High Cap Mags In Cali

[DevLcL]

I notice lots of folks on here are quick to point out everything that is illegal and quickly advise against it. In reality every time I go the range I see 5+ hi-cap mags and nobody says a word. The other day I was at the range and this russian guy had his ak (of course) and was indeed packing a few 30 rounders. There were two off duty cops training just down the way. At this same range there was a young man with an AK and a mini-14 with a pistol grip, both with 30 rounds mags. He was waving them around like a jackarse and got himself nearly kicked out after a hailstorm of spit from the furious rangemaster's mouth...but not a word about the mags. I go to this place in the woods sumtimes and when the sheriff is there he usually lets me shoot his M16...complete with 30 round mag. I'm not really sure what I'm tryin to say here, It's just makes me laugh when people shout "FELONY" when they hear sumone whisper about a hi-cap mag in cali. As long as your a responsible person and an even more responsible gun owner and don't get the cops to raid your house, your not gonna get any fuss about it. Especially when your at the range, if you know what your doing, people will only glance at it without a second thought, if so then only to admire.

Don't take my advice if you live in some of the bigger California cities...haha

-Dev

 

[dasmi]

It is possible this person owned the magazine BEFORE the California ban.

 

[longeyes]

Depends on when you bought 'em.

And then there's...omerta'.

 

[Gordon Fink]

It’s all about prudence … and following forum rules on “illegal” activities.

~G. Fink

 

[Creeping Incrementalism]

I thought this might be a good place to mention this... CRPA's The Firing Line said that Cal DOJ follows people with California plates back from Nevada gun shows, and I believe the Vegas gunshops normally card anyone buying hi-caps.

And DevLcL, the hi-cap ban was part of the Assault Weapon Legislation that went into effect in 2000, and previously owned ones were grandfathered in.

 

[ArmedBear]

Yes, previously-owned magazines were grandfathered in. Actually, it is not a crime, AFAIK, READ THE LAW YOURSELF DON'T TAKE MY WORD, to POSSESS a hi-cap magazine.

It is a crime to make one or to import one. That would be why the DOJ would follow people across the state line. That's where the crime takes place.

Now, since hi-caps were Federally banned from what, 1995-2004, then a newer magazine would have been imported after 2000, so of course a court could reasonably surmise that a new magazine was imported illegally. But it would be difficult or impossible to prove that a 1994 or earlier magazine was illegally imported unless the importer is caught in the act.

Caveat- if you stick a legally-owned pre-1994 30-rounder in your 2001-vintage Mini-14, you have just turned your legal semiauto varmint rifle into an illegal, unregistered assault weapon, AFAIK. This would be due to the definition of assault weapons in CA law. I believe this is a court precedent, not something found in the text of the law. Again, check it yourself.

There are other ways to make your recent-mfg gun into an illegal assault weapon in CA, like change the stock to a thumbhole or one with a pistol grip, or add a flashhider. Muzzlebrakes are okay, and the difference is not entirely clear or defined. Some of the accessories may be legal to sell but not to install.

Yes, this stuff is stupid as hell. But it's important to be aware of it, because none of these technical violations are worth the price you pay.

 

[odysseus]

There are at least tens upon tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, of so-called "high-cap" magazines LEGALLY owned by Californians before the ban in 2000. Why would it be odd to see someone using them at a range? I don't get this thread. The only assumption one should make is that they are legally owned, unless proven otherwise.

 

[Guns_and_Labs]

CRPA's The Firing Line said that Cal DOJ follows people with California plates back from Nevada gun shows

And what probable cause would they use for a stop and search?

 

[odysseus]

And what probable cause would they use for a stop and search?

I can't remember where, but I read that they had spotters actually watching purchases of these items inside and would follow the person from Cali out. It was on a website from a dealer reporting on big LE stings in Nevada gun shows (Reno esp.). Once they crossed the Cali border, they had probable cause a crime had occured and would then pull over to search.

Bottomline, I don't condone committing a "crime" against this stupid law. But the law is the law and if you do this, you take risks - right or wrong. Someone who exposes themselves to this can get in some trouble. I doubt the Cali LE care if you ever heard of the ban on mags or not. More confusion now I am sure since it is legal Federally.

 

[ArmedBear]

What's interesting is that California DOJ has no jurisdiction in a neighboring state. And there's no law saying a CA resident can't buy a magazine in another state, just that he/she can't bring it into California.

You could drive within a few yards of the state line, then turn around and drive back the other way, here, there and everywhere. If you had money and some time to kill, it would be really amusing to do this and see how long they would follow you, even if it meant you would throw the magazine away. Some magazines really ought to be thrown away anyway. We won't mention any manufacturers.

 

[kbarrett]

What's interesting is that California DOJ has no jurisdiction in a neighboring state. And there's no law saying a CA resident can't buy a magazine in another state, just that he/she can't bring it into California.

You could drive within a few yards of the state line, then turn around and drive back the other way, here, there and everywhere. If you had money and some time to kill, it would be really amusing to do this and see how long they would follow you, even if it meant you would throw the magazine away. Some magazines really ought to be thrown away anyway. We won't mention any manufacturers.

Hmmm ... sending yourself a priority mail package before doing this immediately leaps into my head for some reason.....

 

[ArmedBear]

Well, there's something interesting.

It's illegal to import a magazine, so if I shipped it to myself, I'd be guilty if caught.

But if someone else did it, I could receive the package. I didn't import the thing. If I said, "Here, Bill Lockyer, you piece of dog????, here's your magazine!" then I would be innocent. If the person who shipped it was named Abraham Lincoln or something, they'd never find him.

Hey, can I still use that torch and Kaseinit to harden a sear if I make it up to the PDX area? And we could take you to dinner.

We're scouting other states, probably PNW.

Barry

 

[Creeping Incrementalism]

It's illegal to import a magazine, so if I shipped it to myself, I'd be guilty if caught. But if someone else did it, I could receive the package. I didn't import the thing.
Barry

If the example you give is not importing, then people could just mail order them (someone else shipping to you). If you've ever looked at a mail-order catalog selling hi-cap's, I'm sure you've seen the "no sales to CA" disclaimer. We can't even buy linked ammution, if there are more than ten linked together!

odysseus, what I read in CRPA's The Firing Line was also at Reno.

 

[ArmedBear]

If the example you give is not importing, then people could just mail order them (someone else shipping to you). If you've ever looked at a mail-order catalog selling hi-cap's, I'm sure you've seen the "no sales to CA" disclaimer. We can't even buy linked ammution, if there are more than ten linked together!

odysseus, what I read in CRPA's The Firing Line was also at Reno.

Abraham Lincoln would indeed be importing the magazines to California, but he might be difficult to catch, even if anyone notices.

Cabela's, Cheaper Than Dirt, etc. would be a lot easier to find and it would cost them far too much to be convicted.

 

[railroader]

ArmedBear, where does it say it is illegal to put a pre 1994 hi cap mag in a post ban rifle such as a mini 14( in california). The reason I ask is because I have a keltec su-16 and I also have some grandfathered ar15 30 round mags. So If you could show me the text of the law I would appreciate it because I haven't heard of anything like that. Both the keltec and the mini aren't listed as assualt weapons and they don't have the evil features either which would make them illegal. Mark