
NV is an open-carry state (with Shall-Issue CCW rule), so you can open carry a firearm without a permit (provided you are over 21 and can legally posses a handgun, no warrants, no felony record) AS LONG AS the firearm is "WORN IN PLAIN VIEW FROM THE FRONT" and can be carried loaded.
HOWEVER, there are places where it is considered to be "ethically inappropriate" to open-carry, even though legal. For instance, in front of or around a school, child care facility, library, government building, or other places "of public resort" such as parks. These could lead to a "man-with-a-gun" call to police, and possibly charges of "inciting public panic" (a gross misdemeanor). During public events at convention plazas, city center, and such, where they temporarily suspend the "open container of alcohol" prohibition for pedestrians, it becomes illegal (temporarily) to open carry.
By the way, DUI in possession of a firearm is a misdemeanor (NRS 202.257) except when his/she is INSIDE his/her home. DUI is 0.08% Blood Alcohol Content. A CCW permitee can be asked to submit for a field BAC test (breathalyzer) at any time by any LEO, and is required to submit by law; refusal will result in blood samples being forcibly taken, using any amount of force as may be deemed necessary (up to and including tazing).
So, if you have a permit (but left it at home) and a gun on your hip under your jacket, you cannot tuck your jacket around it to make it open carry because it is no longer easily visible from the front and back. To be "open-carry" there must be no chance of any clothing article to cover the firearm from view.
You can carry as many concealed weapons as you want at any time, as long as you have a CCW permit that authorizes them (categorized simply as Revolver or Semiauto). Some states only allow you to carry one concealed firearm at a time. Just make sure you spread them out on your body, just so you don't walk lopsided.
You can carry a loaded firearm in your car, concealed anywhere in the car (or motorcycle) even without a CCW permit (SEE EXCEPTIONS 1 and 2, below). The permit allows you to carry it on your PERSON. Restriction is: without a CCW permit, it cannot be inside a purse, handbag, or backpack because when you exit the vehicle you can take the bag with you, and on your person it becomes a concealed weapon requiring a CCW permit.
EXCEPTION 1: You cannot have a firearm on Indian land, permit or not. It will be confiscated and you will have to go to Tribal Court for the charge, and your chances of getting the gun back are slim. Fines have been known to be very high. The sole exception is that you are allowed to have guns (loaded or unloaded) in your car or on your person, PROVIDED that you are on a street (and about 15 feet on either side of the street) maintained by the city or state (not the Tribe), such as a highway that bisects Tribal land in which case you are safe, just don't pull onto a "private" road owned by the Tribe, such as the road to the smoke shop. Or the Tribal casino. Or the Tribal Casino parking lot!
EXCEPTION 2: In Clark County (Greater Las Vegas area and the city of Henderson) you MUST have a CCW permit to carry a firearm in your car, loaded or unloaded, regardless of where it is in your car. No other counties in Nevada have this restriction.
You can concealed carry (with permit) in banks, churches, casinos and bars, nightclubs, or brothels (yes, legal in NV), and hospitals. You can disregard signs prohibiting firearms when you are on or entering PRIVATE PROPERTY. Many casinos here post no-firearms-or-deadly-weapons signs. You can ignore them. Management can ask you to leave, and you MUST comply, else you are automatically guilty of simple trespass. If police are called to eject you and you resist, it is resisting a police officer while in possession of a concealed weapon (felony).
NOTE that in Arizona (constitutional carry state), if a bar or restaurant has a sign prohibiting firearms on the premises -even though it is private property- you need to leave your gun in the car. (Used to be, you couldn't carry in any bar or restaurant that sold alcohol)
NOTE that in some other states, you cannot carry in a church.
NOTE that is California, you cannot carry a loaded gun in your car without a CA CCW permit (which is resident-only and is extremely difficult to get; CA is a "may-issue" state and you need to justify it even if you meet the legal requirements to apply for one). Handguns may be transported unloaded and in a locked hard-sided case located as far away as possible from the driver's seat. It's a pain in the butt everytime we drive to CA!
In NV, you cannot carry (without extra paperwork and other legal requirements) even with a CCW in a school, public or private, or in a child care facility (not including hospitals unless it is a dedicated child-care private hospital), any government building (police station, highway patrol office, library, courthouse, airport, etc). You CAN, however, have the gun in your car parked in the street, as long as the street is open to the public. For example, you cannot have a gun on school campus, but you can park on the sidewalk (which belongs to the city, not the school) on the street (which again belongs to the city, not the school) and leave your gun in the car. I have parked in the parking structure at the airport and left my gun in the car. I have never brought the gun into the building (a definite no-no!).
You can carry concealed with CCW in State and National Parks, but you cannot enter any building in the park....the restrooms, the ranger station, the convenience store, all of those are owned by the government and are considered "public buildings". So hide your gun in the bushes if you need to use the restroom, and if you have an "oops!", don't go into the ranger's office and ask them for a magnet to get your gun outta the toilet.
IF AND ONLY IF you have a CCW and faced a legitimate "deadly force" situation where you had to fire, and your shooting resulted in "the unintended death of another" as when the bullet goes thru the wall, flies across the street, and beans your neighbor in the head (which is "Excusable Homicide by Misadventure" NRS 200.180), and the circumstances validate the inadvertent death of another during a legitimate use deadly force, under NRS 200.190 ("Justifiable or Excusable Homicide NOT Punishable") then "the person indicted shall, upon his trial, be FULLY ACQUITTED AND DISCHARGED" and that "An action to recover damages shall not prosper"....meaning IF you had a CCW, even if you were at home drunk as a skunk, and someone broke into (or was attempting to break into) your home, and you shot the attacker/intruder/assailant and missed and accidentally killed an innocent bystander, you will NOT be charged with homicide or manslaughter, and you CANNOT be sued in civil court.
There are a host of "nitty-gritty" laws, conditions, and regulations, but those are the major ones.
Hope it helps someone!
NRS 202.3667 states that a CCW permitee MUST carry his/her permit (or copy -photocopy that is- of his/her permit) AND proper identification (like driver's license, passport ID, etc) at all times when in possession of a concealed firearm, and any violation of this law comes under NRS 202.350 which defiles the illegal possession of a concealed firearm (NRS202.305 subparagraph [d] part {3}) as a CATEGORY C FELONY (and shall be arrested, weapon confiscated and destroyed); if the subject is a CCW permitee without his/her permit, it is a gross misdemeanor (in NV all misdemeanors are arrestible offenses) and subject to a $25 civil penalty for each violation AND (at the discretion of the arresting officer) forfeiture of the firearm (confiscation and destruction).
IN OTHER WORDS, if a cop gets called for a "man with a gun" report, and you either (A) don't have your CCW permit with you, or (B) don't have other ID on you, or (C) Both, then you get fined and can be arrested on misdemeanor possession of a concealed weapon; if you don't have a CCW, it is felonious possession. Since the cop had to respond to a citizen's call-in, your chances of getting off without being arrested are nil, even with a CCW permit, because he has to do the paperwork on the call anyway.
NV is an open-carry state (with Shall-Issue CCW rule), so you can open carry a firearm without a permit (provided you are over 21 and can legally posses a handgun, no warrants, no felony record) AS LONG AS the firearm is "WORN IN PLAIN VIEW FROM THE FRONT" and can be carried loaded.
HOWEVER, there are places where it is considered to be "ethically inappropriate" to open-carry, even though legal. For instance, in front of or around a school, child care facility, library, government building, or other places "of public resort" such as parks. These could lead to a "man-with-a-gun" call to police, and possibly charges of "inciting public panic" (a gross misdemeanor). During public events at convention plazas, city center, and such, where they temporarily suspend the "open container of alcohol" prohibition for pedestrians, it becomes illegal (temporarily) to open carry.
By the way, DUI in possession of a firearm is a misdemeanor (NRS 202.257) except when his/she is INSIDE his/her home. DUI is 0.08% Blood Alcohol Content. A CCW permitee can be asked to submit for a field BAC test (breathalyzer) at any time by any LEO, and is required to submit by law; refusal will result in blood samples being forcibly taken, using any amount of force as may be deemed necessary (up to and including tazing).
So, if you have a permit (but left it at home) and a gun on your hip under your jacket, you cannot tuck your jacket around it to make it open carry because it is no longer easily visible from the front and back. To be "open-carry" there must be no chance of any clothing article to cover the firearm from view.
You can carry as many concealed weapons as you want at any time, as long as you have a CCW permit that authorizes them (categorized simply as Revolver or Semiauto). Some states only allow you to carry one concealed firearm at a time. Just make sure you spread them out on your body, just so you don't walk lopsided.
You can carry a loaded firearm in your car, concealed anywhere in the car (or motorcycle) even without a CCW permit (SEE EXCEPTIONS 1 and 2, below). The permit allows you to carry it on your PERSON. Restriction is: without a CCW permit, it cannot be inside a purse, handbag, or backpack because when you exit the vehicle you can take the bag with you, and on your person it becomes a concealed weapon requiring a CCW permit.
EXCEPTION 1: You cannot have a firearm on Indian land, permit or not. It will be confiscated and you will have to go to Tribal Court for the charge, and your chances of getting the gun back are slim. Fines have been known to be very high. The sole exception is that you are allowed to have guns (loaded or unloaded) in your car or on your person, PROVIDED that you are on a street (and about 15 feet on either side of the street) maintained by the city or state (not the Tribe), such as a highway that bisects Tribal land in which case you are safe, just don't pull onto a "private" road owned by the Tribe, such as the road to the smoke shop. Or the Tribal casino. Or the Tribal Casino parking lot!
EXCEPTION 2: In Clark County (Greater Las Vegas area and the city of Henderson) you MUST have a CCW permit to carry a firearm in your car, loaded or unloaded, regardless of where it is in your car. No other counties in Nevada have this restriction.
You can concealed carry (with permit) in banks, churches, casinos and bars, nightclubs, or brothels (yes, legal in NV), and hospitals. You can disregard signs prohibiting firearms when you are on or entering PRIVATE PROPERTY. Many casinos here post no-firearms-or-deadly-weapons signs. You can ignore them. Management can ask you to leave, and you MUST comply, else you are automatically guilty of simple trespass. If police are called to eject you and you resist, it is resisting a police officer while in possession of a concealed weapon (felony).
NOTE that in Arizona (constitutional carry state), if a bar or restaurant has a sign prohibiting firearms on the premises -even though it is private property- you need to leave your gun in the car. (Used to be, you couldn't carry in any bar or restaurant that sold alcohol)
NOTE that in some other states, you cannot carry in a church.
NOTE that is California, you cannot carry a loaded gun in your car without a CA CCW permit (which is resident-only and is extremely difficult to get; CA is a "may-issue" state and you need to justify it even if you meet the legal requirements to apply for one). Handguns may be transported unloaded and in a locked hard-sided case located as far away as possible from the driver's seat. It's a pain in the butt everytime we drive to CA!
In NV, you cannot carry (without extra paperwork and other legal requirements) even with a CCW in a school, public or private, or in a child care facility (not including hospitals unless it is a dedicated child-care private hospital), any government building (police station, highway patrol office, library, courthouse, airport, etc). You CAN, however, have the gun in your car parked in the street, as long as the street is open to the public. For example, you cannot have a gun on school campus, but you can park on the sidewalk (which belongs to the city, not the school) on the street (which again belongs to the city, not the school) and leave your gun in the car. I have parked in the parking structure at the airport and left my gun in the car. I have never brought the gun into the building (a definite no-no!).
You can carry concealed with CCW in State and National Parks, but you cannot enter any building in the park....the restrooms, the ranger station, the convenience store, all of those are owned by the government and are considered "public buildings". So hide your gun in the bushes if you need to use the restroom, and if you have an "oops!", don't go into the ranger's office and ask them for a magnet to get your gun outta the toilet.
IF AND ONLY IF you have a CCW and faced a legitimate "deadly force" situation where you had to fire, and your shooting resulted in "the unintended death of another" as when the bullet goes thru the wall, flies across the street, and beans your neighbor in the head (which is "Excusable Homicide by Misadventure" NRS 200.180), and the circumstances validate the inadvertent death of another during a legitimate use deadly force, under NRS 200.190 ("Justifiable or Excusable Homicide NOT Punishable") then "the person indicted shall, upon his trial, be FULLY ACQUITTED AND DISCHARGED" and that "An action to recover damages shall not prosper"....meaning IF you had a CCW, even if you were at home drunk as a skunk, and someone broke into (or was attempting to break into) your home, and you shot the attacker/intruder/assailant and missed and accidentally killed an innocent bystander, you will NOT be charged with homicide or manslaughter, and you CANNOT be sued in civil court.
There are a host of "nitty-gritty" laws, conditions, and regulations, but those are the major ones.
Hope it helps someone!
bikemutt
Member
This group fights the good fight in Hawaii, they have a long way to go.
http://www.hawaiidefensefoundation.org
MedWheeler
Member
In Florida, carrying without one's license results in an "administrative penalty" not to exceed twenty dollars. No crime, and no risk to your license. Same applies if you are carrying your license, but not carrying your official state DL or ID; both must be carried if a firearm is being carried.
Now, I'm not sure what LE can do with you while they verify that you do indeed have a license if they catch you carrying without it, or what the verification process takes.
Now, I'm not sure what LE can do with you while they verify that you do indeed have a license if they catch you carrying without it, or what the verification process takes.
bergmen
Member.
Generally true but there are minor errors in your statement:
1) "...cannot carry a loaded gun in your car..." should state "loaded handgun". Loaded long guns in motor vehicles are not legal in California.
2) CCW availability is County specific. Of the 58 Counties in California, 41 are basically "shall issue". Ours (Mendocino) is and all we had to state as justification is "personal protection".
3) A concealed handgun can legally be transported within a motor vehicle without a permit only by carrying it: a) unloaded; and b) locked in the vehicle's trunk or in a separate locked container other than the utility or glove compartment. If the vehicle does not have a trunk, it must be carried in a locked container separate from the utility or glove compartment.
Placing a small padlock on a handgun rug, plastic hard case or range bag is considered to be in compliance (especially a "hard case"). There is no "distance" from the driver's seat specified in California P.C. 12025 or 12026. There are more specific definitions of "locked container" in P.C. 12026.1.
Dan
Happysniper1
Member
@BERGMEN, thanks for the clarification!
Missed the first one, about "loaded gun". In Nevada, it is illegal to carry a loaded rifle in a vehicle (this is a gaming [i.e., hunting, anti-poaching] based regulation). Sorry, I was not specific about it being a "loaded handgun".
We have many CA residents come over for our CCW class to get NV, FL and UT permits (which our class is qualified to sign off for), and the predominant complaint is -strangely enough- not so much about the restrictive gun laws, but how hard it is to get a CCW permit. Although we did have a couple of guys who said they were close to the Sheriff (from San Jose area) and that they never had problems getting their CA CCW. Don't know if that is true, but they had permits true enough.
To be in compliance with CA transport of handguns laws, we recommend to our students that they look at getting an elcheapo hard plastic pistol case with only a center mounted padlock....in an emergency you can twist the plastic open enough to reach in and grab the pistol without ever needing to undo the padlock. Guardhouse lawyerspeak, I know, but when you think about it, it meets the legel requirement as well as the practical one, too!
Uh, no offence, but using a handgun rug or rangebag (canvas or nylon?) is in compliance, even though it is not hard-sided? Really? I would imagine not. Do you know of any instances where LEO has agreed this is in complaince? We tell our students to follow the letter of the law with regards to "hard-sided".
Thanks!
Missed the first one, about "loaded gun". In Nevada, it is illegal to carry a loaded rifle in a vehicle (this is a gaming [i.e., hunting, anti-poaching] based regulation). Sorry, I was not specific about it being a "loaded handgun".
We have many CA residents come over for our CCW class to get NV, FL and UT permits (which our class is qualified to sign off for), and the predominant complaint is -strangely enough- not so much about the restrictive gun laws, but how hard it is to get a CCW permit. Although we did have a couple of guys who said they were close to the Sheriff (from San Jose area) and that they never had problems getting their CA CCW. Don't know if that is true, but they had permits true enough.
To be in compliance with CA transport of handguns laws, we recommend to our students that they look at getting an elcheapo hard plastic pistol case with only a center mounted padlock....in an emergency you can twist the plastic open enough to reach in and grab the pistol without ever needing to undo the padlock. Guardhouse lawyerspeak, I know, but when you think about it, it meets the legel requirement as well as the practical one, too!
Uh, no offence, but using a handgun rug or rangebag (canvas or nylon?) is in compliance, even though it is not hard-sided? Really? I would imagine not. Do you know of any instances where LEO has agreed this is in complaince? We tell our students to follow the letter of the law with regards to "hard-sided".
Thanks!
Happysniper1
Member
By the way, I have a cousin who lives in LA County, a CPA specializing in corporate finance, and she has been trying for about 5 years now on-and-off and has never been able to get a CCW. I think she carries now, illegally, but I really don't want to know about it if so.
Just thought I'd toss that in.
Just thought I'd toss that in.
bergmen
Member.
As with many of California's gun laws it can be difficult to interpret exactly how to be in legally safe compliance. The "hard case" with a lock would be the smartest method to advise in my opinion since it is pretty obviously in compliance.
P.C. 12026.1 defines a locked container as "a secure container which is fully enclosed and locked by a padlock, key lock, combination lock, or similar locking device." Nothing about being a "hard case" in the definition but it is generally accepted by those "in the know" that a hard case is least likely to come under any legal scrutiny. Padlocked rugs are considered to be in technical compliance as well and that is how I run. If I need to transport a handgun (that is not listed on my license) I lock it in a rug or range bag.
A very good resource for attempting to understand California's gun laws is a small booklet that the California Rifle and Pistol Association publishes each year titled "Summary of California Gun Laws and Basic Safety Regulations". They are available from CRPA and these are widely used by gun clubs within California as well as some LEO offices to interpret and navigate through the gun law wilderness that we have here.
Dan
bergmen
Member.
Another thing. There are 57 CCW licenses issued in Santa Clara County (where San Jose is). If you know someone from that county who has one, they are amongst the chosen few for sure.
Dan
Dan
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Happysniper1
Member
Actually, there are three of them. And yes, I guess they are among the -ehem- lucky few.
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