has any company ever made a pistol designed specifically for 10 rounds to sell in CA?

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roscoe

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I have a Shield that I like a lot, but it occurred to me that with just a bit of squeezing of sizes of the grip frame, there is probably room for 10 rounds, slightly staggered. I am surprised that S&W didn't adjust the spacing .05" to make it a CA-tailored pistol. It seems like a big market but I am not aware of anyone targeting it.

Has any company ever made a 10-round gun design for CA? And let's stick to gun design, and avoid political venting.
 
I'm pretty limited as far as what I'm familiar with in pistols. The ones that came to mind in sub compact is the HK P2000SK and Glock 26, staggered mag, 10 rounds.

If AB2733 passes the microstamping scenario we've had may not be an issue for us.
 
I have had that very though when I look at my PK380. I looks like it was designed for a double stack magazine; then, later in the design process, they changed it to a single stack. It may have been to keep the, loaded, weight down; but I doubt that.
That being said, this id not something I can document; however, the gun looks that way.
 
Not that they were made specifically for that market, but the SCCY CPX-series, the Kel-Tec P-11, and the new SiG P365 all meet that round capacity.

Are you asking about models that have had versions altered for that market? I don't see any makers actually increasing a magazine capacity for such a market.
 
I'm sure they weren't specifically designed for the California limited capacity market, but there are a bunch of .45 caliber guns with 10 round mags. S&W M&P 45, HK45, Glock 37 (.45 GAP), Glock 30, Beretta PX4, CZ 97, EAA Witness (Tanfoglio), etc.
 
Hasaf said:
I have had that very though when I look at my PK380. I looks like it was designed for a double stack magazine; then, later in the design process, they changed it to a single stack. It may have been to keep the, loaded, weight down; but I doubt that.
That being said, this id not something I can document; however, the gun looks that way.
Click to expand...

I had a pk380 and I thought the same thing, this pistol could easily be a double stack but they didn't for some reason.
 
Is it possible to introduce any NEW gun into California? I thought unless they are already on the "list" they had to include micro stamping.
 
roscoe said:
I have a Shield that I like a lot, but it occurred to me that with just a bit of squeezing of sizes of the grip frame, there is probably room for 10 rounds, slightly staggered. I am surprised that S&W didn't adjust the spacing .05" to make it a CA-tailored pistol. It seems like a big market but I am not aware of anyone targeting it.

Has any company ever made a 10-round gun design for CA? And let's stick to gun design, and avoid political venting.
Click to expand...

No, not that I'm aware of. There are other states that also limit mag capacity to 10 rounds and that have done so for about as long as Ca. has. This helped give birth to the growth of the CCW market. The impulse being that if you were going to limit the number of rounds in a gun why not also make it smaller and easier to conceal. This led to the rejuvenation of the single stack 9s that began some years back. But that wasn't just in response to California.

The laws in Ca.had other features that have made it an expensive obstacle to some manufacturers to meet.

It has been easier to simply limit the number of rounds that can be loaded in a mag rather than redesign a gun for only 10 rounds.
 
One of the reasons I had this thought is that several firearms I know of are 13-15 rounds for 9mm, but 10 for .40. It seemed like a strange coincidence.
 
roscoe said:
One of the reasons I had this thought is that several firearms I know of are 13-15 rounds for 9mm, but 10 for .40. It seemed like a strange coincidence.
Click to expand...

I believe that has more to do with producing the same sized gun in both 9mm and 40 S&W. Fewer rounds of 40 will fit. I think that also varies for manufacturers. For example the S&W M&P will take 15 rounds of 9mm but 13 rounds of 40 S&W in a standard mag. The Glock 19 will accept 15 rds. of 9mm and the G23 13 of 40. That's about average. for guns of the same general size.

https://us.glock.com/products/model/g23gen4

https://www.smith-wesson.com/brands/mp

So if you see a pistol that will take 15 rounds of 9mm but only 10 of 40 it's either because of the design of the gun or it has a mag in it for 10 round states.
 
340PD said:
Is it possible to introduce any NEW gun into California? I thought unless they are already on the "list" they had to include micro stamping.
Click to expand...

It is not possible to introduce a new gun into California for sale to the law abiding public. You are correct that a new gun must prove it can perform the impossible micro stamping which is precisely what the anti-gun politicians wanted from the law. Only LEO's who supported this law can buy and then resell to the public any new off-roster gun.

New guns include any old guns with newly manufactured components such as an MIM trigger part that replaces a machined part. When that happens, the gun suddenly becomes unsafe and must be re-qualified which includes micro stamping.

This is part of the "reasonable conversation" that comes with gun control.
 
JTQ said:
Just for clarity, that is an M&P 2.0 Compact capacity not an M&P 9/40 capacity. I know you properly linked to it, but the post text could cause confusion.
Click to expand...

I compared the compact Glock 19 to the compact M&P. Here you can compare the full size M&P 9 to the M&P 40. 17 rounds of 9mm to 15 rounds of 40S&W.

https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/mp-9-m20-no-thumb-safety-flat-dark-earth

https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/mp-40-m20-no-thumb-safety-flat-dark-earth

We can compare to the Mass. compliant version which is also limited to 10 rounds:

https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/mp-40-m20-ma-compliant
 
tipoc said:
I compared the compact Glock 19 to the compact M&P. Here you can compare the full size M&P 9 to the M&P 40. 17 rounds of 9mm to 15 rounds of 40S&W.

https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/mp-9-m20-no-thumb-safety-flat-dark-earth

https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/mp-40-m20-no-thumb-safety-flat-dark-earth

We can compare to the Mass. compliant version which is also limited to 10 rounds:

https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/mp-40-m20-ma-compliant
Click to expand...
I have a lot of confidence you know what you're talking about. My point was just clarification for those not familiar with the product line since S&W has somewhat confused the market with their terminology and the text of your original post didn't specify 1.0 vs 2.0 or full size or Compact, even though your link was to the 2.0 Compact and the correct capacity was referenced.

S&W has both an M&P 1.0 and 2.0 in full size which are the same size/capacity guns, and an M&P 1.0 and 2.0 Compacts which are different size guns with different capacities. If you say M&P Compact, and don't specify 1.0 or 2.0 you could be talking about completely different guns.
 
S&W makes the M&P compact which I believe is 10 rounds, also more expensive than the shield. Most if not all current production "hi-caps" like Glock, S&W,etc. have 10 rd mags available, and are even sold with the option of having those (edited) mags included with the pistol from the factory.
 
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Ruger SR9c holds 10 rounds. The extended magazine gives you 17 but the one that fits flush with the frame only holds 10.
As far as the OP saying with a bit of tweaking the Shield could have been made to hold 10. Well sure but then it would be either fatter or have a longer grip and then it wouldn't be the size that has made it so popular.
 
The Glock 26 was the original 10 round design which was introduced just after the 1994 "Assault Weapons Ban" limited new magazines nationwide to a 10 round capacity.
 
When the original 1994 AWB passed it limited new guns to 10 round capacity. Lots of guns were made shortly after that sized around the 10 round limit. This is also when the 40 S&W gained popularity. At the time most 9mm pistols were designed to hold 15 rounds, most 40's 11 rounds. If limited to 10 rounds in the same size pistol a lot of guys chose the 40. After the ban was allowed to expire 9mm has really come on and hurt 40 sales.
 
As rsrocket1 posted above no new semi autos will be marketed in California because of the micro stamping requirement for new guns. None of the manufacturers are or will be making guns that include this so called technology. So it really doesn't matter how many rounds the gun holds the gun can't be put on the California safe gun roster.
 
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I would say any 1911 manufacturer...

Other than that... I don't know of any company that specifically designed a pistol around CA dopey capacity laws.

Seeing as how the number 10 is arbitrary and completely pulled out of a politician's posterior.
This would suggest that it could be changed to any other number. Say like 7 (looking at you NY) or 6?!

I don't foresee a company designing products around the whims of politicians.
 
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