Help me understand the value of a short reset trigger, please.

[UKWildcatFan]

I'm somewhat new to firearms, but I've heard a lot lately about short reset triggers. I can understand this for a target gun, but fine motor skills are largely nonexistent at 2:13am when the trouble comes. I just need help understanding the value of them. Help me, please. Oh, and I'm coming with no attitude, so please hold the condescending/smart remarks. Thanks a lot for the info in advance, folks.

 

[Stony]

I can remember years ago with my first 226 sig I bought, practicing some rapid fire drills. Occasionally I wouldn't release the trigger enough to get it reset and it stopped me right there as I tried to figure out what was wrong with it. A short reset trigger can be a real value in a pistol you need to rely on.

 

[4thPointOfContact]

Classic risk v benefits analysis case.

What are the cons associated with a trigger resetting with only short travel
versus
the cons associated with a trigger that has a long travel to require resetting?



Note that a short reset trigger is not a lightened trigger, and is only in play after the firearm has been shot the first time. A 5lb trigger is still a 5.b trigger regardless of short or long reset.

 

[bannockburn]

The short reset trigger only shortens the reset in the single action mode. I believe SIG states that the reset travel is reduced by about 60% over the standard trigger design. It also doesn't change the single action pull weight. It just means faster follow up shots because the trigger is resetting quicker. I have had an older P226 and P228, and a newer P229 E2 which has the SRT and I definitely notice the difference in their respective triggers.

 

[MrBorland]

I can understand this for a target gun, but fine motor skills are largely nonexistent at 2:13am when the trouble comes. I just need help understanding the value of them.

I think you're on the right track, and personally, I think too much is made of reset.

DukeBlueDevilFan

It just means faster follow up shots because the trigger is resetting quicker.

This is what's commonly thought, because it intuitively makes sense, but it ain't so. It takes too long and too much fine dexterity to let out the trigger "just so". The top competitive shooters all get off the trigger on the return, not giving a wit about reset.

 

[rcmodel]

A short re-set?
It prevents short-stroking the trigger in a gun fight because your pucker factor was to tight to let the trigger go all the way foreword to re-set for the next shot.

So you can't shoot the next shot, until you finally let the trigger go all the way forward to re-set again.

It is a very good thing to have on a fighting handgun.
Don't question it.


Rc

 

[rswartsell]

I agree with rcmodel, and that's the way I've understood it. A predominately gunfight feature important only on weapons forseen to be in that role. This isn't the direct parallel of an old bulls-eye revolver over-travel screw.

 

[PabloJ]

Me thinks good idea if clunker pistola makes click when trigger pulled a lot on live cartridges.

 

[JohnKSa]

If your fine motor skills are not functioning, a short reset is very unlikely to cause any problems. At the range, a short reset can be a speed advantage.

A very long reset requires more trigger finger movement which can slow you down at the range if you shoot from the reset. And, I suppose it can increase the possibility of short-stroking the trigger in a crisis situation.

 

[Inebriated]

Quicker follow up shots/less wasted movement.

Shooting from reset is not really a fine motor skill, it's muscle memory.

 

[9mmepiphany]

I just need help understanding the value of them.

In a defensive or competitive situation, they are of limited value unless you have the training to take advantage of it. The interesting thing is that the higher you skill level, the less important it is. The following is correct:

It just means faster follow up shots because the trigger is resetting quicker.

This is what's commonly thought, because it intuitively makes sense, but it ain't so. It takes too long and too much fine dexterity to let out the trigger "just so". The top competitive shooters all get off the trigger on the return, not giving a wit about reset.

...as is this:

Shooting from reset is not really a fine motor skill, it's muscle memory.

A very long reset requires more trigger finger movement which can slow you down at the range if you shoot from the reset.

This is only true, if you are resetting your trigger is series as opposed to in parallel.

Faster shooters, in competition, are all resetting their triggers in parallel and have the trigger reset and have taken up the slack prior to the sights returning onto the target.

Where a trigger with a shorter reset really helps is on a gun with almost no muzzle flip (think a compensated pistol) where speed back onto target is less of a factor.

 

[LocoGringo]

Quicker follow up shots/less wasted movement.

Shooting from reset is not really a fine motor skill, it's muscle memory.

This right here is the answer. Speaking from an AR-15 rifle reset trigger experience in 3-gun competition, I've got a quick story. I was accustomed to shooting my 3-gun rifle equipped with a Timney trigger. Once, I decided to shoot my SBR equipped with a CMC trigger that had a longer trigger reset than the Timney. Twice during the same match I short-stroked the reset on the trigger and had to fully release the trigger a second time to allow it to reset. It cost me time on the stages and I would imagine it could affect things in a defensive/stressful situation as well. Competition is a type of stress that is induced (artificially) because of the clock. It's not life or death like a defensive situation, but it mimics stress and can show problems or deficiencies.

If you don't know the difference or shoot enough to know to be able to tell the difference, it's probably a non-issue. However, if you do shoot enough to know, it's obvious.

 

[CZ9shooter]

My pf9 has a looong DA only trigger pull, and subsequently long reset. I have, in fact, short stroked it a time or two at the range. Especially after shooting SA guns with short, crisp trigger resets. It is still a new-to-me gun, so I am sure time and practice will result in proficiency. However, this experience clearly spells out the advantages of a short resetting trigger.

 

[JohnKSa]

Faster shooters, in competition, are all resetting their triggers in parallel and have the trigger reset and have taken up the slack prior to the sights returning onto the target.

While that's true, it's an answer that has very little practical utility to someone new to firearms asking basic questions about trigger function.

 

[9mmepiphany]

You're right.

It was offered as more of a tease as to a future goal if he should choose to continue to improve beyond the basics.

Of course, the longer reset of a revolver doesn't really have much affect on quick and accurate shot placement

 

[C0untZer0]

I've tried to fire my Charter Arms PITBULL quickly and short-stroked the trigger and when you do that - the gun just locks up until you let the trigger out all the way. It makes for a "WTH?" moment.

I have never experienced that with my S&W revolvers and I have never experienced that with semi-autos, but I don't have any semi-autos that have long triggers.

 

[rcmodel]

S&W revolver's will pretty much force you to do it right because of the power of the rebound slide spring making you do it.

A lot of striker fired semi-autos today don't have 100+ years of refinement of the design like the S&W revolver does though.

Those trigger spring weights didn't just get that way by accident.

rc

 

[chandne]

I think the Glocks have a pretty short reset- I have grown to like that a lot.

 

[9mmepiphany]

My personal opinion is that if you are feeling for the reset...after you've learned the trigger...you're well behind the curve to making a quick and accurate shot.

I understand that many folks who came up through the bullseye ranks or who learned to shoot a rifle first, likely learned to shoot that way...but for defensive use, it is less than optimal

 

[g.willikers]

It's as important to know where the reset is as well as how short or long it is.
Maybe more so, especially since it varies from gun to gun.
Learning where it is requires lots of practice.
Fortunately, dry firing works very well to this end.

 

[strambo]

An example of a bad trigger reset is the Kahr K9. Not only is the reset very long, the spring power is very light (opposite of a S&W revolver) so it is easy to short-stroke it, especially if it isn't your only gun.

I love the K9, but have finally decided to get rid of it for this reason, it is just too different from the P226 I am very well trained on.

 

[Fiv3r]

The only times I have short stroked a trigger is at the range when I went from firing a SA or DA/SA and went to a DAO.

I shot about 150 rounds through my 92fs then switched to my P250. It took me a couple shots to remember to let the trigger ride all the way back out. After that I was fine. The trick to shooting the P250, for me, is to not stage the trigger and pull through every shot. That seems to help me keep from short stroking it.

 

[9mmepiphany]

Yes, in a DAO pistol the trick is to have the trigger in constant motion between a string of shots

 

[Combat Engineer]

"Help me understand the value of a short reset trigger, please." [UKWildcatFan]

In the 4 pics below 4 handguns were fired as fast as possible: top left is a 6-shot 1" group courtesy a true SA trigger Ruger Vaquero, below a 6-shot 1" group courtesy a DA trigger S&W 22-4, top right a 6-shot 5/8"group courtesy a striker fire DAO Walther PPS, and below, a 6-shot half-inch group courtesy a Sig SRT P239.

In my experience the SRT affords very accurate rapid fire shooting. Given that quick double taps have become common training regimen, the SRT can provide a slight edge, especially when smaller cartridges (i.e. 9mm) are used.

 

[LiveLife]

Help me understand the value of a short reset trigger, please.
I'm somewhat new to firearms, but I've heard a lot lately about short reset triggers.

I can understand this for a target gun, but fine motor skills are largely nonexistent at 2:13am when the trouble comes. I just need help understanding the value of them. Help me, please.

It prevents short-stroking the trigger in a gun fight because your pucker factor was to tight to let the trigger go all the way foreword to re-set for the next shot.

So you can't shoot the next shot, until you finally let the trigger go all the way forward to re-set again.

It is a very good thing to have on a fighting handgun.

Don't question it.

+1

For me, techniques and factors that work in match shooting has transferable application in defensive shooting.

Shorter reset triggers (vs long reset/DAO trigger) allows you to maintain your point of aim better, especially in a stressful situation.

When I double-tap for fast match shooting drills, short reset triggers (like my Sig 1911, Glocks, M&P 40/45 with trigger/reset mod, PT145 in SA mode etc.) allow me to maintain my point of aim/sights on targets easier for follow up shots. Faster double taps will improve stage time and score. This is more challenging with triggers with longer reset and double taps with DAO trigger is a "no go" for me (You won't see DAO triggers on match pistols, not where double taps are required).

Same for defensive shooting. As you return your shooting finger farther back, your sights will more likely move away from your target, especially at 2:13 AM with you sleepy and under stress. If I am shooting at someone sleepy and stressed, I want to hit my target and not miss, especially follow up shots. Yes, some may argue that heavier/longer DAO trigger is beneficial for defensive pistol to prevent accidental discharge. Well, I don't plan on shooting only one round at my threat and I want short reset triggers on my pistols, especially if I need to empty my magazine at threat wearing body armor and I realize that after my initial shots are fired.

Bam bam, Oh Crap! threat still moving!, bam bam Holy Crap! body armor! Hip shot! Hip shot! bam bam bam bam bam bam ... Reload, reload! ...