High volumetric density pistol powder that meters well?

[Buck13]

I use Promo with many light target loads in handguns, with lead bullets. From 32 SW Long to 44 Mag.

I also use it in reduced velocity rifle loads.

A very versatile powder. I have a great deal of it.

Where do you find data for rifle loads? Or do you just use a rule of thumb, which I recall seeing for Red Dot...

 

[entropy]

Yes, I definitely try to visually inspect each round. I just like the difference to be as obvious as possible. A double-charge of Titegroup in a .44 Magnum case is visible, I guess, but not as obvious as others.

I have a paranoia when developing any handgun load. The case can not take 2 charges without overflowing. Many don’t need this precaution, I do!

I also visually inspect because there are 2 things I never want.
1) A double charge
2) A squib round.

And I’ve managed to load a couple squib rounds. Because the case can’t take 2 charges, I’ve never loaded a double charge. But Silhouette does that for me.[/QUOTE]

I hand dump the charge, fill, inspect, then immediately seat. It eliminates guessing the fill level, and whether I double charged or forgot to charge.

Have you given any thought to Cream of Wheat or Polyfill?

I tried, but it did not ignite well, velocities were extremely low.

 

[BBarn]

American Select is my preferred fast bulky powder. Smoother metering in my Hornady powder measure than several other flake powders I've tried (including Red Dot, Unique, Clays, Universal, Competition, 700-X, and 800-X).

 

[Hooda Thunkit]

Where do you find data for rifle loads? Or do you just use a rule of thumb, which I recall seeing for Red Dot...

Well, one could use 'The Load', which can be searched using that term. Personally, I think TL is a bit overpowered, but safe.

If one is looking for reduced velocity with Promo, start with TL and work your way down. Definitely safe with lead bullets, a bit more problematic with jacketed.

I shoot the Lee TL314-90-SWC, with just a few gains of Promo ( 3 or 4? I can't remember offhand) in .30-30 for a fun ~1000 fps load.

If you own a chrony, it's easy to work up (or down) to what you want. A bit of extrapolation or interpolation, as the case warrants, is in order.

Edit to add - I have a Lyman #45 manual. It contains RedDot (hence Promo, by weight) load for almost any rifle extant.

 

[Buzznrose]

When I was looking for Trail Boss, I was told to try VV N32C

https://www.vihtavuori.com/powder/n32c-tin-star/

I ended up holding off for now but if it behaves like the other VV powders I use, it would meter well.

Sorry, no first hand experience yet.

I use N320 for my 9MM loads and it is pretty bulky…it is easy to see the powder in the brass on my 550….

 

[black mamba]

I agree with BBarn about American Select, very good fast powder. The Vihtavuori powders run very smoothly through a measure, and N320 is right about the same speed as Green Dot or 231/HP38.

 

[Archie]

Sounds like you want a 'bulky' powder, that is a powder that fills or nearly fills the case when charging. Is that right?

If so, you want to avoid fast powders like 231, Bullseye or Red Dot. They work well, but a little powder goes a long way. For a 'bulky' powder, I suggest Unique or possibly Power Pistol. Or, you could always clean up your reloading and charging act to avoid double charges. Watching while charging is always encouraged. Visually, detecting a couple tenths of a grain of powder is difficult, but a double change is quite noticeable.

 

[P Flados]

As an update on the original topic, Accurate Nitro 100 NF is a fast burning, low density, flattened ball powder. It is in stock at the Hodgdon web site.

Unfortunately, the only factory data for handguns is for 9mm.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

As an update on the original topic, Accurate Nitro 100 NF is a fast burning, low density, flattened ball powder. It is in stock at the Hodgdon web site.

Unfortunately, the only factory data for handguns is for 9mm.

Western v.8.0:


There’s more but it’s up to the OP to go looking.

 

[P Flados]

Nice data. I originally went to the Hodgdon site, but did not find much. Knowing what to look for came up with:
https://ramshot.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/WesternPowdersHandloadingGuide8.0_WEB.pdf

This powder is now on my radar for when I get low on either Promo or TiteGroup. Hopefully prices will drop before then.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Nice data. I originally went to the Hodgdon site, but did not find much. Knowing what to look for came up with:
https://ramshot.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/WesternPowdersHandloadingGuide8.0_WEB.pdf

This powder is now on my radar for when I get low on either Promo or TiteGroup. Hopefully prices will drop before then.

I used its predecessor, Royal Scot Nitro 100, back in the 80’s as a substitute for Bullseye when it was not available. It was okay but I really preferred Bullseye. When Accurate bought Royal Scot they kept most of the powders and just changed the label. Eventually they reformulated Nitro 100 and that’s what the NF stands for. I tried the NF as a Red Dot substitute and it was okay still but not yippee skippy enough to keep on hand. I think it will probably work as a substitute for Trail Boss but with the caveat that it runs a little hot because of the high nitro content.

 

[LiveLife]

Alliant reblended Promo over the years and after several containers of Promo, it now contains all round flakes without the krinkly flakes and meters better with .12 gr variance out of C-H 502 powder measure (BTW, W231/HP-38 meters with .12 gr variance)

Adding to post #23 - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...powder-that-meters-well.912034/#post-12451073

Here's comparison picture of latest container of Promo next to W231/HP-38. As you can see, it is all rounded flakes and flake size has reduced to meter better with .12 gr weight variance.

 

[Thomasss]

Those two and Competition were the powders I was considering most likely in addition to Red Dot.

Red Dot is the worse metering powder you can use. Alliant took it out of all their manual around 2010 because according to them, "it's too fluffy". I talked to them in 2015 and they gave me their recipes only because I weigh every load. They said that weighing each load is the only way to safely use Red Dot.

[

 

[BBarn]

Red Dot, like several other bulky flake powders, does meter poorly. But in looking at Alliant's older manuals back to 2000, it's apparent that they never took it out of their manuals entirely. They have reduced the number of published Red Dot pistol loads over the years, seemingly replacing them with loads utilizing their newer powders.

As far as weighing each charge, I don’t believe that is stated anywhere in Alliant's published data for the current pistol loads. And it's doubtful that the many shotshell reloaders are weighing each charge produced by their charge bars.

 

[entropy]

No. We drop ten charges, weigh them,and average the weights, then compare that to nominal charge list for that powder in that bushing.

 

[Palladan44]

Unique

 

[Jim Watson]

I feel more comfortable with as high a volumetric density as possible

Backwards, you are misled by the Lee numbers. You want LOW bulk density for good case fill. Too bad Lee charts specific volume, sort of.

Unfortunately, Titewad is marketed for 12 gauge only

I have been loading .45 ACP Minor with Bullseye... two 8lb kegs in the recycling bin, plus a single or two. I am down to my last whole pound plus what is in the measure and I am getting nervous. I was not much impressed by Titegroup when I tried one can of it, but I was looking at the Lee chart and saw that Titewad has a high VMD and that Hodgdon does have some pistol data. Look it up. I have seen it in stock and will go to it if I cannot resupply Bullseye.

Clays meters better than its large flake appearance suggests.
700X that looks similar is just bloody awful. I resorted to a vibrator on the measure to shake it down for pistol loads after I got out of shotshell reloading.

 

[AJC1]

I like fluffy with good casefill. I have used red dot only briefly and it's fill was good for the tiny charges. I'm getting a pound of blue dot finally in two weeks. I guess I should search out green dot just to try it. Good metering and high volume fluffy seem inversely perportional. The tiny balls of true blue and sw heavy pistol meter extremely well. Because of people loading progressive I'm sure they will stay extremely popular.