G26-PM9-P3AT (pls check the perspect 1st)

[jlh26oo]

Koohl, thanks for the tip on the Tetra grease Jim. I'll try that.

I mentioned the budget models? (here?); well if I did it was only in passing lol. I agree that while the savings are considerable, mim vs forged slide stop, conventional vs polygonal rifling, plastic pinned in sights etc just too much of a downgrade.

Now let's just hope mine WORKS!

 

[brett30030]

I carry the P3-at,I find it interesting that opinions against it are mostly based on those who do not own one. Frankly, i don't care what you carry, but if you look at the opinions posted and the poll results, i think that you will see a pattern. Good Luck with your search.

 

[gbran]

Can't speak for the P3AT, but I do own both the PM9 and the G26. I like the capacity of the G26 and actually like shooting it more, but I gotta say that the PM9 is perfect for pocket carry.

You also might consider Kel-Tec P11(?), their small 9mm. It's cheap, small, lite, but I also don't know much about them either.

 

[jlh26oo]

Frankly, i don't care what you carry

 

[pocketgun]

I think he just meant he didn't have a personal stake...

 

[jlh26oo]

 

[Black Snowman]

For pocket carry I went with the P3AT in the Nemisis for it's combination of power and portability. I wouldn't want anything weaker for self defense and I wouldn't want anything much larger or heavier for pocket carry. Tried it with my RAMI and it works in a jacket pocket but in pants it's just too heavy and bulky loaded up. Also it can be tricky and slow to draw from a pants pocket. I've never had a problem getting the P3AT into action in practice.

I found what I think is the ideal defensive load for it. Winchester white box. Fairly heavy and fast moving with a large meplat. So it will go deeper than a hollow point and generate a larger wound than a round nose. I was affraid that with the hollowpoints in the 380 Auto I wouldn't get consistant deep penetration but going to FMJ most are round nose which are horrible for generating an effective wound channel. Solution? Big flat nosed bullet (relatively speaking).

Bonus, the WWB is cheap to practice with and 100% reliable in my gun so far.

 

[pocketgun]

If you are going to carry FMJ/non-expanding ammo, I suggest using something else. I have been tracking ammo chronographed from P-3ATs, and the WWB is not only one of the very slowest, but perhaps the most inconsistent. Average velocities measured by four different testers with different lots of ammo were 757, 809, 825, 847 fps. Remington/UMC LeadLess is a FNEB round that came out at 894 fps. Both use 95gr bullets.

Many First Generation P-3ATs have trouble extracting WWB as well. Second Gen pistols seem to work better with it.

edited to add: [/HIJACK]

 

[airrascal]

PM9 P3AT

G26 - Like it but a bit too bulky for pocket carry for me.
PM9 - Mine has been 99.99% overall, 100% after the 200 round break in period. It was my 1st Kahr and I bought it new. My experience with it had me seek out other Kahrs: a K9, T9 and MK9. All were bought used and have been 100%.
P3AT - I actually went and looked at P3AT because there were rare occasions that I thought the PM9 was a bit too bulky. I ended up with an NAA Guardian 380 that was in the shop on consignment. It was a little balky for me at first but has since made it through an uneventful 200 rounds. A few more and I'll put it to work. I liked the fact that it was a little heavier than the P3AT.

My money went to the PM9 but I would accept and keep any of the three if offered.

 

[Newton]

Everyone should have a P-3AT.

If you can't hurt someone with 7 rounds of .380 then a .454 Casull won't be enough gun.

Sure, some of the guns exhibit reliability issues, but these can almost always be rectified, and if they can't K-T will give you a new gun (re-stamped with your original S/N).

This is just my personal 2c of course, but I think that the P-3AT is one of the biggest advances in firearms technology in the last 50 years. To produce a 7 shot .380 that small, and that light and retail it for around $260 is a genuine achievement in a field where there have been precious few others.

The only question that I hover around is the thorny one of JHP or FMJ. I finally decided on carrying some of the Spanish surplus Santa Barbara truncated cone open tip FMJ. It may be old but it is VERY hot, and I personally believe that penetration is far more important than expansion in sub caliber guns.

 

[Lonestar]

I have a KT P3at. It is small, light and very easy to carry. I'm a big Glock fan and I own a G26, and frankly I don't know what some of you people are smoking here but the 26 is NOT pocket carry material, unless you have some big pockets.

I bought the P3at for pocket carry during the summer months. When I first looked at it, I thought it was a cheap POS, but I reluncantly bought it seeing some good review on the forums, and with the $250 price tag, if it stinks its not a big loss. I have maybe 500 rounds thru the gun now and had absolutely no problems.

I held a PM9 in my hand a few times. I would put it down as a second choice. Almost as small as the Kel Tec, definately pocketable. Problem is it is 2x more money, and will have alot more recoil then the .380.

 

[10-Ring]

For your application, I'd recommend the Kahr

 

[TimboKhan]

Hmm, I was gonna vote Kel-Tec all the way until I saw the line "I want to be able to put a few hundred rounds through it"... Not that you couldn't, but the kel-tec really isn't meant to be a range gun. Neither is the Kahr, which I ended up voting for, but I think it is going to be a little sturdier than the Kel-Tec over its life. Additionally, the Kahr is much thinner than the Glock. I don't have a problem with Glocks per se, but if you want to carry in your pocket, the Glock is probably the worst choice of the three. If it were me, I would take the Kel-Tec without even thinking twice about it, but given your demands, I think the Kahr is the best all around choice.

 

[GlockNation]

Rohrbaugh R9S

Skip all the rest and go straight to the best:

http://www.rohrbaughfirearms.com/product/prod_set.html

Always there.

 

[chaim]

You said on the 12th that you'd be buying "tomorrow", did you buy on the 13th? You don't outright say if or what you bought, but you do "hint" that you got the PM9:

...Now let's just hope mine WORKS!

If you did, I think you'll like it. I'm a huge fan of Kahrs, and not having one is the biggest glaring hole in my collection. My best friend had an MK9 for a while and it was a sweet gun that never gave any trouble. With its "Elite" trigger it was better than most DA triggers, including some very nice DA revolvers, that I've tried. Because of the weight he traded it on a Kahr PM9. That has also been 100% reliable. It is lighter, and at the range recoil is noticably greater, but it isn't bad- I'd say it is comparable with a steel framed S&W J-frame or Taurus 85 with regular non +P .38spl.

As for reliability issues, I'm not too nervous about that for when I buy one. Not scientific or anything, but just internet observation suggests to me that most of the problems with the Kahrs I've read have been the polymer models in .40S&W (that did keep me from buying a P40 Covert I saw at a great price a few months back- I definately would have put down the cash then and there if it was a P9 Covert).

Just curious- why pocket only? You can be pretty deeply concealed doing IWB tucked. It seems you really want that Glock, why not find a way to make the Glock work for you? Of course, with its width, I don't think a Glock would work very well tucked either (I think it would look like you had a huge tumor coming out of your side if you tried it).

Anyway, when I go with a pocket carry auto (when I'm in PA and carrying, can't do it here in MD, I use a S&W 442 for pocket use) I plan to get that Kahr. If they were legal in MD I'd probably get the Kel-tec P3AT and/or P32 along with the Kahr for when the Kahr is still too much (my friend who has the PM9 thinks it would often be just a tad too big for pocket carry at times). Being that those two Kel-tecs are illegal for sale in MD, I may get an NAA Guardian in either .380 or .32 plus the Kahr myself. Being that I've shot and very much like the Kahr, and I plan to get a Kahr myself for the same use you describe, I would suggest the Kahr.

 

[jlh26oo]

WOW chaim are you ever detail oriented! I actually won my pm9 on thusrday night (the 14th lol). I should have tied up the loose ends here before moving on to the obligatory "here's what I bought" follow-up thread. It should be here next week.

Mine won't be as nice as an mk9. Don't think it has the "elite" trigger. Snaps nicer than does my beloved (for some reason.. familiarity?) G34's trigger, but it'll take some getting used to. So after he traded it in, how did you guys like the pm9 trigger compared to that of the elite btw? I'm not worried about recoil so much, as the only kahr I've ever shot was a PM40, and I shot well with it; though we'll see if I feel the same way after the 200 round break-in period vs the 2 mags I shot.

Yeah, glock's where my heart was at. Maybe I should have worked around the pistol, instead of working pistol choice around my circumstances; so watch for a possible "wts/t pm9 for g26" thread in the near future! (j/k I've made my decision)

I don't know about pocket carry. I actually haven't tried that or IWB yet (I am still a couple of months from TExas CHL eligibility); but despite the nice IWB tuckable set-ups available, it seems like I could draw faster right there from my pocket as opposed to digging how deep it would have to be stashed back there, tucked and conceslrd. Plus, and this is weird- my manager (who rarely sees me, < once every couple of months for two minutes- as I always work alone) has actually come up behind me and put her hands on my waist, and felt across my entire beltline (twice)! Playing it off like "why isn;t your shirt tucked in" when she did it. Both times it was when I happened to show up to work untucked, true, but all this was after I was robbed one morning (I work nights @ a hotel). I never sadi much about it (the robbing), but I think that they think I am on some kind of enigo-montoya/prepare-to-die vendetta. I honestly think she was feeling for a gun. I would not have drawn a gun even if I had been carrying; even if a shotgun wasn't pointed at my chest (12ga> any handgun p3at or g20 even), because there were people behind him eating breakfast. If I had been using my (as you guys preach) "best weapon", I would have been as prepared for that at 6:30am as I am at 2:00am (door locked, tapes running, NOTICING a crackhead walking in instead of online shopping for a japanese frogman in the back office). That's on ME. But when he went to leave (with all of his $86 in loot), the door wouldn't open for him, and he pointed it at me again and said you better unlock this door- it was unlocked, he was just too short to activate the sensor from where he was standing (actually too close to the door). I just wish I had one then, still wouldn't have pulled it at that point obviously, despite the background being clear where he was. But if it came down to it, I'd rather have a pistol than nothing in the off chance he didn't hit me square with the first shot (still would have to be birdshot to really have a chance), I might have a fighting chance. Hand to hand, I would've killed the little POS. I would have grabbed his little cauliflower ears and repeatedly bashed his crackhead against the brick planter he was near... but, uh, I've totally let that incident go emotionally now

Whew! What-a-tangent. Anyways, yeah pocket carry. I guess I envision myself with my hand in pocket ready to draw in certain circumstances, as opposed to having to untuck my shirt then drawing, a whole procedure to be initiated only when intedended to be completed/ Not precautionary, where I couldhave my hand on the grip in my pocket (if I was untucked, i could see why iwb easily).

BTW whyTF are kel-tecs illegal in MD lol?

BTW@GLOCKnation did your vote live up to your name? I'm guessing you abstained, as the Rohrbaugh was not a poll option (admittedly even the Kahr was pushing my budget- it was hard to justify, compared to how much value I see in my 34* which barely cost more than the Kahr). I am see a pattern of limiting returns on size* with pocket guns, in that, at some point, the smaller you go, the more you have to compromise (whether it be quality, reliability, price, firepower etc). I drew my such point of limiting returns at the Kahr. For some it's the p3at; yet others nothing smaller than a full size service model. For others yet, if there was something slightly smaller somehow that cost $1,500, and was even nicer, they'd go that route. I respect all the above decisions, as they are all so personal. Further, I have little doubt that the R-9/s' are indeed supremely engineered machines. How has yours been?


*YMMMFV