Gun Free School Zone: "You can't get there from here"

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AZRickD

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Senator Di-Fi opened her hypocritical mouth at the Judge Roberts confirmation hearings by first lauding the worth of the 1,000 foot "gun free zone" and then saying that the Supreme Court showed poor judgment in overturning the law in 1995' US v Lopez decision (Congress passed it again the next year).

So, in the map you'll see by going to Alan Korwin's gunlaws.com web site:

http://www.gunlaws.com/Gun_Free_School_Zones.htm

You'll see a map of central Phoenix with as many school zones as the database and GIS software could find and map. About a 1,100 in Maricopa county which has a population of 3.5 million, give or take.

You'll see dots covering major and minor roads throughout metro-Phoenix. (The dots represent the 1,000 foot zone, plus another 300 feet since the zone starts not at the center of the school, but on the sidewalks). So, each dot has a radius of 1,300 feet, and a diameter of 2,600 feet, or about a half mile.

You'll see major highways in red such as Interstate 10 heading west to east through central Phoenix; State Route 51 (Squaw, nay, Pietewa Peak Freeway) and I-17 both heading north/south; and the US 60 heading east into Mesa. The gray lines represent the major surface streets such as Bell Road, Thunderbird, Cactus, Peoria (all east/west in the northern part of Phoenix) as well as north/south streets such as 19th Ave, 35th Ave, etc, in the central-west valley. These are major surface streets WIDE... usually six or even eight lane city streets (fun to cross on foot with the "Don't Walk" sign flashing at you).

To give you some perspective, the blocks made up by the gray roads should be roughly one-square mile (sometimes more, sometimes less) so that two zones, end to end will match the width of most Phoenix city blocks (yes, they are big blocks).

So, as you look over the map which I will post below, you will see that dozens and dozens of school zones block major highways and major surface streets. So, if you're one of the many Arizona citizens who don't have a CCW (only about 70,000 do), if you pass through one of these zones... you're a felon.

Just try to get from Metro Center Mall in NW Phoenix down to the State Capitol in the center of the city. Good luck. Now, look how many surface steets are blocked off at many different places. Some metro-Phoenix citizens are "land-locked" by the GFSZ.

Can't get there from here.

Rick

The following is text from Korwin's press release:

GUN FREE SCHOOL ZONES ACT OF 1990

This act criminalizes every lawful gun owner who travels with a firearm outside the home, with a few narrow exceptions. It was never intended to do this, and needs to be amended. Schools themselves would remain gun-free zones, and the near-total gun ban this law creates would be corrected.

GFSZ%20Phoenix.jpg

Next up is Cleveland. All those Catholic schools? What a mess !!

GFSZ%20Cleveland.jpg
 
Yikes!
Fortunately in LA we're pretty much not allowed to take a gun outside anyways, unless of course you're lucky enough to be in a gang. Then you get to carry cool automatic Ingrams and AK-47s, do crack, rape girls, and kill indiscriminately within 20 feet of a school with complete impunity.

:banghead:
 
What is the law now and how is it applied??????????You said they passed it again the next year. What in HECK is the law now. Some people live within that 1000 foot zone.
 
Indeed they did pass it again in 1996 and Clinton signed it. The original GFSZ was signed by President George Herbert Walker Bush in around 1990 IIRC.

The USSC said that it was an unconstitutional extension of the commerce clause because Congress didn't say that it had a link to interstate commerce. Congress passed the law with new language saying "because gun violence has an effect on interstate commerce..."

The only citizens who are immune to this law are those who keep the gun in their house (how does one get it home from the gun shop or to the range or for hunting?), or those with CCW permits (under certain restrictions).

I am not aware of prosecutions under the current law, and certainly no appeals. There may be some, but think about it, if you were fed.gov and wanted to CYA, would you want to have this law go before the 5th Circuit and then the USSC after they just ruled against fed.gov on the first version?

But look on the bright side, it looks like all of Lake Erie is GFSZ free.

Rick
 
Good Gracious. I though this law was gone. O:K who is going to be the test case. This law is ridiculous.
 
Ya gotta get arrested first.

We are all potential test cases. It just takes one bad cop followed by a stupid prosecutor.

http://www.gunlaws.com/images/GFSZ Phoenix.pdf

The link above is a high-rez version of phoenix.

The little-teeny grey lines are neighborhood streets.

Scroll around and see how many areas are totally boxed in by GFSZones.

Rick
 
Good Gracious. I though this law was gone. O:K who is going to be the test case.
Sorry, you're too late. The idea that Congress can simply declare that an in-state action affects interstate commerce, and thereby grab authority over that action, was just tested. Unfortunately, the drug warrior/gun grabber side of the commerce clause argument won the day.
 
Look on the bright side, at least it doesn't ban the transport of any firearms through the school zone. Although that would come into conflict with FOPA.

I honestly don't think Senators like Mrs. Feinstein really care about the consequences of these laws. It's entirely ideological for these people, and since the only good citizen (to them) is a citizen that doesn't own firearms, who cares what happens to you?
 
Living in Cleveland I can attest, that YES there are that many Catholic schools. ...Really...Some are as small as small as 100 kids.
 
Sadly under current SCOTUS jurisprudence, this counts as interstate commerce because congress said that it does. The only two ways we can get rid of this is by (a) repealing it (b) replacing Ginsberg, Breyer, Stevens, Souter, Kennedy and Scalia with justices who will overturn Wickard v Filburn.

The only 3 justices who got Kelo and Raich right were O'Connor, Rehnquist and Thomas, and the first 2 just quit. I have a good feeling about Roberts, but we still have an enormously long way to go.
 
the only good citizen (to them) is a citizen that doesn't own firearms
Exactly.

They'd rather you follow the process and wait for an LEO to protect you. If, by some outside chance, there's none available when you need them (like right NOW!!!) - then your call will give them ammunition for the next budget cycle.
 
Just so you all know, this is what the law has in the form of "exemptions." Apparently they took a page out of New Jersey's playbook. All of New Jersey is a "gun free" zone, actually, with firearms possession only being allowed through exemption. As you might imagine, many otherwise honest gun owners are serving lengthy terms in prison. Don't say you weren't warned, because this stuff will come your way just as soon as they get to you.

(B) Subparagraph (A) does not apply to the possession of a firearm:

(i) on private property not part of school grounds;

(ii) if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State in which the school zone is located or a political subdivision of the State, and the law of the State or political subdivision requires that, before an individual obtains such a license, the law enforcement authorities of the State or political subdivision verify that the individual is qualified under law to receive the license;

(iii) that is:

(I) not loaded;and

(II) in a locked container, or a locked firearms rack that is on a motorvehicle;

(iv) by an individual for use in a program approved by a school in the school zone;

(v) by an individual in accordance with a contract entered into between a school in the school zone and the individual or an employer of the individual;

(vi) by a law enforcement officer acting in his or her official capacity;or

(vii) that is unloaded and is possessed by an individual while traversing school premises for the purpose of gaining access to public or private lands open to hunting, if the entry on school premises is authorized by school authorities.
Therefore, if you do not have a CCW permit in the state you're in, you would need to unload the firearm and put it in a locked container while driving through the school zone.
 
Its something to be used later. All a more strongly anti-gun ATF needs to do is search for traffic stops where a gun was produced and prosecute. Since most such search stops are against poor individuals, they will have no problem finding someone who will not be able to defend themselves properly. Throw in a few poorly argued constitutional defenses and the precedents start piling up.
 
Sheesh

Here in Mesa the Mesa Gun Shop is across the street from an elementary school and junior high. When I taught in Phoenix, there was Guns R Us across the street from my school.

How can that be? Besides being Arizona that is!
 
I have never understood the logic of prohibiting certain things "within X feet" of a school/church. Even the sexual preditor thing. How is the person less dangerous 1001 feet away from a school? For that matter, how are they more dangerous living next door to a school where the children are properly protected? How about selling beer in a Krogers that is less than 1000 feet from a church? :confused: Are the churchgoers unable to resist the temptation to go in there instead? :evil:

Where did this false logic originate and why do we allow the basic premise not to be challenged? It doesn't matter who or what is the target, it's just a stupid (though maybe feel-good) idea. :banghead:
 
Like Senator Feinstein, I'm happy this law was originally passed. Thanks to it, there have been no school shootings since then. The rule of law has provided a magical, divine barrier that actually causes the "zone" to be gun free.

It's for the same reason that no drugs ever make it into any high schools any more.
 
VA did away with this law for CHP holders. We can now carry concealed when picking up/dropping off the rugrats provided we stay in the vehicle. :D
 
Like Senator Feinstein, I'm happy this law was originally passed. Thanks to it, there have been no school shootings since then. The rule of law has provided a magical, divine barrier that actually causes the "zone" to be gun free.
After watching a documentary on the whole Columbine unpleasantness, I was left with the opinion that anyone who advocates making schools disarmed victim / criminal protection zones is willfully and maliciously endangering our children. :fire:
 
Given the current state of what passes for education in this country, I'd rather we had school free gun zones.

lpl/nc
 
Huh? Is that just for public schools or for private schools as well?

A gun club I belong to maintains and runs a pistol range owned by the city in the basement of a middle school. I hope many a liberal wets their bed with the knowledge that I shoot there. :cool:
 
Haha. In the basement of a school.

Incidentally, in two towns I've lived in the police department (with basement range) has been right across the street from the local elementary school.
 
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