Gunbroker Snipers?
- Thread starter Radjxf
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deadin
Member
I agree, sniping sucks for the seller and the auction site.
However, as a buyer, all I can say is TS!. (Can you blame me for looking for a bargain?)
I don't understand the people that bid several times with just the minimum bid, like bidding $3 each time until they find what the other guy's highest bid was. The way I understand it, no matter what you bid, the only bid that will show is just enough to top the last bid.
Like if the top bid is $150 and you bid $300 as your highest bid. The bid won't go to $350, it will go to $151.
Also, just because your auction has 50 "watchers" , don't assume that they got screwed out of bidding at the last minute. I believe most watchers have a similar item to what you are selling and just want to see what it goes for.
They have no intention of bidding.
Like if the top bid is $150 and you bid $300 as your highest bid. The bid won't go to $350, it will go to $151.
Also, just because your auction has 50 "watchers" , don't assume that they got screwed out of bidding at the last minute. I believe most watchers have a similar item to what you are selling and just want to see what it goes for.
They have no intention of bidding.
I don't believe dealers are bidding up the price. I think a few individuals selling 1 or 2 firearms gives everyone else a bad name. My auctions are not even auctions. No reserve- Buy now sales. Either you want it for the price given or you don't.
So here is my cheap plug:
Take a look for your self. Good prices on Stags.
So here is my cheap plug:
Take a look for your self. Good prices on Stags.
Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow
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Let me see if I understand this:
SOME gunbroker auctions have the 15 minute rule in effect, and SOME don't?
Who gets to decide? Where is it labeled on the auction in question, as to whether or not the 15 minute rule is in effect? Is it conspicuous and in the same place every time?
Obviously, ALL auctions should have the 15 minute rule in effect.
SOME gunbroker auctions have the 15 minute rule in effect, and SOME don't?
Who gets to decide? Where is it labeled on the auction in question, as to whether or not the 15 minute rule is in effect? Is it conspicuous and in the same place every time?Obviously, ALL auctions should have the 15 minute rule in effect.
deadin
Member
For you folks that think all on-line auctions should have the “15-minute-rule” so they would be more like “real” auctions, take these thoughts into consideration.
1. In a “real” auction, there is a much smaller audience to compete with therefore prices tend to be lower. (Also, any auctioneer that waited 15 minutes to gavel an auction closed wouldn’t hold his job very long.)
2. In a “real” auction the bidder actually has a chance to see, handle and evaluate what he is bidding on, not just some fuzzy pictures and vague descriptions.
3. In a “real” auction the winning bidder gets to take immediate possession of what he has won, not sending his money off into the ether and wondering if he will actually get what he thought he bid on. (Or get anything at all.)
4. In a “real” auction the seller gets to pay a 15% premium (at least), plus picture, promotion and other fees.
So, to me, the 15-minute-rule is just another example of someone that has no idea of what they are selling is worth (otherwise why not just put a starting bid at what they value it at) and of auction sites maximizing their profits at the expense of the buyers.
Some folks say they won’t bid on an auction with a reserve because it’s a waste of their time. I feel that way about 15-minute-rule auctions. I need to “snipe” to try to make it worth my while to offset #’s 1, 2 & 3 above.
1. In a “real” auction, there is a much smaller audience to compete with therefore prices tend to be lower. (Also, any auctioneer that waited 15 minutes to gavel an auction closed wouldn’t hold his job very long.)
2. In a “real” auction the bidder actually has a chance to see, handle and evaluate what he is bidding on, not just some fuzzy pictures and vague descriptions.
3. In a “real” auction the winning bidder gets to take immediate possession of what he has won, not sending his money off into the ether and wondering if he will actually get what he thought he bid on. (Or get anything at all.)
4. In a “real” auction the seller gets to pay a 15% premium (at least), plus picture, promotion and other fees.
So, to me, the 15-minute-rule is just another example of someone that has no idea of what they are selling is worth (otherwise why not just put a starting bid at what they value it at) and of auction sites maximizing their profits at the expense of the buyers.
Some folks say they won’t bid on an auction with a reserve because it’s a waste of their time. I feel that way about 15-minute-rule auctions. I need to “snipe” to try to make it worth my while to offset #’s 1, 2 & 3 above.
Most eBay sellers understand that the potential to get sniped will usually drive the price up, just as no reserves and low minimum auctions tend to end up with the highest sale prices.
There are always a few exceptions, and it is not true for certain types of items, so now and then someone gets a bargain, but overall the sellers get the best prices with a fixed ending time. Its sort of like the way a casino works, a payout now and then encourages the other gamblers, even though on the whole,they are being eaten alive.
If you made a bid that was the maximum you wanted to pay for the item, why would you be mad that someone else was willing to pay more? Are you really saying that the maximum bid you made was not actually the maximum you were willing to pay? Whose fault is that?
Radjxf said:
So you lost out on a good price because someone else bid higher?
I don't quite see your point.... You were obviously prepared to bid more but did not, why, if you wanted the item, did you not bid higher? And, yes, sniping software works on Gunbroker and AuctionArms.
The "15 Minute Rule" will kick in and allow other bidders to top the snipe but as soon as the 15 minutes are up and the auction is close to ending the snipe will kick in again. The snipe will simply outbid you until you get tired of waiting and rebidding or until the snipe max is reached.Sniping Software can be very useful. It will occasionally keep you out of a "bidding war" with another bidder but its greatest value is that you can put in a snipe and if you change your mind and need to cancel or want to lower your bid you can do so until a few minuted before the auction ends.
The seller still gets the price people are willing to pay but does not profit from a "bidding war" by two or more people who just "have to have it" and raise the bids to unreasonable levels in the "excitement" of an auction. As a seller I accept that fact and as a buyer I appreciate not having to watch numerous auctions at weird hours to know I can participate up to my price.
Don't forget that the sniper also has to put in a max bid and if your standing bid is higher than the snipe max your standing bid still wins. Your problem is not the sniper - your bid was too low!
krokus said:
If you put in a reserve or start bid for the amount you are willing to accept a sniper can not hurt you.
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jgorniak
Member
Don't even try to suggest that an online auction is similar to a live auction; they're two completely different animals.
Sellers who don't like snipers seem to miss this point: a snipe bid will raise the final selling price of an item, whether the sniper wins the auction or not. Without a snipe bid, a lower bid wins. You do like selling at a higher price, don't you?
Sellers who don't like snipers seem to miss this point: a snipe bid will raise the final selling price of an item, whether the sniper wins the auction or not. Without a snipe bid, a lower bid wins. You do like selling at a higher price, don't you?
R.W.Dale
Member
You also won't have to worry about bidders either.
I take it you haven't sold much online. The ONLY way you can make a sale online is for it to be a great deal or be precieved as a great deal. Gunbroker is chocked full of item priced to value that's been auto releisted for YEARS
My items start at what I have in them +shipping with shipping listed as "free". If four snipers pounce in the last second and only one bid gets through it quickly becomes a waste of my time
I'm at a loss to figure out how "sniping" negates these points
R.W.Dale
Member
no no it doesn't if you have MORE than one sniper
deadin
Member
It's usually the buyer's that feel cheated because a sniper "beat them out" and they didn't have time to make another bid. (And they didn't get the "bargain" they seem to think they deserve.)
Yeah, however, we were talking about BUYERS, not SELLERS.
If you have an auction of your own go for "chump change" then that is YOUR problem because you didn't put a high enough reserve on the item or you started it too low...
This isn't rocket science!
I've sold nearly 200 items on eBay and bought a number of items on GunBroker. People who complain either way (seller or buyer) just have themselves to blame.
Funderb
Member
Easiest way to beat a sniper is with an air strike!!
I think sniping on ebay is a stupid thing, and doesn't achieve squat. I basically decide upfront what an item is worth to me, what is the max I will pay for it, and I bid that amount by proxy. I can't tell you how many times some moron has tried to snipe an item away from me at the last second only to find his bid was lower than my proxy max. At that point, if he was willing to go higher it was too late for him, I had the item won. If he sniped a higher amount than I had set up on proxy, he got it, but he could have done that days earlier, because I had set a max and wouldn't have gone higher.
I had hoped GB bidders were brighter than to snipe.
I had hoped GB bidders were brighter than to snipe.
deadin
Member
It has been my experience that you are one of a rare breed. I would say that 9 out of 10 would bid again if they had the chance.
lonegunman
Member
Deserve a bargain? Are you kidding.
I know that the dealers that Gunbroker their crap from my area always go for the "no reserve" option to induce buyers and if they do not get the price they want they either snipe the price up or steal it back at the last minute by out bidding the honest bidder.
If you want "X" amount of dollars, put a minimum and save the rest of the world from "getting a bargain" as you call it.
I don't bother with crap like Gunbroker simply because it is not worth my time to sit on the internet and try and out bid an employee of the dealer for a product he was supposed to be selling.
I know that the dealers that Gunbroker their crap from my area always go for the "no reserve" option to induce buyers and if they do not get the price they want they either snipe the price up or steal it back at the last minute by out bidding the honest bidder.
If you want "X" amount of dollars, put a minimum and save the rest of the world from "getting a bargain" as you call it.
I don't bother with crap like Gunbroker simply because it is not worth my time to sit on the internet and try and out bid an employee of the dealer for a product he was supposed to be selling.
deadin
Member
You know, it's really easy to sit back and place the blame for losing an auction on someone else. (like shills.) Might it be just because someone else was willing to bid more?
Accusing dealers of using shills is pretty slanderous unless you can actually prove it. If you have proof, send it to the auction sponser, if they choose to not do anything about it, think about a lawsuit or just quit using them.
BTW, If you are sure there is a shill bidding against you, you can take comfort that he is going to be paying the final value fee each time.. It won't take many times of this before the dealer will have more in the item than it will bring, even in an "honest" auction. And if a dealer starts having too many "non-paying bidders", bells will start going off with the auctioneers because it will be costing them money.
Accusing dealers of using shills is pretty slanderous unless you can actually prove it. If you have proof, send it to the auction sponser, if they choose to not do anything about it, think about a lawsuit or just quit using them.
BTW, If you are sure there is a shill bidding against you, you can take comfort that he is going to be paying the final value fee each time.. It won't take many times of this before the dealer will have more in the item than it will bring, even in an "honest" auction. And if a dealer starts having too many "non-paying bidders", bells will start going off with the auctioneers because it will be costing them money.
absolute0
Member
Um...yeah.
Sellers bitching about "snipers" don't seem to understand the realities at work in an auction environment.
Auctions have their own dynamic. They convene a group of potentially interested buyers within a certain time frame at a specific place and time. It could be at a feed lot, in somone's front yard or world wide the internet, only those that show up at the anointed hour get to participate and high bid wins.
If you want a certain price for an item, hang a for sale sign on it and don't sell it at auction. If you want to capitalize on the bidding frenzy an auction can sometimes generate on a desireable item then you'd better be prepared to deal with the consequences if this doesn't occur.
If you wanna take the ride, saddle up partner. If you don't, hold a garage sale.
Sellers bitching about "snipers" don't seem to understand the realities at work in an auction environment.
Auctions have their own dynamic. They convene a group of potentially interested buyers within a certain time frame at a specific place and time. It could be at a feed lot, in somone's front yard or world wide the internet, only those that show up at the anointed hour get to participate and high bid wins.
If you want a certain price for an item, hang a for sale sign on it and don't sell it at auction. If you want to capitalize on the bidding frenzy an auction can sometimes generate on a desireable item then you'd better be prepared to deal with the consequences if this doesn't occur.
If you wanna take the ride, saddle up partner. If you don't, hold a garage sale.
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jgorniak
Member
You miss the all-important reason for sniping.
I, as a bidder, try to win an auction with the lowest bid I can. A snipe bid isa proxy bid, except it is placed at the last second. As I know that I will get only one crack at an item (in an e-Bay auction), I put in my max bid. I then know that there will be no one escalating the auction price at the last minute. If I win, fine. If not, no big deal.
I don't believe I've ever heard a true sniper whine that they lost an auction.
Sniping is non-exsistent on GunBroker. Shilling is another issue.
To give you an idea of strange bidding on GunBroker.
I bid what I wanted to pay for an item. A while later, a guy bid something and the auto-bidder upped my bid to beat his. 15 seconds later the guy bids yet again... And again the auto bidder outbids him because my amount was still higher (although he actually reached my max but didn't know it).
He then went to another auction for the same item and ended up paying more than I did...
People seem to turn their brains off when selling or buying on auction sites for some reason.
I bid what I wanted to pay for an item. A while later, a guy bid something and the auto-bidder upped my bid to beat his. 15 seconds later the guy bids yet again... And again the auto bidder outbids him because my amount was still higher (although he actually reached my max but didn't know it).
He then went to another auction for the same item and ended up paying more than I did...
People seem to turn their brains off when selling or buying on auction sites for some reason.
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