Homeowner shot confronting intruder in NH- how could this have been different?

[browningguy]

If you have a self defense gun why is not in the bedroom with you? I hear bumps in the night and investigate when they happen, it's always turned out to be nothing, but I still check it out as if it is something, with a light and 19 rounds of 9mm. If someone is in my house at night uninvited bad things are bound to happen.

 

[old lady new shooter]

And we all see why a career in carpentry was never going to happen for me.

Still, I like the idea of making my door stronger.

And also a moat.

You can also install security doors, they are steel mesh with steel bars that also serve as decoration, and come with their own frame. They cannot be kicked in, and allow you to open the wood door to talk to whomever is outside without also giving them the possibility of getting in. Look on the websites of Home Depot and Lowes for examples.

And if you have sliding glass doors or any large windows, you should get 3M security film applied... google this, you will find video of BG swinging patio furniture at a slider with this on it and the slider remains intact. You also need a large heavy-duty bolt that goes far into the wall to secure it closed.

 

[dh1633pm]

I agree stay put, but with other family in the the house one might have to be active. But only to a point. Depending on floor plan, you can guard a choke point to protect life with a good position. For my house we live upstairs. As long as the whole family is upstairs, I ain't going down them to confront anyone. Why bother getting blood all over your nice clean floors. Lights stay off. I know my way around the house in the dark.

Anyone attempting to climb stairs, will be falling back down them. My watch cat will tell me friend or foe. His yowl and tone sounds the alarm that something isn't right. He always knows. The dogs know too, but to them its a new friend. The dogs will just lick them to death, they don't care. Oh boy a new visitor.

All good input, but nobody knows until you get into the situation. The best plans of man can end up being worthless.

 

[Tirod]

We don't really have a defensive gun use situation here. We have a complete failure of Home Defense. IE, the house was so easy to get into the perp quietly walked thru an exterior door and then down the hall into the bathroom.

Apparently the door he entered was not secure, no lock thrown, the house lit well enough to see, no alarm was used, no pet like a dog to bark, and most importantly, the folks so sound asleep they never heard him breaking and entering. He's rummaging in the medicine cabinet when they finally hear him and are alerted.

Not a gun use issue at all, a complete failure to have any security on the house whatsoever. These are always written up in the press as a gun shooting, but the reality is that they should be approached as a complete lack of home security.

It makes NO difference which way the hinges swing the door, they are NOT the first line of security holding it closed. The door lock is, and if there are hinge barrels exposed to the outside then use security hinges that prevent the door being removed when closed. Commercial exterior doors are commonly equipped that way - but don't expect the guy down at the local hardware store to have a clue about it. Security doors, hardware, and framing are notoriously ignored in residential construction to this day.

Being gun forum, of course, all this is ignored because the focus is on the gun first and foremost as the solution to all problems, when in fact it is the tool of LAST resort. If anything this is a classic example of people living in a safe bubble who have finally risked all the odds and were found wanting. We can criticize tactics and application all day - the facts speak for themselves, when actually confronted by the perp, the homeowner got himself shot, evacuated leaving his spouse behind, and made for the neighbors.

It would have been better to sell the guns and fix the real problem, a complete lack of any security and no idea of what to do about it. Classic case of "a gun will protect me" when the reality is " I lived practically defenseless and depended on a worst case solution."

 

[Captain33036]

Very sad.
Have a plan before anything happens. Stick to that plan.

BR door locked
Alarms on all doors and windows
Weapon within reach while sleeping
Cell phone within reach while sleeping.
If possible....wifi cam with view of important areas.
Keep a small light on in main part of the home (helps the cam see and can cast shadow under BR door)

You hear something: turn on cam app on your cell phone, look through your home.
If alarm goes off and you are sure someone is in the home (hear someone, or see shadows under BR door
Hunker down in far corner, be armed, weapon with light trained on locked BR door.
[all other family members know to stay put with doors locked]
Call police.

BG comes in through the door....light on, ID as BG, BG in small area, illuminated, possibly cannot see because of light, YOU are already aimed....

 

[ATLDave]

A few weeks ago, my wife and I awoke to a sudden, loud noise downstairs at about 1am. After listening for a few seconds, I decided the TV downstairs was on. The dogs weren't going nuts. I looked out the upstairs window and so no strange car in the driveway or parked on the street. I retrieved the bedside gun (just in case) and went downstairs to turn off the TV. After a little bit of thought, I realized that we had stopped watching an on-demand movie but never turned off the TV. An hour or so later, the cable box reverted to live TV, and with the volume up for the movie, voila, big noise in the middle of the night.

If I had "sheltered in place" waiting for the "intruder" to come upstairs, I'd still be waiting. If I'd have called the police to turn off my TV for me, I'd have made a right fool of myself. Sometimes you just have to go check noises yourself. It's part of being a grownup.

 

[scaatylobo]

And I think that's a very good question to ask.

Anyone rummaging through my house is not going to come away with anything irreplaceable which is why I pay for homeowner's insurance. So, in a situation like this:

• Quietly get out of bed and lock the bedroom door
• Wake my wife and get her to call 911
  
• Retrieve my SD weapon.
• Wait.

If the home invader is just "shopping" and gets what he wants out of the medicine cabinet in the guest bathroom then he'll probably just grab some pawnable stuff and leave. Then its just a question of making nice with the police when they come to take the report and do the fingerprinting.

RESULT:

• No shooting, so no police investigation into whether or not is was "good".
• No civil suit for wrongful death of the home invader
• A shopping trip paid for by the insurance company.

On the other hand, if the home invader is looking for trouble then by staying put I gain an advantage because I know he has to come through the bedroom door. And while he fiddles with the door knob or tries to knock down the door, I know exactly where he is and what type of entry he is trying to make, so I have time to take up an optimal position.

RESULT:

• It's the home invader with the belly wound and not me.
• 911 tape documenting what led up to the shooting meaning greater chance the shooting will be "good".

Thank you, sound judgement and thought out IN ADVANCE.

And to all who want to "cowboy up",hope you already made plans to be out of the house for the time it takes to clean up the blood & brain matter ?.

And of course you keep the number of the company that does that service ?.

And you know you will NOT be sleeping in your house until the police release it = AND the smell and gore are cleaned up [ ask your wife and kids if they would stay there ].

Avoidance is ALWAYS the best course,involving use of force and a shoot scenario = always.

IF & WHEN you are ever involved in such,I am POSITIVE you will grasp that.

 

[Kleanbore]

I hear bumps in the night and investigate when they happen,...

I used to do that.

it's always turned out to be nothing, but I still check it out as if it is something, with a light and 19 rounds of 9mm.

Yeah. And if it is something,....

If someone is in my house at night uninvited bad things are bound to happen.

Best to mitigate that risk. Always.

 

[bassjam]

I just have to ask, where do you guys live that you just call the cops every time you hear a bump in the night?

#1 if I and the people I know called the police every time we heard a bump in the night the county would have to at least double the number of police on duty... to investigate stray dogs

#2 if someone is in my house I don't really want to just hunker down for the three to five hours it's going to take the police to get there. Not to mention, I have kids in two other rooms.

In the real world, at least the one I live in, you just investigate yourself. Like the guy did that got shot. The question is how to do it without being the one that gets shot.

100% correct. I have pets. They make noise. Last night I heard pots and pans crash in the kitchen, when I went to investigate it turns out it was the cats being ********. I'd waste the police's time many times a year if I called every time there was a loud noise in the house.

I also have kids. What kind of parent barricades themselves in a bedroom and lets their kids fend for themselves? When you have kids you do whatever you can to protect them. If I got up in the night to investigate a sound and found someone in my bathroom armed, I would do WHATEVER it takes to stop them, regardless of if I was armed or not. If I was unarmed I certainly wouldn't leave to go find a gun, both of my kid's bedrooms are directly across the hall from that bathroom. Instead I'd count of my wife retrieving the gun from the bedroom and coming to help.

Without knowing MANY more details we can't really criticize the homeowner from the comfort of our keyboards.

 

[ATLDave]

For those of you who say you never investigate noises in your own homes, how many times per year do you call the police to your home?

 

[ClickClickD'oh]

If I had "sheltered in place" waiting for the "intruder" to come upstairs, I'd still be waiting. If I'd have called the police to turn off my TV for me, I'd have made a right fool of myself.

For those of you who say you never investigate noises in your own homes, how many times per year do you call the police to your home?

You know, there's a term for when a person attempts to discredit another persons position by relying on absurd extremes that were never meant to be included.

 

[ATLDave]

I don't think I'm relying on "absurd extremes" at all. The "absurd extreme" is the rare instance in which an odd noise in the house actually IS an intruder. It's all well and good to say "shelter in place" when you know the odd noise is from an intruder. Provided there are no other "friendlies" (kids, other relatives less able to defend themselves, etc.) in the house, and provided the police are reasonably responsive in your area, that makes good sense.

But we all hear noises from time to time. We don't know in advance that they are definitely not intruders. In fact, we think they probably aren't - something just fell off a shelf due to vibrations, or a piece of electronic gear switched on pursuant to some piece of code, or a mouse has decided to infiltrate the basement, or whatever. And 99+% of the time, we're right. It's just a noise, not a home invasion or burglary. In many cases, one only knows in retrospect that the noise was an intruder.

So advice that says "never go confront an intruder - if you hear a noise, hide and call 911" is, itself, an absurd extreme. Sensible advice would be, "If you are reasonably certain that it is a human intruder, and there are no other persons in the home that you need to protect, shelter in place, call 911, arm self, and wait for the professionals to sort it out while (perhaps) shouting warnings." But leaving out those conditions makes the advice absurdly overbroad... and leads to ridiculous second-guessing of unlucky individuals who were doing "normal" things and drew the short straw.

 

[Captain33036]

And that is why wifi cams are very helpful. Avoidance is a good rule...use technology to help you see through your home. Simple.

And I seriously doubt that anyone calls 911, every time they hear a simple noise. It is pretty easy to listen for a short while to determine whether or not there is someone in your home. And, if you think there is, a wifi cam comes in handy.

Defense in depth. Lights....then alarms...then cam.....Have a plan. Use tools.

 

[ClickClickD'oh]

I don't think I'm relying on "absurd extremes" at all.

You just posted about getting a gun to clear the house because you left a TV on in contrast to your mistaken belief that someone in this thread thinks you should shelter in place and call the police if you leave your TV on. Your mistaken interpretation of other peoples post, and your idea of how to handle it are both in themselves absurd extremes. No one said to shelter in place if you left your tv on and, LOL at getting the gun to turn your TV off.

It was all absurdly extreme.

So advice that says "never go confront an intruder - if you hear a noise, hide and call 911" is, itself, an absurd extreme.

Well, that's two posts and two logical fallacies. You are on a roll.

No one ever said that. You just invented that to discredit a position that doesn't exist.

 

[Kleanbore]

So advice that says "never go confront an intruder - if you hear a noise, hide and call 911" is, itself, an absurd extreme.

Really? "Never go and confront an intruder" is excellent advice. Now, I have never heard anyone recommend hiding and calling 911 every time one hears a noise. That would be absurd. There is the little matter of listening and trying to evaluate the noise.

Sensible advice would be, "If you are reasonably certain that it is a human intruder, and there are no other persons in the home that you need to protect, shelter in place, call 911, arm self, and wait for the professionals to sort it out while (perhaps) shouting warnings."

That is of course what one should do if one is in fact "reasonably certain" that an intruder is present. But to adopt that strategy only under such conditions would constitute a very imprudent approach to risk management.

 

[bassjam]

You know, there's a term for when a person attempts to discredit another persons position by relying on absurd extremes that were never meant to be included.

How in the WORLD was anything he mentioned an "absurd extreme"?

We've all heard those bumps in the night. That's not an absurd extreme. Until you go to investigate, you don't really know if you've got an intruder, a rodent, a kid getting a midnight snack, or a ghost. That's the point he was trying to make. There has been one time where I was 100% sure there was someone in my basement from the noise I heard down there. I grabbed a gun, my phone, and a flashlight and went to check it out. I never did find out what caused those boxes to fall over as I lived alone and had no pets at the time.

That kind of stuff happens to all of us. Those aren't absurd extreme's, it's everyday life.

 

[ATLDave]

Maybe a hypothetical (but very common) situation will help move this forward.

A homeowner/resident, asleep on the upper floor of his home, is awakened at 2am by a single loud noise that he thinks came from the ground floor. His wife is also awakened, and asks him, "Did you hear that?" He responds, "yes." They sit very quiet and still for another 20-30 seconds waiting to see if any more information comes in the form of more noise or otherwise... all remains quiet. They live in "nice" but not inaccessible neighborhood, and have no special reason to think anyone would be targeting them. He is reasonably sure that it is "nothing," but is not (and cannot be, without further information) absolutely certain that it is "nothing." Should the guy:

A) Retrieve his firearm, shove the furniture against the door, call 911, and wait until either the cops break down his front door to clear the lower level or the intruder appears; or
B) Content himself in the knowledge that is it probably nothing and go back to sleep; or
C) Use a time-machine to travel into the past and outfit his house with security measures befitting a high-end jewelry store, but with more claymores; or
D) Cautiously go through his own house, with a gun and a flashlight in hand just in case it's an unlikely-but-not-impossible worst-case scenario; or
E) Some materially different approach that you describe more fully?

I'll add D1) Same as D, but leave the firearm behind because, lacking years of experience clearing houses in Kandahar, the person will end up with his own brains on his walls, and, in the unlikely event that it turns out there is an intruder, it's better to face them unarmed.

 

[ClickClickD'oh]

How in the WORLD was anything he mentioned an "absurd extreme"?

You just posted about getting a gun to clear the house because you left a TV on in contrast to your mistaken belief that someone in this thread thinks you should shelter in place and call the police if you leave your TV on. Your mistaken interpretation of other peoples post, and your idea of how to handle it are both in themselves absurd extremes. No one said to shelter in place if you left your tv on and, LOL at getting the gun to turn your TV off.

It was all absurdly extreme.

We've all heard those bumps in the night. That's not an absurd extreme. Until you go to investigate, you don't really know if you've got an intruder, a rodent, a kid getting a midnight snack, or a ghost.

You know, one of the things I find most hilarious about being a hunting guide are the things that go "bump", or more accurately "rustle rustle" in the darkest parts of the night right before dawn. I don't know how many hunters I have sat with who were absolutely convinced that the armadillo grubbing under the stand, or the squirrel climbing a nearby tree were actually giant bucks trying to sneak by in the predawn. And don't even get me started if there are two birds in a nearby cedar. They become absolutely convinced the reason there are noises coming from multiple points is because of a HUGE rack. The untrained human mind, put in a position where it is deprived of the full uses of it's senses is create a creating things that aren't there, and ignoring those things that are there.

Oddly enough, that experience directly relates to hunting humans in the dark too. Usually with the exact same observations related to those dabbling in the craft.

I know it's fashionable on gun forums to no matter what, never under any circumstances, reveal that somone might not be the most ultra high speed, low drag, most tacticalest, gunslinger elite... But I wasn't kidding when I wrote:

Properly searching a structure is best done with 1) Proper training that most civilian gun owners don't have,

Most of you have no clue what so ever how to clear a structure. That you guys post stories of yourselves grabbing a handgun off the nightstand then walking through the house by yourself confirms that. Every post I read is head shaking, face palming confirmation of that.

Anyone that has done this stuff for real, against actual angry, mean and violent human beings, will tell you that the bleary eyed, just woke up, confused and disoriented home owner is at best even odds with the intruder but most of the time at a disadvantage. If even odds or losing odds are good odds for you, go ahead, search the house. It's not my brains that will be on the wall.

 

[ATLDave]

I know it's fashionable on gun forums to no matter what, never under any circumstances, reveal that somone might not be the most ultra high speed, low drag, most tacticalest, gunslinger elite...

Stipulating that the person in question is not a Tier 1 Operator, what's the answer to this hypothetical (re-posted from above):

A homeowner/resident, asleep on the upper floor of his home, is awakened at 2am by a single loud noise that he thinks came from the ground floor. His wife is also awakened, and asks him, "Did you hear that?" He responds, "yes." They sit very quiet and still for another 20-30 seconds waiting to see if any more information comes in the form of more noise or otherwise... all remains quiet. They live in "nice" but not inaccessible neighborhood, and have no special reason to think anyone would be targeting them. He is reasonably sure that it is "nothing," but is not (and cannot be, without further information) absolutely certain that it is "nothing." Should the guy:

A) Retrieve his firearm, shove the furniture against the door, call 911, and wait until either the cops break down his front door to clear the lower level or the intruder appears; or
B) Content himself in the knowledge that is it probably nothing and go back to sleep; or
C) Use a time-machine to travel into the past and outfit his house with security measures befitting a high-end jewelry store, but with more claymores; or
D) Cautiously go through his own house, with a gun and a flashlight in hand just in case it's an unlikely-but-not-impossible worst-case scenario; or
D1) Same as D, but leave the firearm behind because, lacking years of experience clearing houses in Kandahar, the person will end up with his own brains on his walls, and, in the unlikely event that it turns out there is an intruder, it's better to face them unarmed; or
E) Some materially different approach that you describe more fully?
​

 

[bassjam]

You know, one of the things I find most hilarious about being a hunting guide are the things that go "bump", or more accurately "rustle rustle" in the darkest parts of the night right before dawn. I don't know how many hunters I have sat with who were absolutely convinced that the armadillo grubbing under the stand, or the squirrel climbing a nearby tree were actually giant bucks trying to sneak by in the predawn. And don't even get me started if there are two birds in a nearby cedar. They become absolutely convinced the reason there are noises coming from multiple points is because of a HUGE rack. The untrained human mind, put in a position where it is deprived of the full uses of it's senses is create a creating things that aren't there, and ignoring those things that are there.

Oddly enough, that experience directly relates to hunting humans in the dark too. Usually with the exact same observations related to those dabbling in the craft.

I know it's fashionable on gun forums to no matter what, never under any circumstances, reveal that somone might not be the most ultra high speed, low drag, most tacticalest, gunslinger elite... But I wasn't kidding when I wrote:



Most of you have no clue what so ever how to clear a structure. That you guys post stories of yourselves grabbing a handgun off the nightstand then walking through the house by yourself confirms that. Every post I read is head shaking, face palming confirmation of that.

Anyone that has done this stuff for real, against actual angry, mean and violent human beings, will tell you that the bleary eyed, just woke up, confused and disoriented home owner is at best even odds with the intruder but most of the time at a disadvantage. If even odds or losing odds are good odds for you, go ahead, search the house. It's not my brains that will be on the wall.

Well aware of the noise a rodent makes in the woods. And well aware that an unwanted human in a house can be exceptionally silent, except maybe for the initial force of entry.

That doesn't disqualify anyone from looking through their own house when you hear those noises, when 99% of the time they are just that, noises. I find it face palming to suggest hiding in your bedroom and wasting the police's time with such ventures. Even more so when there's kids in other bedrooms.

 

[ATLDave]

That doesn't disqualify anyone from looking through their own house when you hear those noises, when 99% of the time they are just that, noises. I find it face palming to suggest hiding in your bedroom and wasting the police's time with such ventures. Even more so when there's kids in other bedrooms.

It's so face-palming that I seriously doubt anyone does that, unless they are so deaf they never hear any noises in their house. About the 3rd or 4th time the cops get called out for a false alarm, you're going to get a reputation... if one of the cops hasn't shot one of your dogs by then. Plus the expense of paying for the kicked-in doors.

 

[bassjam]

Stipulating that the person in question is not a Tier 1 Operator, what's the answer to this hypothetical (re-posted from above):

A homeowner/resident, asleep on the upper floor of his home, is awakened at 2am by a single loud noise that he thinks came from the ground floor. His wife is also awakened, and asks him, "Did you hear that?" He responds, "yes." They sit very quiet and still for another 20-30 seconds waiting to see if any more information comes in the form of more noise or otherwise... all remains quiet. They live in "nice" but not inaccessible neighborhood, and have no special reason to think anyone would be targeting them. He is reasonably sure that it is "nothing," but is not (and cannot be, without further information) absolutely certain that it is "nothing." Should the guy:

A) Retrieve his firearm, shove the furniture against the door, call 911, and wait until either the cops break down his front door to clear the lower level or the intruder appears; or
B) Content himself in the knowledge that is it probably nothing and go back to sleep; or
C) Use a time-machine to travel into the past and outfit his house with security measures befitting a high-end jewelry store, but with more claymores; or
D) Cautiously go through his own house, with a gun and a flashlight in hand just in case it's an unlikely-but-not-impossible worst-case scenario; or
D1) Same as D, but leave the firearm behind because, lacking years of experience clearing houses in Kandahar, the person will end up with his own brains on his walls, and, in the unlikely event that it turns out there is an intruder, it's better to face them unarmed; or
E) Some materially different approach that you describe more fully?
​

I think the answer is F) Log onto thehighroad and ask your friendly Tier 1 hunting guide how to proceed.

 

[ClickClickD'oh]

Stipulating that the person in question is not a Tier 1 Operator,

Again with the logic fallacies. Seriously, try posting once without one. No one said anything about Tier 1 Operators. You do understand that there is a large gap between untrained noob with a gun and a Navy SEAL right?

what's the answer to this hypothetical (re-posted from above):

Two things here:

1) Learn what a the False Dilema fallacy is, because you just committed it
2) You don't need to repost an unanswered question before allowing time to answer it. Your post was entered a grand total of 1 minute before mine and you waited a grand total of 10 minutes to repost. Seriously, that doesn't make you look like you have a point. Quite the contrary.

So:

A) Retrieve his firearm, shove the furniture against the door, call 911, and wait until either the cops break down his front door to clear the lower level or the intruder appears; or

Appeal to Extremes logical fallacy. Ignored

B) Content himself in the knowledge that is it probably nothing and go back to sleep; or

Appeal to Extremes logical fallacy. Ignored

C) Use a time-machine to travel into the past and outfit his house with security measures befitting a high-end jewelry store, but with more claymores; or

Appeal to Extremes logical fallacy. Ignored

Are you starting to understand why you committed the False Dilema fallacy?

D) Cautiously go through his own house, with a gun and a flashlight in hand just in case it's an unlikely-but-not-impossible worst-case scenario; or

You almost... almost were able to engage in an adult conversation... but then.

D1) Same as D, but leave the firearm behind because, lacking years of experience clearing houses in Kandahar, the person will end up with his own brains on his walls, and, in the unlikely event that it turns out there is an intruder, it's better to face them unarmed; or

Appeal to Extremes logical fallacy. Ignored

E) Some materially different approach that you describe more fully?

Well, there we go. See, you could have just left out all that logical fallacy stuff. Unfortunately, the answer to the question requires your original question to be re-written significantly. Because, as was previously noted by other posters, if your home defense plan counts on you sneaking up on a burglar and winning a gun fight with them, your home defense plan sucks. It's not a marginal plan. It's not a bad plan. It's a terrible, irresponsible disaster of a plan.

So, let's re-write your schenario so that it proposes a homeowner that has half a brain:

A homeowner/resident, asleep on the upper floor of his home, is awakened at 2am by a single loud noise that he thinks came from the ground floor. His wife is also awakened, and asks him, "Did you hear that?" He responds, "yes." They sit very quiet and still for another 20-30 seconds waiting to see if any more information comes in the form of more noise or otherwise... all remains quiet. They check their alarm panel and there are no indications of trouble in any zones including the motion sensors. The dog sleeping at the end of the bed perks it's ears up them as they talk, but otherwise is unconcerned.

Yeah, roll over and go back to sleep is the proper response to those indicators.

That doesn't disqualify anyone from looking through their own house when you hear those noises,

I didn't disqualify anyone. I said it was a stupid horrible plan likely to get you killed.

I find it face palming to suggest hiding in your bedroom and wasting the police's time with such ventures.

Well, I didn't. So, Strawman award for you.

Can either of you actually address statements that have been made instead of just making up an argument to topple over?[/quote]

 

[ATLDave]

I want to get this straight. Your answer is "go back to sleep" because going downstairs where there might be an intruder is too dangerous? Remarkable.

As for the false dilemma fallacy, I don't think that's remotely applicable. You seem to be ignoring the uncertainty factor. Yes, if you know there's an intruder, the right answer is X and if you know there's not an intruder, the right answer is Y. But sometimes you don't know either of those things. And in the face of such uncertainty, either X or Y is not optimal.

Your argument reminds me of the argument against CC that goes like this: "If I thought I was headed someplace so dangerous I needed a gun, I wouldn't go to that place!" Well, sure, if you know you're going to need a gun, sure, skip it. What if you're just 99.9% sure you won't? Don't go? Stay at home from everywhere?

 

[bassjam]

Well, I didn't. So, Strawman award for you.

Can either of you actually address statements that have been made instead of just making up an argument to topple over?

That is EXACTLY what you said. See below.

Pretty much. Barricade in a safe area, protect the entry way, call 911 and hunker down. An ambush is always better than a meeting engagement.

Properly searching a structure is best done with 1) Proper training that most civilian gun owners don't have, 2) A group of like minded and armed friends & 3) A dog. A big, bittey dog.

I didn't disqualify anyone. I said it was a stupid horrible plan likely to get you killed.

Please provide statistics on the likely hood of someone searching their own home getting killed. I've seen the "Armed Citizens" in the NRA mags where 90 year old men (and women) search their own home with a gun and "get the bad guy". Prove to me those are anomalies, and that most people who do this die.