Guns in Space

[FireArmFan]

thanks for all the replies. i did a search before starting this thread but apparently i missed the thread about this before.

 

[strat81]

Klaatu Barada Nicto.

Easy there, Gort.

 

[Neo-Luddite]

Oh, I taped that back in 1984---I think I know what I'll hunt up and watch tonight as I contemplate the Atomic Scientists moving the hands closer to midnight today.

 

[230RN]

RP86

230RN I already had chemistry earlier today!

LOL. Yeah, but high-powered chemistry?

I figured I'd post it to the question of whether cartridges would go off in a vacuum just to have it on site in case anyone in future asked about it. My experience has been that answering the original question leads to other questions, so I figured I'd answer most of 'em in one fell swoop just for the record. By the way, an "oxidizer" doen't have to be oxygen. Mix zinc powder and sulphur powder together and see what happens when you light it. The sulphur is an oxidizer in this sense --it's in the same periodic group as oxygen. Oh. Stand back. Use gloves. Use eye/face protection. Use small quantities. Well-ventilated area. ABC fire extinguisher handy. Blah-blah-blah. I take no responsibility for any carelessness.

I originally took lots 'n lots of chemistry in the middle of the last century, and I can't believe how lucky I was 'sperimenting with some of this stuff. Things were a lot looser back then. A kid could walk into Eimer and Amend chemical supply house or Van Waters and Rogers and buy a pound each of the "big three," nitric, hydrochloric, and sulphuric acids, no questions asked.

Nowadays, they'd probably want a retinal scan.

 

[Mal H]

Mix zinc powder and sulphur powder together and see what happens when you light it.

It all goes up (2K to 10K feet up) in a big cloud of smoke! I must have used several hundred pounds of the stuff in amateur rockets in high school. Then we graduated to epoxy resin and pot. nitrate. Talk about "solid" fuel!

Things were a lot looser back then.

You are so right. I could place an order with Fisher for such things as you mentioned in the 60's and have them delivered to my home. Their catalog was my "dream book" back then, now replaced by Brownell's.

 

[Owen]

Table sugar and potassium nitrate works pretty well as a rocket propellant too. You mix the sugar and KNO3 on a hot plate until the sugar melts.

Mold into desired shape...

Voila, Rocket Candy

 

[230RN]

Ahhhh, the flash, the smoke, the shock wave, the ergs per microsecond....

Ahhhhhh.....

You forgot to mention the green flame, Mal H.

Well, this thread is wandering around pleasantly --like a walk through a garden or a gun show or a Brownell's catalog...

People today don't know what freedom is anymore.

Did you put your seat belt on?

 

[LaEscopeta]

You mix the sugar and KNO3 on a hot plate until the sugar melts.

D’OH! You have to melt the sugar into the mixture! My buddies and I tried and tried to make home made model rocket engines when we were in high school. We used a lot of potassium nitrate and powdered sugar (figured the smaller grains would help the mixing and the extra surface area would help the reaction.) I think we got enough energy release but we could never get a mixture to burn fast enough to move anything but the engine itself. Now 40+ years later I find out the secret.

Well, this thread is wandering around pleasantly.

+1

 

[Owen]

powdered sugar also has a large amount of cornstarch to keep it from clumping.

And we are really wandering...

 

[230RN]

You can test for starch by putting a drop of iodine on it. If it turns black, it's got starch in it.

You can test for iodine by putting a speck of starch on it. If it turns black, it's got iodine in it.

 

[Medusa]

IIRC if to mix equal quantities of Aluminium and Iodine powder and drop some water on it it will be interesting. But I could be mistaken...

 

[North Bender]

About guns in space - the Russians were the first to send guns ins space. Their spacesuits, some of which have been sold on ebay, contained a holster for the Makarov pistol. In case they came down in Siberia and had to wait a while for rescue.

The Makarov was the First Gun in Space.

 

[Lamb of Gun]

So when I turn on my Maglite im feeling the effects of recoil? If that's true, that's the most interesting tidbit of information... ever.

 

[Mal H]

No, you don't feel any recoil from the light at all - there is none. Photons are wave like and particle like at the same time. However, the "particles" (that definition really doesn't fit photons, but it's what we use anyway) are massless. No mass - no recoil. If they did have mass, even an infinitesimal amount of mass, you would be pushed back at an extremely rapid rate assuming you could even hold onto the flashlight at all. Also, if photons had any mass, a simple laser would be the most efficient rocket engine available. It could be used for intersteller travel; from here to Alpha Centauri on about a dozen D cell batteries.

 

[SaMx]

Photons don't have any mass, but they actually do have a very tiny amount of momentum. Theoretically you could make a "flashlight" that could throw a person against a wall. Of course, it would probably vaporize them.

 

[Owen]

Of course photons have mass. Othewise gravity wouldn't be able to alter a photons vector, nd gravitational lensing wouldn't occur

 

[Mal H]

No, they don't have mass in the conventional sense, that is, like a proton or an electron has mass. A massive object like the sun, or a galaxy cluster in the case of lensing, warps the space around it such that the light beam has to bend around it. As far as the photon is concerned, it is traveling in as straight a line as possible.

If photons had mass and are affected by gravity, wouldn't a light beam projected away from the earth or the sun be slowed down by the gravity? And conversely, wouldn't light projected toward the earth speed up due to the acceleration of gravity? Light travels at a constant speed in a vacuum no matter what body of gravitational attraction is nearby.

 

[K40]

If you were to bring earth manufactured ammo into space - wouldn't the cases rupture in the vacuum anyway?

I have no physics training...

 

[Mal H]

No, that's a non-problem. The cases are very strong and can easily withstand the 14 lb. PSI or so that might be contained in the case assuming it is completely air tight and hasn't leaked out any residual pressure. If a structure as strong as a small brass case would rupture when exposed to the vacuum of space, think what would happen to a space suit that has thousands of times more surface area inside and have men and women inside them! (Uh ... not at the same time, of course.)

 

[230RN]

Nal H:

If a structure as strong as a small brass case would rupture when exposed to the vacuum of space, think what would happen to a space suit that has thousands of times more surface area inside and have with men and women inside them! (Uh ... not at the same time, of course.)

Eek!

The very thought!

(My cases have only 12 psi (about 630 Torr) in them. I reload at 5400 feet.)