Great pic of M4 in action

Status
Not open for further replies.

m14nut

Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2003
Messages
170
NY11112111956.jpg


pulled this off optimum online news...

Caption reads...
"Although wounded, Staff Sgt. Shannon Kay, of 1st Battalion, 24th Infantry Regiment, fires on an enemy position after being attacked with a car bomb, Saturday, Dec. 11, 2004, in Mosul, Iraq. (AP Photo/Army Times, M. Scott Mahaskey, via USA Today) "
 
The scope appears to me to be possibly a Leupy CQB....
perhaps the other "devise" is a laser of sorts????
 
He's already been wounded, if he were Kerry ,he'd just take his Purple Heart and go home....I guess they like their Strykers over there.
 
Optic appears to be a Leupold CQT. Device on the handguards in an AN/PEQ-2 IR laser/illuminator.
 
Look very carefully at the tip of the muzzle flash. It appears to be the bullet in-flight.
 
Either he isn't under fire or his buddies are the "cool" ones. It's likely a posed pic.
Since both appear to be moving towards objects that could provide cover, you seem to be jumping to conclusions.
 
I don't understand photographers. They just stand there and take pictures. And people say that soldiers have a deeath wish.

Good pic, great job they are doing for America.
 
He's obviously wounded.

There appears to be blood on his left thumb, eye and nose. Of course, everyone can probably see it better than me - my monitor is a POS...

Great action picture!
 
Destructo6 said:
Since both appear to be moving towards objects that could provide cover, you seem to be jumping to conclusions.
Look carefully, both the soldiers in the background are walking and neither one is attempting to engage anyone. I've had to move for cover before and walking wasn't my mode of choice. Kay himself isn't too worried about seeking cover and neither is the photographer standing above him. Furthermore, nobody is using the gun on the APC, many would argue that it's the first thing that should be up in a firefight. Also, why did he take his helmet off? Taking off one's helmet generally isn't the first thing one thinks of during a firefight.
 
Since both appear to be moving towards objects that could provide cover, you seem to be jumping to conclusions.

In an city/urban environment, cover is in just about any direction. In the given picture, you have the foreground and the background. The soldier firing is close-up and no cover is seen. In the background, cover pretty much spans the entire width of the image. Yes, they may be moving toward cover, but not necessarily because they are seeking cover.

Sometime back, the History Channel did a show on combat news/photographers. It is not unusual to have a staged picture where the photographer asks the soldier(s) to re-enact their performance for posterity. Maybe it is staged, maybe it is real time. The caption says the soldier is firing at an enemy position, but doesn't actually say if the enemy is there.

It does look like the bullet was captured by the camera, but I doubt it. The photographer would have to have a pretty special camera to get a stop action shot that would appear to freeze or nearly freeze the bullet in flight. Note that the supposed bullet appears to be slightly stretched. I am guessing the image shows it as about double its actual length. The bullet should be about 0.6" in real life. If seen as twice as long, then the bullet traveled about 0.6" while the picture was being made. What sort of shutter speed would be needed to do that? Assuming the bullet left the muzzle at roughly 2800 feet per second (or 33600 inches per second), you would need a shutter speed around 1/50000 to 1/52000 of a second.

Due to the fast shutter speed, the photographer would need an extremely bright light source or extremely fast film. A bright light source does not appear to be present. If it was present, then the muzzle flash would have been washed out and shadows cast behind the shooter from the flash. If the fast film was being used, then I would expect the image to be more grainy. Given the field conditions, high speed camera temperments, and cost of such cameras, I would doubt any of the war photographers have these cameras or use them in the field. Plus, there would be few, if any, where the photographers would need such camera capabilities.
 
The people in the background look like they're moving at a jog to me and the do appear to be headed for some kind of cover. As for the photographer...he could be standing just at the edge of some cover himself.

brad cook
 
I don't know about you guys, but the guy in the background on the left looks like he is leaning forward at a pretty critical angle in order to be merely "walking". You can tell my the position of his feet. If I tried to walk like that, I am pretty sure I would fall on my face.

Then again I am probably wrong. They are probably walking and Sgt. Kay probably found some fake blood lying about and decided to pose a photo. Heck, he could have been really bored and had his buddies punch him in the face until his nose bled so he could get a real photo. Or just maybe, he really did get hit and instead of getting medical attention or cleaning up, he took the time to pose for a photo and shoot his gun in the middle of town because the officers like when you shoot randomly in urban areas after a car bomb explodes and you are bleeding from head trauma or facial injuries.

CannibalCrowley you get the armchair quarterback of the year award. Good job. You most certainly know more about the situation than anyone there and all from the comfort of your office several thousand miles away. You figured out that his helmet wasn't blown off, but that he took it off for the staged picture. You also figured out that the soldier on the left is walking despite his foot posture and body position would suggest that he is at a trot or run. You also correctly observed that the APC crew are obviously in their vehicle and are reading comic books as the action was over hours ago. They most certainly are not out of their vehicle somewhere else and this situation couldn't have happened just seconds before so the APC crew would most certainly instantly know where the threat is and start shooting at them immediately. You also didn't fall for the bit that Sgt. Kay could be the gunner on said APC, so indeed the gunner must be eating an MRE inside the vehicle as the action was over days before. Further, you recognized that the top of the APC has a servicable firearm on top and that it isn't a command vehicle or an AA vehicle despite the picture cutting the top of the vehicle out.

[Miller High Life Music with Deep Voiced Announcer]Here's to you Internet Armchair Quarterback Commando Expert.[/Miller High Life Music with Deep Voiced Announcer]

[Miller High Life Singer with Higher Pitched Voice]Mr. Internet Armchair Quarterback Commando Expert![/Miller High Life Singer with Higher Pitched Voice]
 
I don't know about you guys, but the guy in the background on the left looks like he is leaning forward at a pretty critical angle in order to be merely "walking". You can tell my the position of his feet. If I tried to walk like that, I am pretty sure I would fall on my face.

The image is fisheyed. The photog used a macro or fisheye lens and the soldiers appear to be in a forward run. The image is just distorted. They are walking.
 
Yes the fisheye has made the Stryker look like it's leaning over too.
 
For the sake of argument, let me paint a likely scenario here:

Convoy is moving through the area. Car bomb (or VBIED-Vehicle Borne IED, in mil-speak) detonates, disabling one or more vehicles, and wounding several soldiers, to include the good SSG Kay. The infantry troops, including SSG Kay, set up a perimeter to secure the area. Once the perimeter is established, and any more seriously wounded have been cared for, the medic checks out SSG Kay, who removes his helmet so Doc can check out the cut(s) on his face. News photog, attracted by the blood, goes to take some shots of the medic at work. While being examined, SSG Kay notices a guy with an AK paying way too much attention to what's going on. Being a man of action, SSG Kay drops to a knee and opens fire on the muji, meanwhile being captured on film.

FWIW, I used to work just down the street from 1-24, aka "Deuce-Four." Good unit.
 
Well said Lang.....
This was just posted to show our Boys using the M4....that's all. Look at the way the topic got s t r e t c h e d ! :scrutiny:
 
El Rojo said:
CannibalCrowley you get the armchair quarterback of the year award. Good job.
I simply have the mind of a skeptic along with the wisdom to spot inconsistencies, just because you lack those qualities you call it being an armchair quarterback.
You figured out that his helmet wasn't blown off, but that he took it off for the staged picture.
The other picture of him shows the helmet still on and a facial wound. He must have a dedicated deity if there was an explosion near enough to him to blow his helmet off and reak his chinstrap without seriously injuring him.
They most certainly are not out of their vehicle somewhere else and this situation couldn't have happened just seconds before so the APC crew would most certainly instantly know where the threat is and start shooting at them immediately.
Well there is that other picture which shows another APC with the gun being manned.

The press has a history of taking fake photos after the actual action is over, I'm seen it myself. You can even look into the Mount Suribachi incident where they staged a second flag raising.

Hmm, by saying that you know more about the situation at hand than me, that would make you an "Internet Armchair Quarterback Commando Expert" as well.

[Miller High Life Music with Deep Voiced Announcer]Here's to you Always Believe the Press Expert.[/Miller High Life Music with Deep Voiced Announcer]

[Miller High Life Singer with Higher Pitched Voice]Mr. Always Believe the Press Expert![/Miller High Life Singer with Higher Pitched Voice]
 
A couple things make me believe that this is not a staged photo. I am not in the military, nor have I ever been in the military so I might be completely off.

Firstly, would you want to be the Marine who faked an injury in order to get on the news? Your reputation with your men would be ruined. Also, I am sure there would be some Marines who actually were wounded in combat that would be quite upset at him.

Secondly, the soldier is firing his weapon. I would think that discharging your weapon when not in combat would be a big no-no. I know that it is probably pretty easy to away with it in Iraq, but when there is a photo of you doing it you might get some questions from higher up.

Thirdly, in the second picture you will see two soldiers in a defensive position in the background of SSgt. Kay.

In terms of his helmet being off, there are a couple of scenarios that could have happened. The most probable one from where I sit is that the soldier had an injury to the face. To make sure there was not anymore damage and to dress the wounds I am sure the medic asked him to remove his helmet. One other point to consider is that we do not the order of events and what happened between the pictures, so trying to assign an order of events based upon the photos would be difficult at best.
 
If you're going to cue the Deep Voiced Announcer, and the high-pitched background music, shouldn't you get the brand correct?

I THINK that it's Bud Light. :neener:
 
The only screwup I see here is that the commercials are for Bud Lite, not Miller Lite :neener:
I've got a CD with all the older ones on it. Funny Stuff!!
Besides, Budweiser is a big 2nd supporter!

DOH! SkyDaver beat me to the punch!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top