Help me with my 6mm-06 wildcat loads please.

[TexasRifleman]

I have a custom varmint rifle that I had built up back in the mid 80's.

It's a 6mm-06, 36 degree shoulder, pretty steep shoulder angle, using necked down 25-06 brass fire formed once to get the shoulder right. It's a pain to load for but it has always been extremely accurate and deadly at distance to the coyotes with some ridiculous muzzle velocities (around 3750).

The original load given to me by the maker was using a 70gr Nosler Ballistic Tip and 55gr of H414. That's the loading it has worked best with in both that bullet and powder.

I have never liked that bullet in my gun because to set the bullet far enough out to just be about .030 off the lands means that I have little of the bullet in the neck.

With some work you can actually wiggle the bullet loose. I always just sort of ignored that and was very careful with the loaded rounds.

Nosler has a 90 grain Ballistic Tip I think I want to try. It appears to be quite a bit longer so I think I could avoid the problem.

2 questions. Do you think after all this time that h414 is still a good choice or is it time to look at something more modern? There is an awful lot of room in the case with the stuff. I've had H4350 suggested.

Anyone using the 90 grain Ballistic Tip bullet? What do you think of it?

I'm open to other bullet makers, I just have always used Nosler so I don't know much about the others.

I'm fire forming a bunch of brass this week and will try to cook up a little better loading soon.

Thanks as always.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

The 6mm-06 is virtually identical to the 6mm-284. I do not see a recommended load for that cartridge using H414 or H4350 in the Hodgdon handbook I have (26th Edition.)

The powders listed for the 90 grain bullet are:

H870 -- no starting load, max 60.0 grains
H1000 -- starting 54.0, max 57.0
H4831 -- starting 49.0, max 52.0
H450 -- Starting 49.0, Max 52.0

Velocities at max load range from 3249 with H870 to 3380 with H4831.

Max pressures range from 41,400 CUP with H870 (which explains why there is no starting load -- a case full is well below MAP) to 50,700 CUP with H4831.

Warning!! Do not use this data without first going to a manual or the Hodgdon website to verify that I haven't made a typo.

 

[ClarkEMyers]

IIRC the .240 Wby is also similar - actual weights omitted here's Nosler's Wby data.

I don't know what your case capacity is - IIRC the .240 Wby is also a close match for the 6mm-'06 - I may be wrong and I don't have much reference handy (it's in storage a thousand miles away) Handloader's Digest and such used to give water capacity for their cases for Powley style calculations. Obviously your neck is quite different. I'd at least peek at comparative water capacity.

I've been varmint hunting where I had a .243 and my companion had a 6mm-06 - the 6mm-06 was remarkably humane.

.240 Weatherby data from Nosler

90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip IMR IMR-4350 XX 3,448
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip IMR IMR-4350 XX 3,303
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip IMR IMR-4350 XX 3,158
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip Vihtavuori VV-N160 XX 3,445
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip Vihtavuori VV-N160 XX3,313
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip Vihtavuori VV-N160 XX 3,181
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip Alliant RL-19 XX 3,443
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip Alliant RL-19 XX 3,308
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip Alliant RL-19 XX 3,174
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip IMR IMR-4831 XX 3,488
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip IMR IMR-4831 XX 3,343
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip IMR IMR-4831 XX 3,198
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip Hodgdon H-4831 XX 3,453
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip Hodgdon H-4831 XX 3,363
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip Hodgdon H-4831 XX 3,273
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip Accurate XMR-3100 XX 3,376
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip Accurate XMR-3100 XX 3,216
90 Nosler Solid Base Ballistic Tip Accurate XMR-3100 XX 3,054

 

[Matt-man]

I was reading Hodgdon's 2006 "annual manual" last night, and one of the authors said basically the same thing as ClarkEMyers - that the case capacity of 6mm-06 is very close to that of .240 Wby Mag. He then went on to say that based on that, he felt the starting loads listed for .240 would be safe to use in his 6mm-06. For his 90-grain Scirocco load, he ended up using H4831SC.

 

[TexasRifleman]

Thanks folks for the information.
It's nice to have a starting place at least.

I've never used H4831 but it seems to be highly regarded.

 

[CB900F]

TexasSIGman;

Here's the starting load info from Hornady #6 for the 6mm/284 and the .240 Weatherby using the Hornady 87 gr V-Max.

6mm/284 2800 fps:
IMR4350 39.2 gr. Viht N-165 40.5 gr. H4831 40.8 gr. RL19 41.2 gr. AA3100 42.8 gr. and WMR 43.2 gr.

.240 Weatherby 3100 fps:
IMR4064 41.0 gr. IMR4320 42.5 gr. AA4350 43.2 gr. WIN760 44.8 gr. IMR4350 45.6 gr. Viht N160 46.0 gr. IMR4831 47.0 gr. and RL19 46.4 gr.

Speer does not list the 6mm/284, but does, of course, show the .240 Weatherby. Here's Speer #13's starting loads using the 85 gr spitzer boatail.

IMR4831 49.0 gr*. H414 48.0 gr*. IMR4350 47.5 gr*. WIN760 46.0 gr*. IMR4064 40.0 gr*. and H380 43.0 gr*. * denotes use of a magnum primer.

Please notice that Hornady lists by velocity & adjusts the charge to achieve that speed. Speer simply lists in order of maximum velocity & grades powders out that way.

As a personal note, I find that Hornady runs conservative & Speer will push the envelope. Part of this may very well be due to differences in jacket hardness and the intangibles of different guns used in different laboratories. If I were taking on your project, I do believe I'd study hard & start low.

I've also found the Hornady V-Max bullets to be outstanding performers. And you're going to be pleasantly surprised at the price difference in favor of the red box.

900F

 

[Randy in Arizona]

TexasSIGman;

As a personal note, I find that Hornady runs conservative & Speer will push the envelope.

When I got started loading back about 1965 the only data book I had access to was a Speer manual. IIRC, 300 Winchester Magnum, 165 Grain bullet -
Starting charge 80 gr H4831
Medium charge 82 gr H4831
Maximum charge 84 gr H4831

My reloading mentor also had a 300 Win Mag and both of us worked up to the 82 grain charge weight and called it good.

Both rifles were Smith Corona 1903A3s his had a rechambered milspec barrel, mine a Douglas Premium 26" medium heavyweight barrel. Chronographs were scarce and pricey back then so we went with what the good book (Speer) said as if it were gospel.

Nowadays most data books stop at around the 80 grain H4831 weight as a maximum. Of course you have a raft of different 4831s to pick from now too.

I eventually got a chronograph and found the Speer book and my loads were as was said to TexasSIGman, pushing the envelope. Average of 5 shots 3417 FPS.
Now if I could just afford a strain gauge setup - -

 

[CB900F]

Fella's, Randy too;

"I eventually got a chronograph and found the Speer book and my loads were as TexasSIGman said, pushing the envelope. Average of 5 shots 3417 FPS."

WHO said?!

900F

Nada, it happens to the best of us.

 

[Randy in Arizona]

Sorry, CB900F!
Fixed it.

Randy

 

[nune]

could some one help me on the size of the cartrige,over all lenth of the bullet and how much you have to trim the neck.for my 6mm-06 wildcat.i really need this info.thank you if someone can give me this info it wil be greatly appricated.thanks

 

[NCsmitty]

TexasRifleman, I have 1 load from Ammoguide site for the 40 degree Ackley version of the 6mm-06. Should be a reference load at least.

Bullet is 105gr Berger

Powder is IMR7828 = 60.0gr This is a full case and a Maximum load

Velocity is 3460 from 26" barrel

Here's a schematic of the cartridge for comparison. Max COL is 3.340

http://ammoguide.com/?catid=560

It might help.

Sorry, I just saw it was an older thread. Maybe it will help nune.

NCsmitty

 

[ClarkEMyers]

Only a gunsmith the rifle in his hands - or the man who made it can answer.

That's what wildcat means - nasty to tangle with and not a standard.

could some one help me on the size of the cartrige,over all lenth of the bullet and how much you have to trim the neck.for my 6mm-06 wildcat.i really need this info.thank you if someone can give me this info it wil be greatly appricated.thanks

Given a wildcat there is every possibility that any particular chamber is unique. FREX there exist chambers that are really necked down .270 (originally .30-'03 length) length. The only valid answer is it depends on how the maker made it - and a chamber cast.

Notice that folks will fire a cartridge and say it works once so it must be the right one - not so.

 

[CB900F]

Fella's;

Yup, go to Brownell's or Midway & order up some Cerrosafe. That's a low-temp melt material that's then used to make a casting of your rifle's chamber. Using the casting it's possible to determine just what the chamber was reamed to.

900F

 

[Vern Humphrey]

+1. Make a chamber cast with cerrosafe and measure the OAL of the chamber. Then trim your cases about 0.1" short of the chamber.

The danger comes when the case neck extends beyond the end of the chamber, thus forcing the neck tightly around the bullet and kicking pressures through the roof.

 

[CB900F]

Fella's;

When making the chamber cast, don't use more cerrosafe than necessary. You want a cast of the chamber and throat & not a whole lot more. If it extends too far into the rifleing, getting the casting out becomes, "interesting". But not to worry, the stuff is easily melted & reusable several times over.

900F

 

[Master G]

6mm 06 info

Folks 6mm-06 has so many variables. First you all need to get on the ball with TWIST RATE. What is your twist rate? 9, 10, 12, 13, 13 1/4 or 14" ? This is what tells you what bullet weight you can stabilize perfectly at what twist rate you have. Then there is the next problem, what 6mm-06 chamber do you have? 6mm-06 ACKLEY IMPROVED- my opinion TOO BIG for 6mm bore- been there, done that! 6mm-06 Springfield- now your on your way to going somewhere in the real world of fast and flat shooting. If you want to shoot a heavy bullet in say the 100 grain 6mm this is not for you period. Forget the 6mm-06 with heavy bullets. Do something else in a different cartridge. Trust me on this one. Why would you load a tank on a VW to transport it? You would not in your right mind. So 1-9" twist means close to 3000 fps + a few to stabilize the bullet- nothing else. 1-10" = 3350 fps. 1-11"= 3675 fps 1-12"= 4000fps. 1-13"=4325 fps. 1-13 1/4"=4400fps. This is the real deal in twist rates and velocity after that bullets cone in flight. Fly as much as 5 calibers bigger on the tail of the bullet and start the whirlpool effect in flight. Not very good in the accuracy department at all. Now for bullet weight and length. This is where most of you guys get lost with the wrong bullet in your rifle twist rate. So the faster you want to go, the slower the twist rate in the barrel and shorter the bullet has to be. That also means bullet weight has to be less. Just because you want to shoot a heavy bullet for what ever reason in your caliber rifle. You had better know the twist rate and then you can move in the right direction. Faster twist rate, say 1-9" heavier bullet, Slower Twist rate. 1-12" to 1-14" lighter bullets 55gr. to 85gr.
Now that only applies to copper lead bullets. SOLID copper bullets are super long in the same bullet weight and need to be spun in faster twist rate and slower velocities.

 

[OKIE2]

cerrosafe

here is where I found it half the price of Midway and Brownells

http://www.rotometals.com/Bullet-Casting-Alloys-s/5.htm?gclid=CIKBwK6_35gCFQ9JagodNTkCeQ