My .45 acp handloads are spitting junk out of my 1911 ejection port I cant tell if its' copper from the bullet jackets or un-burnt powder. I switched from Hodgon HP-38 to IMR PB. I use winchester large pistol primers. Before the switch I stopped crimping thinking my crimp was to tight. It doesnt happen as bad when I use expensive bullets but most bulk copper jacket bullets do it and I dont notice it at all with rainer lead safe bullets. Can anyone help? The one thing I notice is a little more than usual copper fouling in and around the slide. Is it my powder? Do I need more pressure to create a more efficient burn? Suggestions????
Handloads spitting junk out of ejection port
- Thread starter walteray
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LiveLife
Member
Could you provide more information?
Make/model of pistol
Bullet make/type/weight (Rainier and new bullet)
Powder charge (Hodgdon HP38 and IMR PB)
Overall Length of loaded round (OAL)
Crimp/diameter of loaded round around bullet
Based on what you wrote, you didn't have problem with Rainier Ballistics copper plated bullets but now you do?
Did you use the same powder/charge for Rainier bullet (Hodgon HP-38) as with the new bullet and IMR PB?
These information will shed some more light.
Make/model of pistol
Bullet make/type/weight (Rainier and new bullet)
Powder charge (Hodgdon HP38 and IMR PB)
Overall Length of loaded round (OAL)
Crimp/diameter of loaded round around bullet
Based on what you wrote, you didn't have problem with Rainier Ballistics copper plated bullets but now you do?
Did you use the same powder/charge for Rainier bullet (Hodgon HP-38) as with the new bullet and IMR PB?
These information will shed some more light.
the pistol is a taurus PT1911
The bullet weights vary but the last four shot were
-cheap 185 gr. "Berrys Bullets"
- Sierra 185 grn HPs
- 185 gr Hornady XTP hp
-the rainers were 200 grn RN.
I Load them all to 5.0 grn (HP-38 and IMR PB)
-OAL is 1 7/32"
Dont have the crimp diameter becuase I dont have anymore crimped rounds left and havnt adjusted that die inawhile, plus my calipers need a cal. but Im all ears to a suggestion becuase I just ordered new calipers
The rainers weren't copper plated they were the gold ones one of my local shops sell them in bulk. But i just bought new 200 grn HPs' and will load and shoot them this weekend. I didnt get the junk out of the XTPs' as bad as the sierras I had and the "Berrys Bullets" which i still have 400 bullets of that crap
The bullet weights vary but the last four shot were
-cheap 185 gr. "Berrys Bullets"
- Sierra 185 grn HPs
- 185 gr Hornady XTP hp
-the rainers were 200 grn RN.
I Load them all to 5.0 grn (HP-38 and IMR PB)
-OAL is 1 7/32"
Dont have the crimp diameter becuase I dont have anymore crimped rounds left and havnt adjusted that die inawhile, plus my calipers need a cal. but Im all ears to a suggestion becuase I just ordered new calipers
The rainers weren't copper plated they were the gold ones one of my local shops sell them in bulk. But i just bought new 200 grn HPs' and will load and shoot them this weekend. I didnt get the junk out of the XTPs' as bad as the sierras I had and the "Berrys Bullets" which i still have 400 bullets of that crap
ArchAngelCD
Member.
The starting charge weight for a 185gr jacketed bullet from the Hodgdon load data site is 5.0gr HP-38 and 5.2gr PB. Usually unburnt powder in an application like this is caused by low pressure. The published max charge of HP-38 for a 185gr bullet is 5.9gr, I would up the charge to at least 5.5gr HP-38 or PB. I also suggest you use a crimp since the 45 Auto headspaces on the mouth of the case and also a slight crimp will aid in building proper pressure.
Maj Dad
Member
Taper Crimp
If you crimp, don't roll crimp. As ArchAngelCD notes, the bullet headspaces on the case mouth, and if you roll it over, the bullet can slip forward over the edge of the rifling & cause failures. Use a taper crimp and you'll be in business. I use them on all of my autos.
If you crimp, don't roll crimp. As ArchAngelCD notes, the bullet headspaces on the case mouth, and if you roll it over, the bullet can slip forward over the edge of the rifling & cause failures. Use a taper crimp and you'll be in business. I use them on all of my autos.
I've got exactly the same deal on mine:
- Dan Wesson PM7
- MBC 200gr LSWC
- 7.8gr AA#5 (published is 7.8 to 8.7)
- taper crimp (.70)
- OAL set by barrel (1.250)
- Wolf primers
I had upped to 8.3gr for 20 or so rounds to see if it helped front-barrel leading (it didn't), but I don't remember if it was "spitting poo out the port".
Just inspected the chamber area (haven't cleaned since last range visit), and though it's hard to tell, it looks like the flakes of powder I see are unburned. Got some PD FMJ on order, but not here to test.
Maybe I should run it up to max load & see wot hoppens?
(Don't want to hijack your thread Walt, but seems like we've the same issue, so might as well get it all in one thread for future readers.)
- Dan Wesson PM7
- MBC 200gr LSWC
- 7.8gr AA#5 (published is 7.8 to 8.7)
- taper crimp (.70)
- OAL set by barrel (1.250)
- Wolf primers
I had upped to 8.3gr for 20 or so rounds to see if it helped front-barrel leading (it didn't), but I don't remember if it was "spitting poo out the port".
Just inspected the chamber area (haven't cleaned since last range visit), and though it's hard to tell, it looks like the flakes of powder I see are unburned. Got some PD FMJ on order, but not here to test.
Maybe I should run it up to max load & see wot hoppens?
(Don't want to hijack your thread Walt, but seems like we've the same issue, so might as well get it all in one thread for future readers.)
The Bushmaster
Member
Junk? Spitting? You need to be more specific as to what kind of junk.
The Bushmaster
Member
Too slow burning powder or too low powder charge or bad powder or bad reloading procedures (such as moisture/oil in case)...
Dont worry about the hi-jack FX the more info I can get or we can get out there will help and your right its junk like specks of grit any of those in the military recently might remember sand storms over there just like that feeling. I can see what looks like specs of copper in and around my ejection port and the sides of my cases will have a slight char color almost like taking i lighter to the one side of the case around the mouth and half way down one side of the case. Sorry this is probably a major detail I just remembered( i just dumped some brass into the tumbler.
The dies I have are LEE and it has a crimping die with it does anyone know if its a taper crimp or roll crimp? this probably sounds amatuer but prior to owning a .45 the only thing i re-loaded was .308 with a hand press and I still only crimp my Barnes' and leave my sierras alone
The dies I have are LEE and it has a crimping die with it does anyone know if its a taper crimp or roll crimp? this probably sounds amatuer but prior to owning a .45 the only thing i re-loaded was .308 with a hand press and I still only crimp my Barnes' and leave my sierras alone
I didnt know that joustin, I knew they were plated but wasnt aware that it would make a difference in my charge thanks for the tip, and mcgred no tumbling media, i put them all in a charging block look inside and after about 20 charges are thrown I look into them all for variations (double charge or something) and seat bullets on those twenty.
FX I look forward to your results, Ill try to load about 16 each of my hornady XTPs, the berrys (with an adjusted lead load), and the new 200 grn rainer hps' and if the wife lets me out to play i'll try to shoot tomorrow and post changes ( I'll crimp all of these also)
FX I look forward to your results, Ill try to load about 16 each of my hornady XTPs, the berrys (with an adjusted lead load), and the new 200 grn rainer hps' and if the wife lets me out to play i'll try to shoot tomorrow and post changes ( I'll crimp all of these also)
bullseye308
Member
Have you checked the diameter of the bullets? I was also gonna ask about maybe a tight match chamber but you said taurus 
I like taurus, but that is the way it came out as it got typed.
I like taurus, but that is the way it came out as it got typed.
You know it might be that fancy match barrel on it... Nah the gun is nothing special but for the price its really stood up to the abuse I carry it every single day except to and from work and has about 5k rounds through it, Im going through all this work trying to get these loads right becuase it is time for a new barrel... my calipers are broken and when the new ones get here in a few days ill check the diameter and repost unloaded they are .451 on the FTXs and not sure abou the rainers or berrys yet
sonick808
Member
the fact that it never happens with softer bullets makes me think your crimp might be light when dealing with the thicker copper jackets. Rainier plated are easy to get a great seal with. Traditional FMJ needs more pressure on the crimp, especially with no cannelure.
How heavy is your crimp ? Lee factory crimp or the combo seating/crimp die included with the set ? Do you use the same charge with the rainier that you do with traditional FMJ ? If so, it sounds more and more like low pressure on the FMJ. The plated lead sound close to perfect.
Have you inspected the primer and case for symptoms ?
Re-assess your recipe for each bullet and crimp for bullet type
How heavy is your crimp ? Lee factory crimp or the combo seating/crimp die included with the set ? Do you use the same charge with the rainier that you do with traditional FMJ ? If so, it sounds more and more like low pressure on the FMJ. The plated lead sound close to perfect.
Have you inspected the primer and case for symptoms ?
Re-assess your recipe for each bullet and crimp for bullet type
The Bushmaster
Member
.45 ACP relies on bullet to case tension. Not crimp. If you are trying to put a heavy crimp on any .45 ACP bullet you are looking for more trouble. Like having the cartridge travel too far into the chamber to where the firing pin can't reach it. That and over crimping can and will lessen the bullet to case tension [which, by the way, might be your problem]...
Crimp the .45 ACP or any cartridge that head spaces on the case mouth. With no more crimp then to remove the bell. No more, no less.
Crimp the .45 ACP or any cartridge that head spaces on the case mouth. With no more crimp then to remove the bell. No more, no less.
sonick808
Member
hmmm. the lee factory crimp die could be used though yes ? It doesn't affect the headspacing regardless of how aggressive you set it.... supposedly...... the included seating/crimp die probably could affect headspacing though
It can if you crimp too much. It will move the case mouth in too far, as can any crimp die if adjusted down too far.
As The Bushmaster stated, neck tension does the job of holding the bullet. The "crimp" is just to remove the bell, and a hair more. Since I don't trim .45 ACP like The Bushmaster does, I have my crimp die adjusted so that the shortest cases get the bell removed fully, while the longest will get crimped in .001 or .002 at the most. (Actually measured it the other day. Been eyeballing it for years with a loupe)
As The Bushmaster stated, neck tension does the job of holding the bullet. The "crimp" is just to remove the bell, and a hair more. Since I don't trim .45 ACP like The Bushmaster does, I have my crimp die adjusted so that the shortest cases get the bell removed fully, while the longest will get crimped in .001 or .002 at the most. (Actually measured it the other day. Been eyeballing it for years with a loupe)
243winxb
Member
Use Alliant Bullseye, end of spitting.
To answer one question it is the factory crimp die.
And to ask one more so the solution seems to be to try another power and to crimp my
Jacketed bullets a little more?
Ill swith to alliant or to AA apply a crimp and try them out 25 of the new rainers and 25 of the XTPs and 25 of the berrys and I'll post the results hopefully this weekend
And to ask one more so the solution seems to be to try another power and to crimp my
Jacketed bullets a little more?
Ill swith to alliant or to AA apply a crimp and try them out 25 of the new rainers and 25 of the XTPs and 25 of the berrys and I'll post the results hopefully this weekend
ArchAngelCD
Member.
walteray,
No reason to switch to another powder considering you already have a very good powder for the .45 Auto. HP-38/W231 is my goto powder for the .45 Auto. I charge 5.5gr W231/HP-38 under a 230gr bullet, both lead and jacketed and never have unburnt powder. The ammo that load produces is also very accurate. I'm not saying AA#5 is a bad powder for the .45 Auto, after all, it was developed specifically for the .45 Auto but there's nothing wrong with W231/HP-38 either. Just up the charge of HP-38 and you will be fine...
No reason to switch to another powder considering you already have a very good powder for the .45 Auto. HP-38/W231 is my goto powder for the .45 Auto. I charge 5.5gr W231/HP-38 under a 230gr bullet, both lead and jacketed and never have unburnt powder. The ammo that load produces is also very accurate. I'm not saying AA#5 is a bad powder for the .45 Auto, after all, it was developed specifically for the .45 Auto but there's nothing wrong with W231/HP-38 either. Just up the charge of HP-38 and you will be fine...
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