Handgun to accompany me to Montana?

[Balrog]

Hey I am going to be going to Montana or Wyoming within the next year for my first Elk hunting experience. I am still in the very preliminary stages of preparation. Most of the time when I would be outdoors I would think my rifle would be either carried or at least nearby. But there is a chance I may do some sight seeing/hiking that would not involve my rifle while I am out there.

With that in mind, I would guess most people would recommend 44 magnum as the handgun of choice for that situation. I don't have a 44mag, and dont really want to have to buy one just for that trip.

My choices would be a S&W 686 3" barrel 357 magnum or a Ruger New Vaquero in 45 Colt. I would probably carry 158g cast lead at about 1300 fps if I carry the S&W, or a 250g LSWC hard cast at about 1000 fps if I carry the Ruger.

Which of these loads would be best out there, I guess I am asking about if a bear of something decided to eat me.

 

[FMF Doc]

What it appears you are looking for is what has often been refered to as a "Perfect Packin' Pistol" May I suggest the following THR link as a good starting point.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=590544

In the end, I doubt it will really matter. Any propperly placed shot (CNS hit) of almost any service caliber will kill the bear, and anything less, regarless of caliber will likely not. Personally, I would go with something like a 10mm glock. Atleast then when they find all the brass near your mangled coprse, they will know you put up a good fight.

 

[Leanwolf]

BALROG - "My choices would be a S&W 686 3" barrel 357 magnum or a Ruger New Vaquero in 45 Colt. I would probably carry 158g cast lead at about 1300 fps if I carry the S&W, or a 250g LSWC hard cast at about 1000 fps if I carry the Ruger."

If you're thiinking about defending yourself from a Grizzly with a handgun, I suggest the Ruger in .45 Colt.

If I were in Grizzly country (and I've been there a number of times) and doing some sight seeing, hiking, etc., and had a rifle, I'd carry the rifle.

On the other hand in Grizz country, just lazing around camp, cooking, sawing and chopping firewood, gathering water from the creek, sleeping, etc., etc., I would always have a gun handy and as a sidearm is always with you, I suggest again, the Ruger .45 Colt.

As always, accuracy is everything when shooting at a charging bear.

I don't know where you live nor the altitude of your location, but don't forget packing a heavy pistol and a high power rifle in the Rocky Mountains can get kinda tedious by the end of the day at 9,000' "up in the high country."

Good luck on your hunt.

L.W.

 

[murf]

suggest the 45lc. more momentum/ bigger diameter bullet.

murf

 

[stevelyn]

...........250g LSWC hard cast at about 1000 fps if I carry the Ruger.

I wouldn't feel under-gunned with that.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

I totally agree with the above suggestions on carrying the .45 Colt. It was designed to shoot a horse out from under it's rider. If it can kill a horse it can kill almost anything, after all, a horse is a large and very muscular animal.

 

[CraigC]

....or a 250g LSWC hard cast at about 1000 fps if I carry the Ruger.

Perfect!

 

[svtruth]

Wasn't Elmer Keith from Montana?
If so, .44 magnum is the appropriate choice.
Good luck.

 

[Kachok]

I would take the 45s heavy hardcast bullets over the 357s speed anyday when big dangerous things are in the mix. The 44 mag really is a better choice, but the 45 LC does not have any dust on it either. There are some 45 LC +P loads made by buffalo bore that rival the 44 mags performance, but I am not sure your gun is rated for that kind of pressure.

 

[CraigC]

Elmer Keith was from Salmon, Idaho.

 

[rcmodel]

but I am not sure your gun is rated for that kind of pressure.

It isn't.

But the 250 SWC/1,000 load he mentioned will kill anything that crawls or walks so it should get-R-done.

Besides that, you would be better off using the .45 Colt you have now, and have time to practice with, then buying a bigger gun later and not being as familiar with it.

rc

 

[conrad427]

personally, I would also carry the rifle. If i was in bear country I think it would be .375. If i only had a pistol, I would lean toward a revolver that had a swing out reload if i got off six rounds to little effect. If the bear quit eating me for a while i think a smith and wesson would be easier to reload than a colt copy. probably not a real possibility but I would hate to die for lack of shooting back!

 

[bangaway]

Use the .45 colt as it will serve you better with more knockdown power than the .357. If you use the.357 look at a 180 gr hard cast head. HSM from Stevensville, MT. are making Bear Attack ammo. There are others doing similar loads and with 180 hard cast. Have a good time in Montana. Have fun and bangaway.

 

[Waywatcher]

Both rounds have very comparable sectional density. (0.175 vs 0.177, IIRC) But the .357 has much more velocity. Ballistically, I think it has the edge. You could go 180s, like Buffalo Bore style.

Which are you more proficient with?

I would personally choose the lighter, DA, gun of the two you listed; it's going to be faster into action and have faster follow up shots. Plus you could carry a speedloader to quickly reload.

 

[CraigC]

Even the old blackpowder standard of a 250-260gr cast bullet at 950fps has it all over any .357 load. Bar none.

 

[Brian Williams]

Either gun will be good, My question is;
What kind of rig do you have for either one?

Next ?
How proficient are you with either one?
Can you hit paper plates at distance?
What distance?
What size paper plate?

 

[Balrog]

Either gun will be good, My question is;
What kind of rig do you have for either one?

Next ?
How proficient are you with either one?
Can you hit paper plates at distance?
What distance?
What size paper plate?

All good questions. I am about equally proficient with either, offhand at 25 yds, probably 4" groups with the 45, a little worse with the 357 because of its shorter barrel. Why do you ask?

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Besides that, you would be better off using the .45 Colt you have now, and have time to practice with, then buying a bigger gun later and not being as familiar with it.

rc

Words to live by. The best load in the world will do you no good unless you hit your target.

 

[Brian Williams]

All good questions. I am about equally proficient with either, offhand at 25 yds, probably 4" groups with the 45, a little worse with the 357 because of its shorter barrel. Why do you ask?

Now take either gun to the range and run to the targets pin up new ones and run back to the bench, do a few jumping jacks and using the rig you are going to wear, shoot the same type of target while someone tickles your ear with a feather. Take the one with you that you are the most accurate shooting while enduring this bit of "stress"

What I really want to know is what are you using to carry this gun?

 

[bassdogs]

Ask almost the exact ? regarding a recent trip to rural Alaska. Got almost the exact same comments and suggestions. Most importantly, veterans of bear country point out that an attack most often happens in the blink of an eye with little or no warning. If you can't get to your gun and can't hit your target in less than a couple of seconds, you will most likely be on the ground with a raging bear tearing at your body like a strawberry in a blender. I ended up taking both my 6" 357 with 180gr HCWC and my Judge with 225 gr FNHCWC both from Buffalo Bore. The 357 was in a nice holster rig / belt and the Judge was in a beltloop holster.

Thankfully I didn't need to test either on a big bear but only felt undergunned after returning home and reading of a Brown taken in the general area of one of our stops that weighed in at an estimated 1100lbs ++. Another hunter was mauled withing 10 miles of another overnight campsite. Although serious bear attacks are incredibly rare, I didn't want to be the unlucky one left with no option other than rolling up in a ball.

With all that said, you might want to read the news about the Sept 11 case of a hunter in Montana who died as a result of an attack by a Grizzly and pay particular attention that a later autopsy discovered that he had in fact died of a gunshot fired by his hunting companion who was trying to shoot the bear off his friend. Never forget that a gun is easily as deadly as the Grizzly.

Have since purchased a short barrel Rem 870 12g and will be practicing with slugs for the next visit to bear country next year. Have a great trip.

 

[Mr. T]

I would go with the Ruger in .45 LC with the heaviest hardcast bullets your weapon could handle. The .357 Mag is a good round, but for Grizzly it is not recommended by many people I have consulted with on this very topic in the past. Based on the information I have received from people "in the know" almost to the person, everyone said that the .44 Mag was the minimum that they would consider for something like this. A fair number of them even recommended the .500 S&W round.