Gunsmith "Rule"?

[bullzeye8]

This gunsmith and some of you have never shot a real nice rifle. Anschutz less expensive match 64 action comes with a 6 oz trigger and their more expensive match 54 action comes with a trigger adjustable down to about 2 oz. Jewell triggers for centerfire rifles such as the Remington 700 are similar weights and even Timney makes a model that goes down to 8 oz. Now some trigger designs may not be safe below three pounds but a well designed trigger is perfectly safe at low weights of pull. Thinking you can't adjust any trigger below three pounds for liability reasons is ridiculous especially considering budget rifles these days are adjustable below that weight such as Savages adjustable down to like 1.5 pounds. These weights may not be appropriate for a hunting or self defense rifles but they are use-full and very enjoyable to shoot and not a liability risk to the company or gunsmith otherwise all of these companies would not sell these triggers and guns.

 

[Moparnut]

IIRC, the Savage accutrigger is adjustable down to 2lbs. It is not recommended to adjust it any further. If a gunsmith is uncomfortable with adjusting a trigger below a certain weight then you have the right to find a new gunsmith. At the same time, the gunsmith has the right to conduct a business how he/she wants to.

 

[chicharrones]

Anschutz less expensive match 64 action comes with a 6 oz trigger and their more expensive match 54 action comes with a trigger adjustable down to about 2 oz. Jewell triggers for centerfire rifles such as the Remington 700 are similar weights and even Timney makes a model that goes down to 8 oz.

I can't feel trigger weights that low with the tip of my trigger finger. In that situation I imagine I'd have to know that if my trigger finger moved that the gun would fire.

 

[chicharrones]

Legal isn't a matter of individual discretion. Safe is. How much the government intervenes in personal responsibility for one's actions varies quite a bit by jurisdiction, of course. In my neck of the woods people are probably so "naive" that pretty much the only products that have warning stickers of any kind on them are either tobacco products or imported.

Like other's have said, the lawyer situation with the people that hire them is ludicrous here in the USA.

I personally know five people in my lifetime that have caused harm to themselves and sought out attorneys to blame someone else for their own negligence. None of those people are my friends and I don't want to be anywhere near them.

 

[armarsh]

I recently had a trigger installed by a new gunsmith and he declined to set the trigger ( a new Timney) below 3 lbs. I prefer mine to about 2 lbs. Said his insurance policy would not allow him to do it. I know, I know....I should do it myself. I plan to look for another smith, but good ones are hard to find since my previous smith/friend died. Is this guy just being unnecessarily cautious or have you heard of such policies?? I'll appreciate your thoughts.

I can't tell if the gunsmith told you in advance or after the work was done. Putting myself in your place if he did not tell me in advance I would not be happy and he would get no further work from me.

I expect an installer to adjust an item to the manufacturers's specifications. It makes me wonder what other specifications he decided not to follow.

 

[entropy]

This gunsmith and some of you have never shot a real nice rifle. Anschutz less expensive match 64 action comes with a 6 oz trigger and their more expensive match 54 action comes with a trigger adjustable down to about 2 oz. Jewell triggers for centerfire rifles such as the Remington 700 are similar weights and even Timney makes a model that goes down to 8 oz. Now some trigger designs may not be safe below three pounds but a well designed trigger is perfectly safe at low weights of pull. Thinking you can't adjust any trigger below three pounds for liability reasons is ridiculous especially considering budget rifles these days are adjustable below that weight such as Savages adjustable down to like 1.5 pounds. These weights may not be appropriate for a hunting or self defense rifles but they are use-full and very enjoyable to shoot and not a liability risk to the company or gunsmith otherwise all of these companies would not sell these triggers and guns.

Precisely because these guns are used for one thing, and one thing only, and the people who shoot them know this, and have LOTS of experience with them You don't just up and buy an Anschutz on a whim.
The only reason I did the two trigger jobs I mentioned earlier is because the guns were heavy varmint barreled .22-250's, the guys were serious varminters, and they had other guns for deer.
And, yes, I have shot some triggers that measure in ounces, on real nice rifles. (The two .22-250 M700's for starters. 8 oz. I had a trigger setup in my issue M16A1 that I set at 2.5#; I had to take it out and reinstall an extra set that was above the 4.5# min. test weight when we had inspections.)
If someone I didn't know came into a shop I owned and asked me to set a trigger lower than 3# on a rifle, I'd probably pass, too.

 

[doubleh]

First off I have a question. Has Timney's trigger quality degraded to the extent you need a gunsmith to work on them to make them crisp? I only have two Timneys and they are many years old but they needed nothing but installed and adjusted to the weight I wanted.

As to rifles with triggers that are safe at very light pull weights that is of no interest to a lawyer. He is out to get a settlement and is not fair or impartial. He is also going to do everything he possibly can to have people on his jury that know basically nothing about guns to help him out getting his judgment. I don't blame the gunsmith or his insurance company at all although he should make his policy clear before doing the work.

 

[bgw45]

In our justice system the jury only gets to hear what the judge allows. Since jurors are not generally 12 of our peers with knowledge of shooting or hunting we suffer from ignorant greed.

 

[Riomouse911]

The folks who mentioned personal liability for the gunsmith are spot on. It's not just the possibility of losing a lawsuit, its the cost, hassle, and lost time-wages from just responding to a lawsuit (much less actually defending oneself) that keeps people thinking this way.

Yes, people will often file a suit when they are at fault hoping to get a " go away" settlement. I absolutely hate that, but many businesses and governments live by a cost-risk philosophy and perpetuate these suits as a result.

Remember; the gunsmith is setting a trigger for a hunting gun that is to be used by someone he isn't related to, who will be hunting on lands where he can't control the conduct or presence of others. It's not just the shooter who may sue if an incident occurs, it could be the shooters family or estate if the shooter shoots himself, it could be the shooters unintended victim if he shoots someone else, or a combination of both if the shooter shoots someone who sues, and then the shooters criminal defense attorney drags the gunsmith before the jury and blames him for making "an unsafe rifle with a hair trigger" that went off and killed the kid thought to be a deer.

Every one of these types of scenarios play out all the time, so it doesn't surprise me in the least that an arbitrary 3lb. let off weight was selected by the gunsmith. He thinks he can defend it, and if you tune it to be lower then that setting isn't on him it's on you.

Stay (and shoot) safe!

 

[Jim Watson]

Pardon me for thinking out of the box, but it would seem reasonable to apply the Timney instructions and turn the weight of pull screw until it suited you, within their published adjustment range, also following the instruction to leave the sear engagement screw where they put it. You would then, of course, test it for safety such that it didn't drop the striker by closing the bolt too hard or bumping the butt.