Have you ever taken a blood test to see if your lead level was high?

[Rockrivr1]

One of the guys I shoot USPSA practice with just got a blood test and his lead level is high. The doctor has told him he should stay away from shooting for a month, prescribed chemet and told him to take as much vitamin B and C he can stomach. Once the month is over he needs to go back in and get re-tested.

I would never think to get a blood test for this. During the winter we do shoot a lot indoors and he attended a large indoor match that lasted most of the day.

I didn't ask him, but what exactly would be the symptoms of lead poisoning? I'm also wondering what the long term effect, short of cancer, this could lead to. I know he indicated it could cause problems for him and his wife to conceave. Geez!

How many of you have ever been tested for this? I'm thinking I should get this done just to see.

 

[hso]

What was "high" according to the doc? Anything over 7 micrograms/deciliter could be considered "high" without being a risk. Anything approaching 25 micrograms/deciliter is high while anything above 35 micrograms/deciliter would call for immediate removal from the source of exposure.

BTW, Lead exposure has been discussed extensively in the past several months.

The search function is your friend.

Acute Effects - tingling sensations, muscle weakness, excessive bleeding, irritability, insomnia, memory loss, nausea, abdominal pain, vomiting, (and the big attention getter) IMPOTENCE.

In severe cases:
Brain and/or kidney damage
Coma
Convulsions
Death

How can lead affect my health?

The effects of lead are the same whether it enters the body through breathing or swallowing. Lead can affect almost every organ and system in your body. The main target for lead toxicity is the nervous system, both in adults and children. Long-term exposure of adults can result in decreased performance in some tests that measure functions of the nervous system. It may also cause weakness in fingers, wrists, or ankles. Lead exposure also causes small increases in blood pressure, particularly in middle-aged and older people and can cause anemia. Exposure to high lead levels can severely damage the brain and kidneys in adults or children and ultimately cause death. In pregnant women, high levels of exposure to lead may cause miscarriage. High-level exposure in men can damage the organs responsible for sperm production.

http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/tfacts13.html

 

[Carl N. Brown]

I did stop eating, drinking, and smoking while cleaning guns
and reloading ammunition with exposed lead bullets.
And I started washing my hands after any lead-exposure.

And remember kids, "biting the bullet" is just a figure of speech.

And not smoking around open powder containers is also a
handy safety tip from your nagging safety nanny, moi.

 

[Rockrivr1]

Thanks for the info. Didn't realize it was thoroughly discussed. As I said, I never even thought about it until he indicated his level was high.

His level was 48. Going by the levels indicated in your post, 48 is really bad.

 

[Sistema1927]

One of my CCW instructors mentioned that he had quit casting due to a higher than normal blood lead level. He was a retired Air Force Flight Surgeon, and was very concientous about his health.

A couple of months later, he contracted West Nile Virus, and died.

Very sad.

 

[hso]

His level was 48. Going by the levels indicated in your post, 48 is really bad.

Yup, that's high and that would take a while to drop unless he chelates. Any idea what his ZPP was?

 

[Rockrivr1]

I'll have to ask him about what his ZZP was. He just indicated his number was 48. He didn't go into detail about it other then he wasn't going to be shooting for a while.

 

[Kramer Krazy]

Hmmm....I answered yes, but it wasn't gun-related. I used to work for Yuasa-Exide, a lead-acid battery manufacturer, and having your blood tested is a federal law under one of the CFR's. I've never had it checked since I left the company, though....

I started working working there with a level of 6 or 9 mg/dl and had it hit 42 once. The higher the number, the more frequently we were tested. Also, if you got over 40, they'd pull you out of your work area. Over 50, and you got to work a front desk job until it came back down......pregnant women automatically got desk jobs......

 

[hso]

Hmmm....I answered yes, but it wasn't gun-related. I used to work for Yuasa-Exide, a lead-acid battery manufacturer, and having your blood tested is a federal law under one of the CFR's. I've never had it checked since I left the company, though....

29CFR1910.1025 (I'm such a geek )

If you break a bone or have a sudden weight loss you will see your blood lead levels spike up as the lead is released from those two storage 'sites'.

The higher the number, the more frequently we were tested. Also, if you got over 40, they'd pull you out of your work area.

Did they every do anything other than blls like provide ventilation or require respirators or did they just test and reassign?

The classic story on lead exposure is from a battery facility. If fellas got sort of irratable and hostile in the melting/forming area they were punished by being sent to the bust'n up area where car batteries were broken open with sledge hammers. Once they "sweated out the meanness" (i.e. worked until the bll dropped low enough for the symptoms of overexposure went away) they rotated back into the melting/forming area where a "fresh" crop of angry men were ready to go to the hammers.:banghead:

 

[Brian Williams]

I had mine tested in Sept and it was 4.2 IIRC.

 

[AZ Jeff]

Taken from THE ASLET JOURNAL, March/April 1990
(American Society of Law Enforcement Trainers)

The following is a partial list of common symptoms of lead poisoning, and symptoms that appear in any individual will vary. Furthermore, a lead level that produces only moderate problems in one individual may prove lethal to another:
1. Loss of memory, and difficulty in concentration. This is frequently the first symptom seen.
2. Fatigue. This can become profound and incapacitating.
3. Irritability and aggressiveness.
4. Loss of sexual interest. Impotence.
5. Insomnia. (Which greatly complicates the fatigue.)
6. Depression.
7. Headaches.
8. Neurological symptoms, such as hand twitching.
9. Encephalopathy. This is the medical term for major brain dysfunction (actually, all of the above are symptoms of central nervous system problems). This can manifest itself as loss of function or paralysis in a limb, confusion, disorientation, loss of coordination, or the symptoms of several forms of insanity. (Lead poisoning probably contributed to the insanity of several of the Roman Ceasars, and contributed to the fall of the empire. The Roman upper classes boiled their wine in lead-lined pots. This sweetened the wine, and made it resistant to souring by yeast. Bones recovered from graves of Roman nobility have shown phenomenal lead contents.)
10. Elevated blood pressure.
11. Digestive difficulties and abdominal pains.
12. Weight loss.
13. Joint pains, particularly in the joints of the long bones, like the wrists.
14. Anemia.
15. In women, menstrual irregularity and decreased fertility. (Again, lead poisoning may have been responsible for the documented dramatic decrease in fertility among the Roman nobility and upper classes.)
16. Kidney damage and/or liver damage.
17. Sore or bleeding gums around the margin of the gum and tooth.
18. In children, retarded intellectual development, behavioral problems, as well as most of the other problems listed above.

 

[Moonclip]

[QUOTE=
Loss of sexual interest. Impotence.


I guess I'm pretty much lead free Though seriously I should be tested I suppose. I am more careful about lead now and shoot less than I used to but I am concerned about lead buildup from previous years as I have heard it takes a long time to leave the body.

 

[HSMITH]

I just got tested, number was 27. Haven't been casting for over a year, and stopped pounding lead bullets at the indoor range about 6 months ago. Makes me wonder what it was when I was casting and shooting 4-6 thousand bullets per month......

Now that I know it is high I am going to take some special precautions. Dirty tumbler media is going out, clean fresh media is coming in and will be changed regularly. Lead bullets are going to be left alone for a while. Indoor range shooting will be almost none, and all JHP or TMJ used when I do. Reloading will be all jacketed bullets. And finally I will pay very close attention to scrubbing up, changing clothes and blowing my nose well after any potential contact with lead.

 

[lee n. field]

I got my bloodlead tested once lead tested once, when I was trying to track down some odd symptoms, and after a finger prick test read high. My blood lead was actually low

 

[Jeff22]

lead testing

I've been tested twice. I was a "13" the first time (1993) and an "11" the second time, and I haven't been tested since my last military physical in 1998.

But I have a physical scheduled in late March and I'm having my lead level tested again along with all the other blood work.

I've known a couple of guys who required medical treatment for high levels of lead in their blood. One was a commercial reloader who used to cast his own bullets. The other was a police firearms instructor who worked 4 days a week in a poorly ventilated circa 1955 indoor range.

The reloader now buys his bullets, the old indoor range is long gone, and the cop has been retired for five years with no lasting effects . . .

 

[peteinct]

Hi, I was tested and my levels were found to be slightly high. I had the doctor add it to some other blood tests being done. He said the numbers were a little high but not enough to worry about. It was from shooting at a poorly ventilated indoor range. So I stopped going there and found an outdoor range.
It isn't just solid lead that can get into your blood. If you wash your hands and don't smoke while shooting you should be ok. In the smoke from the primer there is lead and that is inhaled which is an easy way into your system. Sweeping up the floor on an indoor range stirs up clouds of lead dust which can then be inhaled.You can also bring it home with you on you clothes so be careful esp.if you have little kids it affects them more than adults.
pete

 

[Kramer Krazy]

29CFR1910.1025 (I'm such a geek )
<snip>
Did they every do anything other than blls like provide ventilation or require respirators or did they just test and reassign?...

I was going to state the CFR number, but didn't think anyone else would know it.

We had quite an elaborate array or baghouses and wetscrubbers (I conducted weekly and monthly checks on them). Each work station had it's own ventilation system which was checked with a flowmeter, also. Employees were given work uniforms that could not leave the property, access to your vehicle was limited if wearing your uniform....boots, gloves, respirators, headgear, and other PPE were provided.....the company paid you for 18 minutes at the end of each day to take a MANDATORY shower........there were a LOT of things that they did to try to keep the employees, safe. Additional PPE was required as your lead levels went up, but at those upper limits, you were pulled out of the work area.

 

[Rockrivr1]

Let me ask a question here. When cleaning my guns I always use CLP and I've never used plastic glove. But I have been thinking of starting. I'm sure there is a lot of lead that is now on my hands along with the CLP. This may be a stupid question, but is there any way lead can be absorbed through the skin with help from gun cleaners? I'm thinking no, but I'm not sure?

 

[peteinct]

Rock, I don't know if the cleaner could tramsport the chemicals through your skin but it is easy for a person to convey the chemical to their mouth without realizing it. Through your skin is a hard way to get exposed. It is easier for the stuff to get in through the holes in your skin such as your mouth or lungs or eyes. I think that if you are using a solvent cleaner you need to to worry more about that stuff giving you cancer if you aren't wearing gloves than lead.
pete

 

[mp510]

I got myself tested once a couple years ago, but despite shooting at indoor ranges, my lead level was in the normal range. Haven't thought about it since.

 

[BigRobT]

It doesn't look like Break Free CLP is all that toxic or posseses any known carcinogins. The MSDS can be found here:
http://www.wfrfire.com/website/msds/break.htm

Hoppes #9 solvent might need some extra care when used:
http://www.emedco.com/emed2/resource/msds/msds_view.asp?pd=ca&pf=cftjh

 

[peteinct]

Chemicals are like guns

Just as an aside Chemicals are like guns in that they carry a risk in their use.
any cleaner, which are basically solvents, that is strong enough to do a good job is strong enough to mess you up if you are exposed enough.If a cleaner is advertised as being safe I feel it is generally worthless. That's why modern cleaners don't do as good a job as the old ones they have been neutered in the name of safety.
pete

 

[BigRobT]

Just as an aside Chemicals are like guns in that they carry a risk in their use.
any cleaner, which are basically solvents, that is strong enough to do a good job is strong enough to mess you up if you are exposed enough.If a cleaner is advertised as being safe I feel it is generally worthless. That's why modern cleaners don't do as good a job as the old ones they have been neutered in the name of safety.
pete

They may not do as good of a job and for some applications, they are essentially worthless. But.......the known risks of the associated toxic effects on things like trichlorotrifluoroethane, (an electronics cleaner) are pretty extensive. When I was USN, we would play with that stuff. Turns out, that stuff could cause severe kidney damage. If you recall, the old style brake cleaner worked REALLY well, but it was pulled from the shelves because it caused cancer (or could).

 

[Justin]

This is a good topic, and one worth bringing up regularly.

I generally shoot twice a week at an indoor range, and lead contamination is something of a concern.

It's also the reason for why I now wear latex surgical gloves when cleaning guns.

 

[hso]

Let me ask a question here. When cleaning my guns I always use CLP and I've never used plastic glove. But I have been thinking of starting. I'm sure there is a lot of lead that is now on my hands along with the CLP. This may be a stupid question, but is there any way lead can be absorbed through the skin with help from gun cleaners? I'm thinking no, but I'm not sure?

Yep. Some forms of lead are capable of being absorbed through the skin directly, but you'd be dealing with the oxide instead of one of the salts. OTOH if you've got chapped/cracked skin this provides a direct pathway into the body (and we all know how most cleaners dry the skin)

If you want to wear gloves get the nitrile exam gloves available at the pharmacy or Granger or Home Depot. Wear 2 pair and toss the outer pair into the trash when you're done and clean up the work area while still wearing the inner pair. Don't reuse them, just toss them. Don't get latex.