Going to a shooting range... on a bike

[Phaethon]

I ask many similarly silly questions on this forum, but I'm interested in not using my parent's gas and not having to call on someone to drive me.

My shooting range is about 8 miles from me, which I can cover in around half an hour on my bike. Assuming that I strap my rifle (in its soft case) to my back or onto my bike's frame and put the ammunition I intend to shoot in my rear rack, this would fit under Florida's legal exceptions for open carry, right?

 

[NavyLCDR]

No, it would not because the rifle would NOT be open carried, it would be in a case.

 

[Phaethon]

What would that be, then? "Concealed" carry? Is there such a classification for long-arms under Florida, or Federal, law?

I'm assuming that if that's the case then I'll have to dash that plan and find a shooting buddy, as I'm not about to start riding around with my rifle in plain sight. Can anyone help clarify?

 

[WardenWolf]

Many states have in their laws that a cased firearm is not considered concealed.

 

[Davey Wavey]

If the gun isn't loaded it sounds more like you'd be transporting rather than carrying.

This is based on the laws here in IL. I can walk around in public with an unloaded gun fully enclosed in a case, container, backpack, shoebox, fanny pack, european carry all .

 

[ultradoc]

I have an old guitar case that I put a shotgun in once and transported it on my bike [Harley]. I just strapped it on to the back seat and cruised on down the freeway.

 

[quatin]

I would say technically yes, but practically no. The exception is to prevent hysterical soccer moms calling in people at the parking lot of a gun range. There's no way to prove you're going to the range or the grocery store on a 8 mile bike ride. An uninformed LEO can get you into some trouble.

*If you're going to do this anyways, keep a copy of the statue in your rifle case. Also, make sure to have a membership card to the gun range to prove you're a "member of a skeet, trap....club"

 

[NavyLCDR]

I think you would be legal, until you came within 1000' of a school (if you don't have a Florida CCW license):

Florida Statutes:

790.001 Definitions.—As used in this chapter, except where the context otherwise requires:
(17) “Securely encased” means in a glove compartment, whether or not locked; snapped in a holster; in a gun case, whether or not locked; in a zippered gun case; or in a closed box or container which requires a lid or cover to be opened for access.


(3) LAWFUL USES.—The provisions of ss. 790.053 and 790.06 do not apply in the following instances, and, despite such sections, it is lawful for the following persons to own, possess, and lawfully use firearms and other weapons, ammunition, and supplies for lawful purposes:
(l) A person traveling by private conveyance when the weapon is securely encased or in a public conveyance when the weapon is securely encased and not in the person’s manual possession;

Your law in this case creates a catch 22 - in order to comply with the law that allows you to "open carry" the firearm by private conveyance, you must conceal the firearm in a case, which then seemingly puts you in violation of the law prohibiting carrying a concealed firearm on or about the person...

Clearly the intent of the law is to allow you to be able to transport your firearms by private conveyance - which includes bicycles.

Federal law would prohibit you from possessing the firearm on the bicycle within 1000' of a school, if not on private property.

 

[Phaethon]

Excellent, I'll have to print out and take a highlighter to the statutes, and try my luck. Thanks for the replies everyone.

 

[hermannr]

I have not read FL law, but look carefully for an exemption when "Transporting" to and from a range or other activity (think hunting)

I would think that a fully cased, unloaded firearm would fit the definition of "transporting".

 

[oneounceload]

We had a gent show up at our club yesterday on his Honda Trike - his shotgun was broken down in a soft cast which was strapped to his bike. Don't know if that helps clarify for you or not

 

[btg3]

Clearly the intent of the law is to allow you to be able to transport your firearms by private conveyance - which includes bicycles.

gotta ask... Skateboards? On foot? For either of these modes of conveyance, I would expect the cased weapon to be "on the person". Does it make a difference?

 

[brboyer]

I think you would be legal, until you came within 1000' of a school (if you don't have a Florida CCW license):

Florida Statutes:

790.001 Definitions.—As used in this chapter, except where the context otherwise requires:
(17) “Securely encased” means in a glove compartment, whether or not locked; snapped in a holster; in a gun case, whether or not locked; in a zippered gun case; or in a closed box or container which requires a lid or cover to be opened for access.


[790.25](3) LAWFUL USES.—The provisions of ss. 790.053 and 790.06 do not apply in the following instances, and, despite such sections, it is lawful for the following persons to own, possess, and lawfully use firearms and other weapons, ammunition, and supplies for lawful purposes:
(l) A person traveling by private conveyance when the weapon is securely encased or in a public conveyance when the weapon is securely encased and not in the person’s manual possession

Your law in this case creates a catch 22 - in order to comply with the law that allows you to "open carry" the firearm by private conveyance, you must conceal the firearm in a case, which then seemingly puts you in violation of the law prohibiting carrying a concealed firearm on or about the person...

Clearly the intent of the law is to allow you to be able to transport your firearms by private conveyance - which includes bicycles.

Federal law would prohibit you from possessing the firearm on the bicycle within 1000' of a school, if not on private property.

Unfortunately, the courts have ruled that "securely encased" also means not on one's person.

I'll see if I can dig up the case where a motorcycle rider was convicted under 790.01(2) for carrying a concealed weapon in a similar situation - without having a CWFL. The court relied on the 'interior' wording in 790.25(5) instead of the wording in 790.25(3)(l). Arguably/possibly because 790.25(3) only exempts one from the provisions of 790.06 (License required to carry concealed) and 790.053 (General prohibition against open carry) and not 790.01 as 790.25(5) does.

(5) POSSESSION IN PRIVATE CONVEYANCE.—Notwithstanding subsection (2), it is lawful and is not a violation of s. 790.01 for a person 18 years of age or older to possess a concealed firearm or other weapon for self-defense or other lawful purpose within the interior of a private conveyance, without a license, if the firearm or other weapon is securely encased or is otherwise not readily accessible for immediate use. Nothing herein contained prohibits the carrying of a legal firearm other than a handgun anywhere in a private conveyance when such firearm is being carried for a lawful use. Nothing herein contained shall be construed to authorize the carrying of a concealed firearm or other weapon on the person. This subsection shall be liberally construed in favor of the lawful use, ownership, and possession of firearms and other weapons, including lawful self-defense as provided in s. 776.012.

 

[Phaethon]

What, then, is "public conveyance"?

 

[NavyLCDR]

What, then, is "public conveyance"?

More commonly refered to as bus, train, subway, ferry. Taxi?

When you said bike, did you mean motorcycle or bicycle?

 

[btg3]

What, then, is "public conveyance"?

bus, subway, tram, trolley

 

[NavyLCDR]

Horse drawn carriage....
Moving walkway or moving sidewalk....
Monorail...
Rickshaw!....
Stagecoach....
Litter... you know, like Cleopatra was carried on.....

 

[Phaethon]

When you said bike, did you mean motorcycle or bicycle?

Ah, I hadn't even considered that I was confusing people. I meant a bicycle; I won't be getting my motorcycle license for a while yet.

I do hope that carrying my rifle on the metro bus isn't more legal than riding it on a bike. I must admit that I would feel very uncomfortable lugging that thing around with all those weirdos.

 

[brboyer]

Ah, I hadn't even considered that I was confusing people. I meant a bicycle; I won't be getting my motorcycle license for a while yet.

I do hope that carrying my rifle on the metro bus isn't more legal than riding it on a bike. I must admit that I would feel very uncomfortable lugging that thing around with all those weirdos.

Quick question....how old are you?

 

[Phaethon]

Eighteen. Motorcycle licenses are expensive.

 

[Telekinesis]

I'm not sure about FL, but in Alabama the motorcycle license isn't that bad. Just the cost of a replacement card, less than $20. Now getting the bike and everything can get expensive... and watch out for the taxes on the purchase when you register if you buy from a private seller! (I just got a motorcycle about a month ago and am loving it!!! )

To keep this somewhat on topic, I'm pretty sure that if you are on a motorcycle (re: road going/registered vehicle) you are treated the same as if you were in a car with regards to having unloaded weapons with you.

 

[MrWesson]

So a bike is a private conveyance?

You can walk around all you want with a cased firearm. I would think as long as it is cased/transporting you are good to go but you might not make it there without getting robbed though.

Guys go to the range on motorcycles(I live in FL) all the time.

 

[brboyer]

OK, update to my post above (#13)
The case I was referring to was Doughty v. State, 979 So. 2d 1048 - Fla: Dist. Court of Appeals, 4th Dist. 2008

In this case, we consider whether the private conveyance exception of section 790.25, Florida Statutes, permits the unlicensed carrying of a concealed firearm or other weapon in a zippered pack around the waist while riding a motorcycle. We conclude that it does not.

. . .

Under the facts presented, Doughty did not meet the statutory requirements of the private conveyance exception because, albeit he was traveling in a private conveyance and his firearm was securely encased, he was carrying the firearm on his person and did not have it within an interior compartment of his motorcycle. We therefore affirm the trial court's denial of Doughty's motion to dismiss.

In Florida, without a CWFL you cannot carry a firearm on, or about, your person even if it is securely encased while in or on a vehicle, or most anywhere else for that matter- with noted exceptions like at home/work, hunting/fishing, at the range, etc. See 790.25(3)

Also in a vehicle, you may only carry a firearm within an interior compartment of said vehicle, so unless the motorcycle/bicycle/tractor/lawn-mower/hang glider has some type of internal storage compartment, the firearm won't be "within the interior of a private conveyance".

Not sure how a court would rule if the firearm was in a saddle bag attached to the motorcycle.

 

[NavyLCDR]

^^^^^ Seems like, unfortunately, I was correct:

Your law in this case creates a catch 22 - in order to comply with the law that allows you to "open carry" the firearm by private conveyance, you must conceal the firearm in a case, which then seemingly puts you in violation of the law prohibiting carrying a concealed firearm on or about the person...

Now.... that leaves us with this:
Put a sling on the rifle/shotgun. Sling the rifle/shotgun over your back, NOT IN A CASE. And ride your bicycle to the gun range.

You will not be in violation of 790.01 because you will not be carrying a concealed firearm.
You will not be in violation of 790.053 because of the exception in 790.25(3)(j):

(3) LAWFUL USES.—The provisions of ss. 790.053 and 790.06 do not apply in the following instances, and, despite such sections, it is lawful for the following persons to own, possess, and lawfully use firearms and other weapons, ammunition, and supplies for lawful purposes:
(j) A person firing weapons for testing or target practice under safe conditions and in a safe place not prohibited by law or going to or from such place;

That's the only way you can legally get to the gun range on your bicycle, apparently, is to carry the gun right out in the open, with no case.

I would do it, just to show how incredibly stupid these laws are.

And yet there remain "pro-2A" people in Florida who oppose unlicensed open or concealed carry. Because of that - this is the situation you find yourself in. This is the perfect example of where "reasonable regulation" and compromise gets us.

 

[Phaethon]

I would do it, just to show how incredibly stupid these laws are.

I might consider doing that, if I didn't live in a heavily urban center and would succeed in not terrifying half the city with my big black Mauser.

790.25 also states that I can carry it securely encased in public conveyance. Is there anything to that? Would bicycles qualify as public conveyance?

I'm thinking that if I strap the rifle in a case to my bike, I can then just put the bicycle on the bike ramp clamps on a city metrobus (my city is bike friendly) along with the rifle, take the bus as close to the range as possible, and maybe from thereonout just mount my bike and ride the relatively marshy stretch to the range with the rifle slung on my back as suggested; or perhaps some variation thereof. Is there any way I can use this public conveyance business to my advantage?