Here are 7 critical lessons for anyone who owns or carries a gun.

[george burns]

Complete Legal Protection for Armed Self Defense
The above is where the info was taken from
7 critical lessons from America's most notorious gun owner,
The link is that one I put up earlier, I didn't know you needed the subject matter outlined prior to reading post This was just some advise to keep in mind over the holiday, In the event that you encounter a situation that could escalate.
Here are 7 critical lessons for anyone who owns or carries a gun.
http://www.secondcalldefense.org/se...ail&utm_term=0_65f72563ba-82f1171072-95315369
Some of this was outlined here,George Zimmerman’s comments can be heard in the second hour of the three hour show, here: http://armedamericanradio.s3.amazonaws.com/12-14-2014_Hour_2.mp3
The entire three hour show (mostly self-defense issues in the first hour, and mostly women’s gun selection and self-defense issues in the third hour with the three famous female authorities), are available if you download the entire podcast at: http://armedamericanradio.org/show-archives. Apparently Mr Ayoob got a call from Mr Zimmerman during the show.

 

[Warp]

Can you summarize the 7 critical lessons?

I doubt you'll get many people interested in [mostly] blindly watching 3+ hours of stuff.

 

[george burns]

It's not necessary to listen to the 3 hour show, unless you want to hear from some experts including Mass, discussing the [politics of what happens during and after, or could happen. It's not video, just the radio show. That is something to listen to while working "or not", also some commercial ads on there for guns and accessories. It' from the concealed carry network.
Lots of good info. Armed American Radio, with Mark Walthers.
The first link concerns itself with things you should be concerned with should you find yourself in a position where you "may" need your gun to protect yourself or others.
If you would like to hear from Zimmerman himself discuss his case with Mr Ayoob, then perhaps you might be interested in listening to it.
This is the first time he has done this since the verdict.

 

[Warp]

I've watched/listened to Ayoob before...it was not wasted time. I may revisit this...though additional reviews would help me set the time aside to actively listen.

Any volunteers?

 

[4thPointOfContact]

Can you summarize the 7 critical lessons?

Don't get out of the car.
Don't rely on cheap equipment.
Don't take your eyes off the threat.
Don’t assume police are your friends.
Don't forget to assert your 5th Amendment Right.
Don't give interviews without your lawyer.
Don't be surprised if a civil lawsuit comes next.

I agree with all except the first. Being in an automobile reduces your sight, reduces your hearing, restricts your movements and places you in a known position. Why do you think the police like to have the people they stop on the roads remain in the car?

I won't pursue, but I'll be damned if I'm going to sit in a car where I cannot easily look over my shoulder or hear someone approaching.

 

[Plan2Live]

Don't get out of the car.
Don't rely on cheap equipment.
Don't take your eyes off the threat.
Don’t assume police are your friends.
Don't forget to assert your 5th Amendment Right.
Don't give interviews without your lawyer.
Don't be surprised if a civil lawsuit comes next.

I can't speak for other instructors but I cover all that when teaching the full South Carolina CWP class.

 

[RustyShackelford]

Mark O'Mera....

Zimmerman's defense atty, Mark O'Mera discussed lethal force incidents & armed citizens a few weeks ago after the Dunn verdict(NE Florida).
He advises gun owners/CCW holders to contact 911/law enforcement ASAP and tell the dispatcher/call center what's going on & that you fired in self defense. He also said to envoke your legal rights & to pled the 5th is smart.
I met and spoke 2 different times directly with O'Mera. He was confident in his legal team & said the case would be resolved in his favor. This was a few weeks prior to the main criminal trial in Sanford Florida with GZ.
Id add that to obtain or have a pre paid legal service or plan like NRA/Second Call or CCWsafe.com is a good idea too.
Rusty
PS: not talking to the first responders or police is a smart move. They can & will write sworn statements or testify against you if needed.

 

[Warp]

Don't get out of the car.
Don't rely on cheap equipment.
Don't take your eyes off the threat.
Don’t assume police are your friends.
Don't forget to assert your 5th Amendment Right.
Don't give interviews without your lawyer.
Don't be surprised if a civil lawsuit comes next.

I agree with all except the first. Being in an automobile reduces your sight, reduces your hearing, restricts your movements and places you in a known position. Why do you think the police like to have the people they stop on the roads remain in the car?

I won't pursue, but I'll be damned if I'm going to sit in a car where I cannot easily look over my shoulder or hear someone approaching.

I agree with #1, as it pertains to "lessons learned" from Zimmerman.

You are safer, in so many ways, by simply driving. Getting out of your car in order to knowingly and intentionally put yourself, on foot, closer to a potential threat, is just plain stupid. Why? Because you might get attacked, for one. Which is precisely what happened. Do you think Martin would have been a threat, with his fists and empty hands, had Zimmerman been locked in his car? Nope.

Sure, if Martin was behind Zimmerman's car, and Martin had a gun, and Zimmerman was unable to drive away, he would want to get out of the car so he was not a sitting duck. A LEO conducting a traffic stop just isn't an apt comparison here.

If you fear the person who is out there on foot might attack you, and you aren't sure where they went...DRIVE AWAY!

 

[Tirod]

We can probably nitpick each item.

Overall they are good examples of general guidelines. And overall, you have to ask, more than anything, why were you there in the first place.

How would these 7 items apply if you saw a person entering a Walmart brandishing a firearm?

Don't get out of the car. You are.
Don't rely on cheap equipment. You shop at Walmart, they sell decent firearms. It's relative and the hidden message is to force an expensive upgrade.
Don't take your eyes off the threat. Are they actually a threat to YOU, or will something you do focus that?

The following are more after the fact - and are something to consider because it will be the price you pay for getting involved, especially if you go "hero" and try to fix something that maybe you shouldn't.

Don’t assume police are your friends.
Don't forget to assert your 5th Amendment Right.
Don't give interviews without your lawyer.
Don't be surprised if a civil lawsuit comes next.

We get these suggestions all the time from experts who attempt to assert their methods - and they are selling something. Their expertise in a class setting, for a fee.

Keep it in mind.

Are you responsible for defending the Free World from active shooters, or do you just need to get out of the way and survive?

Do you have the muzzle of a gun pointed at you?

Those last four are what happens if you didn't, too. Escalating the situation into a confrontation where there is no explicit threat of lethal force is something a CCW carrier needs to examine very carefully. Even if he is the designated neighborhood watch citizen.

 

[MedWheeler]

Why do you think the police like to have the people they stop on the roads remain in the car?

.. it's also why good cops don't sit in theirs during traffic stops or other field contacts.

 

[Warp]

.. it's also why good cops don't sit in theirs during traffic stops or other field contacts.

A LEO conducting a traffic stop or field contact is not an apt comparison.

Zimmerman had no duty to be there. Zimmerman was not confronting somebody with the intention of preventing them from leaving for the duration of the encounter, by force if necessary, or engaging in a vehicle chase if necessary, etc.

I guess I need to say this...carrying a gun does not make you a police officer! Following, confronting, and engaging "bad guys" is not your job! Throw that shiny "CCW" badge away.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

Don't take your eyes off the threat. Are they actually a threat to YOU, or will something you do focus that?

This is always problematic. Somewhere in there should have been to maintain situational awareness. The problem is that keeping your eyes on the threat can and often is at odds with maintaining situational awareness. "Don't take your eyes off the threat" is sort of like saying to fixate on the target. Many folks have lost their lives because they focused on the threat. Many have lost their lives because they failed to focus on the threat. Which is absolutely correct? It is hard to know until after the situation is over.

I guess I need to say this...carrying a gun does not make you a police officer! Following, confronting, and engaging "bad guys" is not your job! Throw that shiny "CCW" badge away.

No, you don't need to say it. We all know it. Folks to meddle in situations would have meddled in them regardless of having a gun. And whether or not it is "your job" is a matter of opinion. Many people feel very strongly that it is their civic duty to look out for others and to be vigilant on behalf of their brother because the reality of the situation is almost always that the cops are not around when you think you need them. Think about all the self-proclaimed sheepdogs on the forum, for example.

I like this story. It's not their job...
http://www.foxsports.com/college-fo...-burglars-at-gun-point-until-cops-come-121614

 

[anothernewb]

line items 1, 3, 4, and 5 seem to me to fall under the premise of "situational awareness" IMO. if you pay attention to one, you may not need any of the others. at least that's what the classes I've been involved in have tried to tell me.

 

[Warp]

No, you don't need to say it. We all know it. Folks to meddle in situations would have meddled in them regardless of having a gun. And whether or not it is "your job" is a matter of opinion. Many people feel very strongly that it is their civic duty to look out for others and to be vigilant on behalf of their brother because the reality of the situation is almost always that the cops are not around when you think you need them. Think about all the self-proclaimed sheepdogs on the forum, for example.

I'm not sure we all know it. We have arguments here that the right thing to do, when you see a suspicious person walking through the neighborhood, is akin to what a police officer conducting a traffic stop or field contact would do. That is beyond the scope of a private citizen and can get you into real trouble, fast. Just ask Zimmerman.

 

[ku4hx]

Wife and I took a day long course with our sheriff's depart. Morning was safe gun handling, tactics and legal stuff. Afternoon was two thirty round range sessions with every student having a dedicated deputy mentor. This was all presented at no cost to us. Well, we pay taxes so in this case it was tax money well spent.

Having legal instruction specific to our state was a real positive as was the mentored shooting.

In our state, after a self defense situation is determined to be justified, civil suites are precluded.

 

[Warp]

Wife and I took a day long course with our sheriff's depart. Morning was safe gun handling, tactics and legal stuff. Afternoon was two thirty round range sessions with every student having a dedicated deputy mentor. This was all presented at no cost to us. Well, we pay taxes so in this case it was tax money well spent.

Having legal instruction specific to our state was a real positive as was the mentored shooting.

In our state, after a self defense situation is determined to be justified, civil suites are precluded.

That's an awesome deal

 

[Elkins45]

Don't rely on cheap equipment.

This may be a valid lesson, but it wasn't something that was learned from the Zimmerman case. His 'cheap' Kel-Tec worked just fine, and whatever ammo he had it loaded with seemed to do the job as well.

The main lesson from the Zimmerman case is this: If you aren't a sworn police officer then don't go running around acting like one. IMO Zimmerman's shooting of Martin was justified, but entirely avoidable. If Zimmerman had stayed in his car (see lesson #1) he wouldn't be a pariah today and Martin would have enjoyed his Skittles and iced tea at home.

 

[Warp]

This may be a valid lesson, but it wasn't something that was learned from the Zimmerman case. His 'cheap' Kel-Tec worked just fine, and whatever ammo he had it loaded with seemed to do the job as well.

The main lesson from the Zimmerman case is this: If you aren't a sworn police officer then don't go running around acting like one. IMO Zimmerman's shooting of Martin was justified, but entirely avoidable. If Zimmerman had stayed in his car (see lesson #1) he wouldn't be a pariah today and Martin would have enjoyed his Skittles and iced tea at home.

Bingo.

Though on the equipment note, only one shot was fired. It would take a pretty darn poor semi auto handgun to fail on the round that was in the chamber (or simply a pretty darn unlucky individual). All of the jams I personally experienced with KelTec (before I sold them all) and all the ones I remember reading about happened on subsequent rounds.

 

[Onmilo]

Here's a simple rule.
Don't go looking for a gunfight.
Let one come to you.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

I'm not sure we all know it. We have arguments here that the right thing to do, when you see a suspicious person walking through the neighborhood, is akin to what a police officer conducting a traffic stop or field contact would do. That is beyond the scope of a private citizen and can get you into real trouble, fast. Just ask Zimmerman.

I am certain it is beyond your call to say what is or is not beyond anyone's particular scope unless you are there at the time.

 

[Warp]

I am certain it is beyond your call to say what is or is not beyond anyone's particular scope unless you are there at the time.

Please, don't go chasing down suspicious guys walking through the neighborhood because there isn't a LEO on scene yet. That is beyond your scope.

 

[Double Naught Spy]

You make a lot of wild assumptions for a person stating what parameters should or should not be followed. You really don't know what you are talking about when you generalize as you are doing.

You seem to be guilty of what you are saying others should not do. You aren't the CCW cops. Just mind you own business.

 

[denton]

.carrying a gun does not make you a police officer! Following, confronting, and engaging "bad guys" is not your job! Throw that shiny "CCW" badge away.

^^^This!

As other posters have noted, the police have a much harder job than a CCW holder. The police have to chase down, capture, and haul off to jail people who commit crimes. A private citizen only has to avoid being shot, beaten or robbed.

If you are going to a place where you feel you need a gun, don't go there.

 

[Warp]

You make a lot of wild assumptions for a person stating what parameters should or should not be followed. You really don't know what you are talking about when you generalize as you are doing.

You seem to be guilty of what you are saying others should not do. You aren't the CCW cops. Just mind you own business.

The thread topic is lessons for people who carry a gun.

If you don't want to hear what other people are going to say you should or should not do, don't even click on the thread.

One of the lessons learned from Zimmerman (even though we should have known it already) is that avoidance is extremely important. Getting out on foot to follow (arguably chase down) a random suspicious person when there is no reason to believe anybody is in danger of injury/death/forcible felony/etc is a bad idea.

 

[Deaf Smith]

Brother Murphy as far more lessons that these seven.

but.. instead of "'dont's"..

Look for trouble and you will find it.
Your life is valuable, use good equipment that is well tested.
Keep your eyes, and mind, on the threat(s).
No one is your 'friend', police or others, treat them accordingly.
Tell the police the basic dynamics of the incident, no more, no less.
Interviews are for suckers.
You might be sued. Might not. Just don't be surprised if you do. Being sued does not mean they win anything.

Deaf