Help? .38 158gr discrepancies. OAL and crimp height etc

[Sabre01]

If I may ask this question...I know it is Soooo common. first off.. Gun Sp101 ruger .357 3" barrel
Unique powder..got 3 different loads from 3 different manuals..am settling on 4.5 or 4.6 . Max. I've seen is 5.1gr would be happy w/ 4.5.
158 grain bullets. Lead RNFP .358 dia. will be loading .38 Brass
The main problem I have, after research is: old Hornady book says 1.475 OAL, New Speer Book says 1.510 OAL, other published data I saw here says 1.450 OAL..yikes...I dont want to load this too short, As This Will Increase pressures, Correct? It's Tough because being a .357 cal They will all fit, so I know it will chamber. :banghead: The Books also have load data that don't jive, the old Horny^ad book is Conservative(1990) @ Max load says 4.4.
The New Speer says 4.7 Max and gives .38+p data max @ 5.2
I am New at this, but consider myself Fairly intelligent, and I have done alot of Research BEFORE buying my equip...which , by the way Is an RCBS Turret. Carbide Dies(RCBS) for both 9mm and .38. If any of you all can help, or direct me to some sound advice, mostly on Crimp and COL Thank you in advance....

 

[mbopp]

Are you using cast bullets with a crimp groove? If so, you'll want a light crimp in the crimp groove and the OAL is what it is - it's set by the bullet design.
As far as the charge weights - welcome to reloading! Different cases, bullets, and primers will make a difference along with the test equipment used. You're not going to get in trouble with 4.5gr of Unique in a 38 Spl.

 

[Sabre01]

Thank you mbopp...it has a "ledge" just down from the nose of the bullet, the groove is just below it...I did assume, that no matter what, thats where i crimped it, but always safe to ask! I try to pay attention to details, though, guns are expensive and body parts are irreplacable...I look forward to my newest hobby!

 

[Sabre01]

and yes..I am new here ,and am currently reviewing the Stickies and posts regarding this issue..anyone who wants to add to this, please do...I think we are all "info" junkies or we wouldn't be here, or in this hobby for that matter...

 

[armoredman]

With cast, and the very generous case volume of the 38 special, I wouldn't sweat it too much on those small variations of COAL. I load my cast 158 grain LSWC to 1.40, btw, over AA# 2, right to, as posted above, the crimp groove.

 

[Walkalong]

http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=5871460&postcount=30

http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=5873477&postcount=32

http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=6257173&postcount=50

http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=6657919&postcount=83

Here are some crimp pics showing a proper crimp into a crimp groove on lead bullets. Set your O.A.L. so the crimp will be in the crimp groove. That is the proper O.A.L. for that bullet.

Hope this helps. AC

Welcome to THR.

 

[Steve C]

yikes...I dont want to load this too short, As This Will Increase pressures, Correct?

The affect of OAL on pressure is over exaggerated by individuals that have taken a little information published in the Speer manual regarding the small volume 9mm with some "unnamed" powder that produced much higher pressures with relatively small changes in OAL and interpret it to be a truism applicable to all cartridges and powders. It is true that under some narrowly defined conditions a change in OAL could increase pressure beyond safe limits however it is also true that such warning doesn't appear in the manuals for any other cartridge so under the greatest majority of reloading component combination the OAL and pressure relationship is not a safety issue by itself.

OAL is more important with the regards to ammo that will fit the chambers and magazines of most firearms as manuals usually list max OAL and sometimes min OAL, or OAL tested, none of winch are absolutes.

Loading the .38 spl with a 158gr lead bullet you will not even begin to approach the pressure of the .357 magnum with any published load and since you plan on shooting them in a .357 mag pistol you have a huge safety margin. When you work up loads with the .38 spl which is a lower pressure cartridge to begin with the work up is to find accuracy for your particular pistol or for some other property like low recoil. Its pointless to even look for pressure signs even at max published loads.

As others have said, crimp the bullet in the provided groove and OAL will take care of itself.

 

[Hondo 60]

mbopp gave good advice.
I prefer bullets with a cannelure (the technical name for the crimp groove)
That way there's no question about the OAL.

Every gun is different, so try several different powder drops. You may find that 0.1 grain difference is the exact right amount for you.

Welcome to THR & welcome to the addiction!

 

[rcmodel]

old Hornady book says 1.475 OAL, New Speer Book says 1.510 OAL, other published data I saw here says 1.450 OAL..yikes...

That's because three different bullets, with three different crimp groove or cannulure locations, were used in the three different reloading manuals.

As others have said, seat to the crimp groove.
That is the correct COL for the bullets you are using.

I don't even bother measuring revolver loads for COL.

They just are what they are, and there is nothing you can do about it unless you use a different bullet design.

rc

 

[Sabre01]

ok, i loaded up 50 to "test" at the range, they worked fine, not overpowered, shoot straight, will stick with this recipe for now, and the 'lil woman likes 'em, and if that gets her to shoot more, than it's a good thing..I could always add some powder, but don't feel the need, if I want more I'll load up some +p loads, but these will work for now, Thanks to all for your input!!