GSG-5 coming. Also known as MP5 in .22LR

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Settle down.

This "US parts" babble y'all are talking about only applies to the guns that are listed as "assault rifles."


"1989 IMPORT BAN"
18 USC Chapter 44 as amended by Public Law 101-647 (enacted 11-29-90) and 27 CFR part 178 as amended 06-25-93.
§ 178.39 Assembly of semiautomatic rifles or shotguns.

(a) No person shall assemble a semiautomatic rifle or any shotgun using more than 10 of the imported parts listed in paragraph (c) of this section if the assembled firearm is prohibited from importation under section 925(d)(3) as not being particularly suitable for or readily adaptable to sporting purposes.

Those HK knock-off guns look nifty.

But, they won't do anything that my 10-22 won't do.
Maybe a good choice if you're just starting your gun collection.

I think I'll just stick with my FAL for righteous bad-ass-ness.
 
I was always under the impression that once you make a Title 1 firearm into a Title 2 firearm you no longer have to worry about or play the 922r parts game.
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Settle down.

This "US parts" babble y'all are talking about only applies to the guns that are listed as "assault rifles."


"1989 IMPORT BAN"
18 USC Chapter 44 as amended by Public Law 101-647 (enacted 11-29-90) and 27 CFR part 178 as amended 06-25-93.
§ 178.39 Assembly of semiautomatic rifles or shotguns.

(a) No person shall assemble a semiautomatic rifle or any shotgun using more than 10 of the imported parts listed in paragraph (c) of this section if the assembled firearm is prohibited from importation under section 925(d)(3) as not being particularly suitable for or readily adaptable to sporting purposes.

Those HK knock-off guns look nifty.

But, they won't do anything that my 10-22 won't do.
Maybe a good choice if you're just starting your gun collection.

I think I'll just stick with my FAL for righteous bad-ass-ness.
Click to expand...

This issue came up with the Beretta CX4, and there was even a scanned letter from the ATF posted saying the weapon was allowed to be imported because it is a sporting arm. However, if it were to be turned into an SBR or have the barrel threaded, it would no longer be a "sporting" firearm, and thus would need to comply with the import parts count. SBRing a rifle does not make it exempt from the parts count.

page1-1.jpg

It is basically saying that if the end product you produce would not be legal to be imported for civilian sale, you cannot assemble it or register it. A threaded barrel would not be legal to be imported for civilians, and neither would a short barrel.
 
Hold the horses there Outlaws, you have an incomplete letter there. That is just page one, standard boilerplate that the ATF puts on letters in regard to 922r questions. Page 2 would be where they would address the specific question--

The ATF has already addressed this question in October of 2006 specifically and ruled that if you create a legal NFA item (SBR as an example) from a legally imported firearm, then it no longer falls into the 922r game

Originally Posted by Sterling Nixon, Chief, Firearms Technology Branch on Oct 11 2006

Dear Mr DRUGRUNR

This is in response to your letter dated September 28, 2006 to the Bureau Of Alchohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF), Firearms Technology Branch (FTB), in which you inqure concerning the legality of assembling short-barreled rifles (SBRs) using only imported parts.

As you are aware, SBRs are firearms controlled by the National Firearms Act (NFA). The ATF NFA Branch has previously received applications to make SBRs and shotguns from imported firearms. Since the making of these NFA weapons would render these firearms non-importable under 18 U.S.C. Section 925(d)(3), the ATF Office of Chief Councel Was consulted regarding ATF's position on the application of 18 U.S.C. Section 922(r) to the assembly of NFA Fireams. The response from the Office of Chief Counsel was as follows:

In our view, the making of NFA weapons from lawfully imported rifles and shotguns would not violate section 922(r). The legislative history of section 922(r) indicates that it was intended to preclude the circumvention of the importation restriction on nonsporting rifles and shotguns by importing parts for "nonsporting' firearms and assembling them in the United States using domestically manufactured frames or receivers capable of accepting imported parts. [See the President's Message to Congress Transmitting A Draft of Proposed Legislation Entitled The "Comprehensive Violent Crime Control Act Of 1989," H.R. Doc. No. 101-73, 101st Cong., 1st Sess. 81 (June 15, 1989)]. There is no evidence that this assembly restriction was intended to preclude the making of NFA weapons.

Further, as noted above, section 925(d)(3) prohibits the importation of three types firearms, i.e., nonsporting, NFA weapons, and surplus military weapons. Significantly, section 922(r) only addresses the assembly of "nonsporting" firearms and not the making of NFA weapons.
Since section 922(r) only addresses the assembly of "nonsporting" firearms, the lawfull making of short barrel rifles or shotguns would not be precluded by section 922(r).

Please note that this legal opinion applies very specifically to SBRs and shotguns which are made by shortening the barrel(s) of complete firearms which have been lawfully imported; it does not apply to the assembly of NFA weapons from imported parts.

With regard to the scenario(s) you proposed, if you are interested in manufacturing a short-barreled AK pattern rifle, you must do so only by shortening the original barrel of a lawfully imported rifle. This shortening procedure must not be preformed until you submit an ATF Form 1 ("Application to Make and Register a Firearm").

In Addition, FTB advises you to contact authorities wheere you reside to determing what, if any, State laws or local ordinances govern production or possession of such weapons.

We thank you for your inquiry and trust that foregoing has been responsive.

Sincerely yours,

Richard Vogg?? (can't read it)

for Sterling Nixon
Chief, Firearms Technology Branch


Citation
 
A threaded barrel would not be legal to be imported for civilians, and neither would a short barrel.
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what about my saiga 12? it's got a threaded barrel although it's a shotgun so no suppressor but still threaded.....
 
The ATF has already addressed this question in October of 2006 specifically and ruled that if you create a legal NFA item (SBR as an example) from a legally imported firearm, then it no longer falls into the 922r game
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Agreed, there are multiple letters out that all state the same thing...922(r) does not apply once you are in NFA world.


When the wife is done (CRNA, certified registered nurse anestheologist)
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not to be picky here but...
CRNA = certified registered nurse anesthetist
anesthetist = nurse
anesthesiologist = medical doctor
:D;)
...oh and she'll love it. Good pay, good hours, good lifestyle!
 
not to be picky here but...
CRNA = certified registered nurse anesthetist
anesthetist = nurse
anesthesiologist = medical doctor

...oh and she'll love it. Good pay, good hours, good lifestyle!
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No, your not being picky! Your Edumacating me! I'm glad to learn more about this world I'm being introduced to.
Thanks for the heads up.
 
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Some parts of the gsg-5 are clearly plastic (foreend, stock, grip frame). What other parts of the gun are made from plastic?
 
What other parts of the gun are made from plastic?
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Not sure, but looking at the photos from the French website, the GSG-5's construction looks a LOT like my Son's Tippmann A-5, but just a different shape. Cast aluminum sides, plastic trigger group, the zinc plated screws and nuts holding the halves together. Don't these guys know you have to use blued or parkerized screws on a real firearm!! :evil:
Honestly, it's got me thinking real hard about dropping $500+ (yes +, I'm going to have to SBR this one to own it!) on a paintball gun outfitted with .22LR innerds when I could spend a little more and make a truly dedicated .22LR upper for my RRA AR-15, and have a real gun designed by gun mfgrs. I'd still have the "cool factor" with the AR platform. My only holdback there is I keep reading things about magazine reliability.
On further thought, I'm going to sit on the sidelines on the GSG-5 and see what the "first kid on the block" has to say about it.
 
I am becoming even less interested in it since seemingly nobody can provide real and convincing accuracy information. It doesn't matter how cool it is. If it isn't accurate, it just isn't interesting!
 
A lot of videos now on You Tube, I have ordered some metal targets the reduced size of a bowling pin, half inch thick, to get some fun with this toy.
All the shooters who try it find it really fun.I'll post more videos when it's done.

http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=LAzeQekrj8U

Happy 2008, Y'all!
 
does anyone know if the ones that are currently being sold are the ones with the fake suppressor or not? if they are, can the fake suppressor be unscrewed? and it says it will accept most mp5 accessories, does that mean a collapsible stock? thanks
 
L1 model with the mock silencer is the first of the series to be released. Heard from other forums that Gemtech and American Armaments may be looking to outfit this particular model.

More pics and info posted by www.suchar-enterprises.com, reading from other forums airsoft collapsible stocks , mounts are compatible . However check with your State laws regarding compliance.
 
can the fake suppressor be unscrewed?
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The fake suppressor can be unscrewed. And it does not screw into barrel, but into front sight base.

985 rounds through my gun now, and only a couple of failures to feed from my 5 magazines. A few more failures to ignite primers though, depending on ammo. Amount of misfires is not alarming, but I will look into it. Firing pin may need some reshaping for example. Gun's butt has developed a slight wobble, which would be annoying if this was an olympic match rifle. Overall I'm rather happy with the gun so far.
 
yea i know, it would be pretty dumb to add a stock that is almost as much as the entire gun but if that was my only option i was going to do it. glad to hear that airsoft ones may work.

Luomu-is there anyway to fix that wobble?
 
I quess I could try something to eliminate the wobble, Jeremy. But in reality it is so small it does not bother me yet. My AR15 tele-stock (Colt) wobbles about the same and I don't mind that either.

I find the gun prefers quality HV-ammo reliability-wise, allthough std-velocity works if the weather is not too cold. Excessively lubed bullets are best avoided, so no surprises there.

I must say (hope ruger fans are not terribly offended ;)), that this is so much better than a 10/22 (std model, stainless) I owned 10 years back. Reliability, accuracy, ergonomics, and even trigger are superior.
 
Great comment on your GSG-5 ! It may ruffle a few 10/22LR fans but at least reading your input helps dispell a lot of apprehension about reliability and quality of this gun we are so excited about!

BTW a 6mm washer will help eliminate that wobble you mentioned.
 
I just learned from a French GSG-5 owner that these guns are sold there for a $1,000.00 and that extra mags cost $75.00 a piece limit of 2 mags per owner.

Makes me thankful that a GSG-5 from www.suchar-enterprises only cost $499.00 and extra mags at $35.00 no limit !
 
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