Greetings with the next chapter in my post apocalyptic world of BP. I made my Homemade BP and am planning a video. Not nearly as complicated as I thought. Now that the Zombies have overrun my hide out I find myself without a gun or ammo. My next challenge to my self is what can I make to hunt and defend my self if all I have is my wits. [1/2?] And the worms I took from OW's niter patch! As always, thanks for your input. The ammo I don't think will be too difficult. Finding older cars with the lead wheel weights should be aplenty. Tooling a stone to form a ball mold is one idea. Another is to pry out a bearing from something that quit running when the gas was gone. Take some clay or plaster and make a ball mold. Lots of ideas here. The gun. HHhhmmmm. I don't have a clue.
Home made BP gun with no power tools?
- Thread starter CANNONMAN
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Officers'Wife
Member
O
M
G
!
You are starting down my uncle's path... Assuming all products of modern tech disappeared how long would it take to rebuild?
You can use a forge to heat steel bands then hammer weld them around a hard steel rod to fashion a barrel. Use case hardening to fashion the spring for the lock and make a flintlock musket.
M
G
!
You are starting down my uncle's path... Assuming all products of modern tech disappeared how long would it take to rebuild?
You can use a forge to heat steel bands then hammer weld them around a hard steel rod to fashion a barrel. Use case hardening to fashion the spring for the lock and make a flintlock musket.
BCRider
Member
It's not like steel and brass will fade into the earth any time soon. So any post apocalyptic society will have all the steel, brass and aluminium they can ask for once the dust settles. No mining needed.
There's lots of ways of using wood fires or bags of charcoal from the abandoned hardware store shelves to make up what you need to cast brass to make a round ball bullet mold if you're short sighted enough not to stock up on Lee molds before everyone goes all zombie on ya. Look up the Gingery line of books on back yard machine and foundry works. The guy is a genius at doing a lot with very little basic options.
As for making guns without power tools? Have you seen this gunsmithing video of a guy from Old Williamsburg? It's worth a bowl of popcorn and a drink to sit in your favorite comfy chair and watch. Old world metal working skills at their finest. It's a slap of reality to the modern generation that thinks CNC has been around since the rise of Egypt and when the Nile valley was lush and green. Just stock up a nice supply of hack saw blades and files on the shelf next to the flints and Lee ball molds and you'll be good to go.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lui6uNPcRPA
Of course the same thing applies to stocking up on flint locks now instead of waiting until after the zombie virus takes hold.
In fact this sort of concern might just explain the .22LR hoaring that's been going on over the past year. I wonder if those types know something we don't?
There's lots of ways of using wood fires or bags of charcoal from the abandoned hardware store shelves to make up what you need to cast brass to make a round ball bullet mold if you're short sighted enough not to stock up on Lee molds before everyone goes all zombie on ya. Look up the Gingery line of books on back yard machine and foundry works. The guy is a genius at doing a lot with very little basic options.
As for making guns without power tools? Have you seen this gunsmithing video of a guy from Old Williamsburg? It's worth a bowl of popcorn and a drink to sit in your favorite comfy chair and watch. Old world metal working skills at their finest. It's a slap of reality to the modern generation that thinks CNC has been around since the rise of Egypt and when the Nile valley was lush and green. Just stock up a nice supply of hack saw blades and files on the shelf next to the flints and Lee ball molds and you'll be good to go.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lui6uNPcRPA
Of course the same thing applies to stocking up on flint locks now instead of waiting until after the zombie virus takes hold.
In fact this sort of concern might just explain the .22LR hoaring that's been going on over the past year. I wonder if those types know something we don't?
kBob
Member
Why Cannonman, I am surprised at you. After all the cars stop running I thought you would be making 3 inch smoothbore cannon from all the drive shafts on the useless cars. Selling canister rounds loaded with ball bearings.
Won't be long before the moderators get us for fantasizing about the coming Porker-lips.
-kBob
Won't be long before the moderators get us for fantasizing about the coming Porker-lips.
-kBob
Egads! What was I thinking? Just because I tried out my super homemade brew on my 'flinter .50 gives me no justification for wanting to build anything else but a cannon! [must of been those dadburn book covers! Silly OW.] OK. Cannons, that I can do. What's the deal with the "hand cannons" that Gary was talking about?
splattergun
Member
handgonne is the answer
http://www.musketeer.ch/blackpowder/handgonne.html
It's just a hand-held cannon.
http://www.musketeer.ch/blackpowder/handgonne.html
It's just a hand-held cannon.
dickydalton
Member
Make a pet out of a zombie killing bear.
zimmerstutzen
Member
The trick is not to make it without tools, but the know how to fabricate the tools. Located in the bowels of the Smithsonian History and Technology building is a display of old "wooden" treadle operated machinery. Such as a metal lathe, a copper spinning machine, etc. My cousin owned an operating colonial era grist mill. All the gears and even the mill's water wheels and axles were made of wood.
I remember a story of a giant bronze ship propeller that was delivered with the wrong size hole. It needed to be enlarged by an inch. No one had the "power machinery" and the delay to ship it back would take the ship out of the war for at least three extra weeks. An old time black smith forged a cutter which was mounted into a piece of a tree trunk that was shaved to fit the smaller hole. A mule was used to pull a cross bar to turn the piece of tree trunk. The black smith had a kid sit on top and constantly brush oil onto the area being cut. It shaved a tiny fraction of an inch per revolution. But after 24 hours the propeller had been cut to size and reamed smooth by an equally primitive fashion. The ship was back in action and the ship yard big wigs marveled and scratched their heads over how a rough crude non-schooled black smith could do what the engineers had assumed only could be done by fancy machinery.
When I bought my first 50-70 rifle, loading tools were next to impossible to find. So I made some out of rock maple. it took patient drilling and sanding, but I made a straight line bullet seater that worked.
Right now, in a drawer in my desk is a 20 ga shot shell reloading kit, commercially made, of wood.
I remember a story of a giant bronze ship propeller that was delivered with the wrong size hole. It needed to be enlarged by an inch. No one had the "power machinery" and the delay to ship it back would take the ship out of the war for at least three extra weeks. An old time black smith forged a cutter which was mounted into a piece of a tree trunk that was shaved to fit the smaller hole. A mule was used to pull a cross bar to turn the piece of tree trunk. The black smith had a kid sit on top and constantly brush oil onto the area being cut. It shaved a tiny fraction of an inch per revolution. But after 24 hours the propeller had been cut to size and reamed smooth by an equally primitive fashion. The ship was back in action and the ship yard big wigs marveled and scratched their heads over how a rough crude non-schooled black smith could do what the engineers had assumed only could be done by fancy machinery.
When I bought my first 50-70 rifle, loading tools were next to impossible to find. So I made some out of rock maple. it took patient drilling and sanding, but I made a straight line bullet seater that worked.
Right now, in a drawer in my desk is a 20 ga shot shell reloading kit, commercially made, of wood.
splattergun
Member
The early ones were hammered and banded.
- Joined
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Handgonnes could have been casted one piece. The bore could be polished with a stick and abrasive compound. In/out, rinse and repeat. Tedious.
I need to make one. I was teaching muzzle loading at Adventure Camp and it would have been nice to show the kiddies one.
I need to make one. I was teaching muzzle loading at Adventure Camp and it would have been nice to show the kiddies one.
Gemmer
Member
Want to know how to make a forge? Gunpowder? Survive in primative conditions? Read " The Mysterious Island" by Jules Verne published in 1874.
kBob
Member
Gemmer, and while we are at it train an ape to be a household maid and to smoke a pipe.
-kBob
-kBob
kBob
Member
Looks like many handgoone were cast then drilled.
Table guns and such were often hammer welded iron skiens held together by bands......like a wooden barrel only iron. Why did you think we called them barrels?
Supposedly in Spain in the earliest days of BP in Europe sections of tree trunk only a foot or so thick got hollowed out most of the way through and used as one shot (or until they burst) rock throwing mortars. These were used to lob rocks over walls to fall on the hapless folks over yonder. Guess you could burn a hole as when making a wooden bowl or dug out canoe. Looks like a way to make a wooden grenade for self destruction to me though.
STOP! DO NOT ATTEMPT TO RECREATE THE FOLLOWING kBOB STORY IN ANY MANNER!
I am reminded of the good old days of being a kid when one could buy Cherry Bombs and the M80 silver side fused cylindrical firecracker. Having told some buddies about this Spanish or Moorish Stump Mortar we commenced to a 12 year old Y chomosonal group think. Today I can think of few things more dangerous than a 12 year old Y chomosonal group think.
Figuring that hollowing out a stump would be to much like actual work to be any fun we considered other ways of launching our selected "rock". Being Florida the rock was actually a chunk of concrete one of the boys had found about the size of his head. Some one else had a couple of empty paint cans and another had some M80s and Cherry Bombs. We found we could stomp a paint can mouth first into the soft loam soil in the woods and then pry it out full of dirt leaving a paint can sized hole into which an empty dirt free can could be placed.
in a three boy operation one boy lit a M80 and tossed it into the hole, another shoved a paint can into the hole over the burning fuzed M80 and the third slammed the rock on top of the now facing up bottom of the paint can then rolled quickly away, all the while any excess boys ran in circles about the operation screaming conflicting advice and warnings.
Keep in mind that the fuzes only burned 3 to 4 seconds.
With a deep throated "WHUMPH!" nothing like an M80 bursting in air and yet different than an M80 tied to a brick hurled off the dock into the water, the can pistoned out of the hole and hurled the rock a good 12 feet into the air. It was of course only after the rock stopped upward motion that any thought was given to its return trajectory. Naturally by the time we made it to school the next day to tell other young Y chromosome holders the tale the rock had gone 40 feet into the air. There was also of course the story of how on the fifth attempt the paint can had blown to bits (well three or four pieces) and one buzzing bit had cut a tree limb from right next to Phillip's head, Honest Injun!
Fortunately it provided a learning experience for us little monsters.......we needed a different sized rock and a way to angle the shot!
Science!
Brain damage!
12 year old boys!
Take that Officer's Wife! Geez, Gurlz......
-kBob
Table guns and such were often hammer welded iron skiens held together by bands......like a wooden barrel only iron. Why did you think we called them barrels?
Supposedly in Spain in the earliest days of BP in Europe sections of tree trunk only a foot or so thick got hollowed out most of the way through and used as one shot (or until they burst) rock throwing mortars. These were used to lob rocks over walls to fall on the hapless folks over yonder. Guess you could burn a hole as when making a wooden bowl or dug out canoe. Looks like a way to make a wooden grenade for self destruction to me though.
STOP! DO NOT ATTEMPT TO RECREATE THE FOLLOWING kBOB STORY IN ANY MANNER!
I am reminded of the good old days of being a kid when one could buy Cherry Bombs and the M80 silver side fused cylindrical firecracker. Having told some buddies about this Spanish or Moorish Stump Mortar we commenced to a 12 year old Y chomosonal group think. Today I can think of few things more dangerous than a 12 year old Y chomosonal group think.
Figuring that hollowing out a stump would be to much like actual work to be any fun we considered other ways of launching our selected "rock". Being Florida the rock was actually a chunk of concrete one of the boys had found about the size of his head. Some one else had a couple of empty paint cans and another had some M80s and Cherry Bombs. We found we could stomp a paint can mouth first into the soft loam soil in the woods and then pry it out full of dirt leaving a paint can sized hole into which an empty dirt free can could be placed.
in a three boy operation one boy lit a M80 and tossed it into the hole, another shoved a paint can into the hole over the burning fuzed M80 and the third slammed the rock on top of the now facing up bottom of the paint can then rolled quickly away, all the while any excess boys ran in circles about the operation screaming conflicting advice and warnings.
Keep in mind that the fuzes only burned 3 to 4 seconds.
With a deep throated "WHUMPH!" nothing like an M80 bursting in air and yet different than an M80 tied to a brick hurled off the dock into the water, the can pistoned out of the hole and hurled the rock a good 12 feet into the air. It was of course only after the rock stopped upward motion that any thought was given to its return trajectory. Naturally by the time we made it to school the next day to tell other young Y chromosome holders the tale the rock had gone 40 feet into the air. There was also of course the story of how on the fifth attempt the paint can had blown to bits (well three or four pieces) and one buzzing bit had cut a tree limb from right next to Phillip's head, Honest Injun!
Fortunately it provided a learning experience for us little monsters.......we needed a different sized rock and a way to angle the shot!
Science!
Brain damage!
12 year old boys!
Take that Officer's Wife! Geez, Gurlz......
-kBob
Officers'Wife
Member
What is this? pick on the Tulala day?
Bob, it's a scientific fact that among the adult population there is a significant percent less men than women. The reason is fewer boys 19 and younger survive their stupidity long enough to become adults.
Aye-yi-yi! Growing up in the Sonoran Desert; I've managed to pick up a few hints from other, wiser (usually older) folks. Most importantly: DON'T MAKE IT HARDER TO LOCATE, STEAL, OR MANUFACTURE YOURSELF THAT WHICH YOU CAN'T BUY (ANYMORE).
Moulds for making round balls, check. Lead, check (although the lead I have is not "pure"). Nearly lab grade sulfur, check. "Preservative" for bread and cakes, check! Still gotta get myself a cheap rock tumbler and a sorta-local place to get willow charcoal. But I'm durn near ready!
I already have to pee in a bottle at random periods; just one of the requirements for continued employment with my company. Consequently, I'm not much interested in following THAT trail.
Why does the rest of the topic of discussion here have to become so, so, convoluted?
To make matters more confusing, there's a member of this Forum (of the "lady persuasion") that has taken to using the term "Tulala"; which was a term heretofore unknown to me. Since I presumably still have distant relatives (my Maternal Grandmother's Little Sister's - is that distant enough? - offspring; I may hear from them one day, so I looked up this "Tulala".
Criminitly, Muttly! A quick search on Google has created even more confusion! According to the web page to which Google sent me http://tagaloglang.com/Tagalog-English-Dictionary/English-Translation-of-Tagalog-Word/tulala.html) there are FOUR distinct possible short meanings for the word Tulala. As of right now, with this additional information, I'm more confused!
I do not know if I'm:
1.)star-struck
2.)dumbfounded
3.)astonished or amazed
-or just-
4.)staring into space (like a confused Irishman)
Aye-yi-yi.....
Moulds for making round balls, check. Lead, check (although the lead I have is not "pure"). Nearly lab grade sulfur, check. "Preservative" for bread and cakes, check! Still gotta get myself a cheap rock tumbler and a sorta-local place to get willow charcoal. But I'm durn near ready!
I already have to pee in a bottle at random periods; just one of the requirements for continued employment with my company. Consequently, I'm not much interested in following THAT trail.
Why does the rest of the topic of discussion here have to become so, so, convoluted?
To make matters more confusing, there's a member of this Forum (of the "lady persuasion") that has taken to using the term "Tulala"; which was a term heretofore unknown to me. Since I presumably still have distant relatives (my Maternal Grandmother's Little Sister's - is that distant enough? - offspring; I may hear from them one day, so I looked up this "Tulala".
Criminitly, Muttly! A quick search on Google has created even more confusion! According to the web page to which Google sent me http://tagaloglang.com/Tagalog-English-Dictionary/English-Translation-of-Tagalog-Word/tulala.html) there are FOUR distinct possible short meanings for the word Tulala. As of right now, with this additional information, I'm more confused!
I do not know if I'm:
1.)star-struck
2.)dumbfounded
3.)astonished or amazed
-or just-
4.)staring into space (like a confused Irishman)
Aye-yi-yi.....
BCRider
Member
Cannonman, I foresee you following history and in another few years asking how to turn your handgonne into a matchlock. Then maybe shortly before you sign into the old age home you'll advance up the time line and learn about the magic of FLINT! ! !
There's a bunch of handgonne videos on you toob. I was going to post a link but there's too many to choose from. Just run a you toob search on "handgonne" and a bunch of them show up.
The EASY way would be to simply buy a smoothbore barrel and shorten it then mount it to a stick with the touch hole facing up. Next would be a suitable piece of seamless thick wall tubing with the right size ball. Sort of a small cannon on a stick with no wheels, eh?
More fun to be had by starting with a big piece of round bar of suitable metallic breeding and form it into a part octagonal and part rounded beads to form something more period typical and put THAT on a nice hefty stick for balance.
There's a bunch of handgonne videos on you toob. I was going to post a link but there's too many to choose from. Just run a you toob search on "handgonne" and a bunch of them show up.
The EASY way would be to simply buy a smoothbore barrel and shorten it then mount it to a stick with the touch hole facing up. Next would be a suitable piece of seamless thick wall tubing with the right size ball. Sort of a small cannon on a stick with no wheels, eh?
More fun to be had by starting with a big piece of round bar of suitable metallic breeding and form it into a part octagonal and part rounded beads to form something more period typical and put THAT on a nice hefty stick for balance.
Officers'Wife
Member
First off Yuma, I'm kidding about this being pick on the Tulala day.
Please note that your definitions are either verbs or adjectives while I'm using the word as a noun. Also keep in mind that like Spanish, Tagalog is gender specific and translator engines online are rarely set up to recognize the feminine gender. Blatant sexism really, I'm thinking of a class action suit.
Now that confusion is over, I'm told that there is a plant in your little desert that produces a rubber rich in straight chain hydrocarbons that can be "cracked" into the same products as crude oil. I would suggest you concentrate on cultivation of that weed since if "Mad Max" is to be believed gasoline will be much harder to obtain than powder and lead and ergo a more valuable trade commodity.
zimmerstutzen
Member
Officer's wife: Que Pasa Cha?
Had a Philipino baby sitter for my kids 20 years ago and a very little Tagalog rubbed off.
The ability to make a file, forge a chisel, carbonize and temper your tools. Even know where to find the necessary items like flux, etc.
I have done a little sand casting with simple stuff here at home. Heat of a fire, simple tools, etc.
I friend made a couple of very sharp "ulu" knives from circular saw blades.
Had a Philipino baby sitter for my kids 20 years ago and a very little Tagalog rubbed off.
The ability to make a file, forge a chisel, carbonize and temper your tools. Even know where to find the necessary items like flux, etc.
I have done a little sand casting with simple stuff here at home. Heat of a fire, simple tools, etc.
I friend made a couple of very sharp "ulu" knives from circular saw blades.
kBob
Member
zimmer,
I used a tourista souvenier ulu to cut the pizza with last week!
-kBob
I used a tourista souvenier ulu to cut the pizza with last week!
-kBob
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2002
- Messages
- 22,482
Remember, even if the lights go out, there's no need to start from Square 1. You can salvage a lot of steel or metal with which you may fabricate a barrel.
I once examined and shot a Dogon made flintlock fusil. The lock parts were sandcasted and many other parts (trigger guard, barrel bands, buttplate) were made from flat brass stock. As for the barrel, that was a steering wheel column. Too bad Muzzle Blasts never published that article.
I once examined and shot a Dogon made flintlock fusil. The lock parts were sandcasted and many other parts (trigger guard, barrel bands, buttplate) were made from flat brass stock. As for the barrel, that was a steering wheel column. Too bad Muzzle Blasts never published that article.
zimmerstutzen
Member
Heard once that CH dies, when the company started, were cut from scrap car rear axles.
kBob
Member
One of the axle shafts inside the axle of a rear wheel drive car can be used for making a barrel....or no doubt dies. For the barrel I would guess drilling a hole that long and deep with no guide like the place the mandel was in a skelp made hammered up barrel might be an issue. Maybe keep the barrels short as on small handguns until you figure it out. Maybe a bore sized hollow guide with a smaller drill through it to provide a guide hole every few inches.....my head hurts.
I believe Carbine Williams did his short piston work in prison using such an axle shaft for material.
Of course as a kid what I saw them most used for was tent pegs for circus sized tents at revival meetings.
Whoa, revival meetings, I'm gonna go all Porgy and Bess now.....
"It ain't necessarily so....."
Aren't we all sporting men? (Except Officer's Wife, of course.)
-kBob
I believe Carbine Williams did his short piston work in prison using such an axle shaft for material.
Of course as a kid what I saw them most used for was tent pegs for circus sized tents at revival meetings.
Whoa, revival meetings, I'm gonna go all Porgy and Bess now.....
"It ain't necessarily so....."
Aren't we all sporting men? (Except Officer's Wife, of course.)
-kBob
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