Foster slugs vs. a hog. Yea or nay?

[Sergeant Sabre]

Since we have a growing feral hog population in Michigan, and I'm a buying mood, the answer to this question will guide my purchases in the near future. (That is, buying a rifled 12ga barrel or not)

I always hear about how tough feral hogs are. I've seen anatomical drawings of them and I was surprised to see how far forward their vitals are. Right behind their front leg bone, it looks like.

I've also heard time and time again about how soft foster slugs are. Is a 1oz. foster a good choice for a feral hog? What about a big ranch hog (200+ lbs)?

If not a foster, then a Brenneke maybe? Are they any better?

 

[ArmedBear]

Hell, after I saw a lead 520-grain .45-70 round-nose lead bullet go gstraight throuh a buffalo (black powder cartridge at 75 yards), then keep on going, I have a lot of respect for a heavy slug not going too fast. Buffalo is a lot bigger than a pig. Vitals in a similar spot, but the buffalo stands a bit taller over the grass.

 

[rantingredneck]

Brenneke's are your friend.

I've never shot a hog personally, but the Brenneke's are harder lead and are, in my experience at least, more accurate than other slugs from a smoothbore. Their weight forward design and attached wad allows this.

 

[rantingredneck]

That all being said, a foster should still kill a hog if you put it where it belongs . They're tough, but not armor plated.

 

[ArmedBear]

An ounce of lead going over 1000 fps isn't going to stop moving very easily, that was the point about the buffalo.

 

[RyanM]

Unfortunately, articles are no longer online on http://www.african-hunter.com/

There used to be one about shotguns vs. leopards (about 80 to 200 pounds) and lions (330 to 530 pounds). The gist of it was a Foster slug may work if you can shoot the cat broadside, but when shooting from the front (like if it's charging at you), the slugs would stick in the chest muscle without penetrating through to the lungs. Brenneke slugs generally worked fine, though.

And keep in mind, cats are built pretty lightly. A 500 pound lion is probably going to be easier to kill than a 500 pound bear, and a 200 pound leopard will definitely be frailer than a 200 pound hog.

Also, for those making comparisons to the .45-70, keep in mind sectional density. A 1 ounce 12 gauge slug has a sectional density of only 0.118. That's the equivalent of a 104 grain 9mm bullet. A 520 grain .45-70, on the other hand, has a sectional density of 0.354. That's more on par with a 235 grain .30 caliber bullet. Night and day difference.

Personally, I would reserve Foster slugs for very thin-skinned animals only, like humans. Brennekes are okay on heavier stuff, but I'd still prefer a rifle caliber on anything more substantial than a northern whitetail.

Something like a hog, yeah, I'd leave the 12 gauge at home. Actually, maybe it's just me, but I'd have the most confidence in something like a bonded 200 gr JSP from a .30-06 or .303 British.

 

[ArmedBear]

Very good point re sectional density. It's easy for me to forget just how big a 12 bore is.

And all of that said, I figure slug guns are good for one thing and one thing only: hunting when and where the laws don't allow a rifle.

 

[Sergeant Sabre]

And all of that said, I figure slug guns are good for one thing and one thing only: hunting when and where the laws don't allow a rifle

That's exactly where I am.

Rifles are illegal for deer where I am, anyway. Hogs are kind of a budding thing around here, though. In a few years, considering the interest there is around here in hunting them, I wouldn't be surprised if hogs were a slug-only proposition as well.

What about sabot slugs? Any of them that you would feel confident with on a hog? I'm interested in the Brenneke K.O. sabot in particular. 1oz, .63 caliber, same design as the standard K.O. (and also works from a smooth bore, supposedly)

As an aside: The problem I have with the standard Brenneke K.O. slugs is that they shoot terribly in my 18.5" Mossberg. I'm lucky to keep them on an 8.5"x11" piece of printer paper at 50yds.

 

[RyanM]

I'd probably go for something like this.

http://www.remington.com/products/ammunition/shotshell/slugs/copper_solid_sabot.asp

1 ounce, solid copper. Don't know the caliber, probably also .63. That gives you a sectional density of 0.157, which isn't great, but it's better than a Foster slug. 0.157 is equivalent to a 225 gr .45 bullet.

 

[Deer Hunter]

So are we saying that your standard 1 ounce lead rifled slug will not work against hog?

I was once aquainted with a few lovely strips of bacon that would disagree with you on that.

It's all in where you place your shot. That holds true with anything you'll ever shoot.

 

[RyanM]

"Would not" work, no. Might not work, yes. I'm sure plenty of people have taken hogs with 12 gauge Foster slugs. Plenty of people have taken deer with .32-20 carbines, but that doesn't mean it's the best caliber for the job.

Given that, according to very experienced professional hunters and professional guides in Africa, 12 gauge slugs very commonly fail to penetrate the chest muscles of big cats, I would not trust them for most heavy game.

Would they still work? Sure, maybe. But I, personaly, wouldn't trust them on anything heavier than a small deer (or big deer, for Brennekes).

 

[mio]

im also hoping to do a little michigan hog hunting and had considered using my 12ga. i shoot rottweil slugs from mine. i havent shot a hog before but dont see why a slug wouldnt work within 100yrds

 

[Sergeant Sabre]

I probably should have been more specific about my original question:

Do you think that any of the sabot slugs available provide a significant penetration advantage over the time-honored foster-type slug, within the context of a feral hog or very large "ranch hog"?

 

[Jeff F]

Hogs are no problem for a 12 guage slug. I can say from experience that a good hit with a slug on big hogs = DRT. I would use a 12 guage with Brenneke's for bear defense even for big brown bears.

 

[plumberroy]

http://www.dixieslugs.com/
I buy the slugs and load them myself in 20 gauge James Gates the owner is a top notch man to deal with. my loads are 500 gr slug .625 diameter .660 long 1200 fps and shoot two inch groups w/ironsights @50 yards.. these slugs are hard cast and heat treated pigs are getting close to where I live and I am looking for a place to hammer a hog with my 20 bore rifle
roy

 

[Fred Fuller]

Sarge,

I'd be leery of shooting soft lead Foster slugs at anything like a hog, they sometimes have a bad tendency to flatten out and stop penetrating. I'd say stick to Brennekes in a smoothbore (that will shoot them well) and a hardcast solid lead sabot slug in a rifled barrel- I'd sure give Dixie slugs a try if I was gonna mix it up with big hogs up close.

lpl/nc

 

[Dave McCracken]

When Otto Brenekke designed his slug, the idea was to give hog capability to Euro-hunters with shotguns, mostly 16 gauge.It did and does.

My hog hunting has been limited to Javelina, something different entirely. Were I foraging for Trefe at close range, it'd be with an 870 loaded with Rottweil Brenekkes.

 

[chas08]

Here in the part of Texas I live in "Wild Hogs" have been upgraded from nusiance to plague. If left unchecked they will absolutely devastate an area. Their ability to shift from one food source to another crowds out or starves out other species. Humans are their only substantial predator. I have killed more than 200 in my lifetime. Foster slugs wouldn't be my first choice. I have seen Boars whose armor plate over his shoulders & ribs was 2 1/4 inches thick. I have found rifle bullets imbedded in armor thinner than that. My first choice is a good flat shooting, highly accurate rifle with a head shot. If I have to trail a wounded hog I like a .44 mag 240 grain flat point. Age and gender plays a large roll in just how tough a hog is to bring down. With sows and young boars the foster slug and even 00 buck is adequate at close range but hogs can be quite viscious if not dropped in their tracks and I like to feel "Overgunned" when persuing them. I just don't get that feeling with a shotgun.

 

[Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow]

And all of that said, I figure slug guns are good for one thing and one thing only: hunting when and where the laws don't allow a rifle

I beg to differ. First, if said "slug gun" is a RIFLED slug gun, then the many saboted slugs you can buy have much higher sectional densities and would penetrate very well and be an excellent choice for hogs. Second, whether rifled or not, something like a Remington Buckhammer 602 grainer, though soft, will still hit hard and have a SD higher than a lighter foster style slug. And, harder lead alloys are available in certain Brenneke, Lightfield, Dixie, and other foster style slugs - and they are heavier/longer than "standard" fosters. Some of these longer ones are stabilized by a wadding that stays attached to the slug, using the badminton birdie principle to stabilize, giving them good accuracy. I believe the Rem buckhammers do this. I think the 12 ga is an outstanding choice for deer in heavy brush, and a good choice for hogs with the right load matched to the right size game animal -smaller hogs with foster slugs, and hard alloy slugs or saboted slugs for larger hogs.

 

[Limey46]

In my experience with the bigger kind of hog, Brennekes are very definitely the way to go in a smoothbore shotgun. I've seen Foster-type slugs fail to do the job too many times. I once watched my son hit a 250-pounder with four of them to no apparent effect whatsoever until he put the fifth in its brain.

Personally, I'm happiest around big, tough old hogs with a .45-70 lever gun and hard-cast flatpoints. It's good to have something that WILL get through the gristle.

 

[redneck]

There are several choices of sabots now with "premium" bullets in them. Remington offers the "accutip bonded sabot slug", "corelokt ultra bonded sabot" which throws a 385 grain hp at 1900fps, and the "copper solid". I haven't tried any but the copper solid (and it will put a big hole in a deer), but they all look like good candidates.

Hornady has the SST slug, which throws a 300 grain ballistic tip. These are also accurate in my 500 slugster, but I haven't used them on game yet.

And winchester has the supreme partition, supreme platinum tip, and the XP3 sabot load.

You can buy just about any of these loads in walmart, dick's, or gander mountain. I haven't tried them all, but have been working my way through putting a few through my mossberg 500 slugster from time to time.
I've found that it definitely does best with sabots (as expected), but also offers acceptable accuracy with rifled slugs out to 50 yards. Being in a shotgun only state I can't see any reason not to have the rifled barrel. You get so much more flexibility on ammo and can choose a load to match your needs at the time.