How do we help California?

[danez71]

This discussion is about STATE politics. And in Arkansas we have made a political revolution. We HAVE pro-gun majorities in both houses.

Now if California and a few other states would get off their butts and create pro-gun majorities in their states, we'd be much stronger at the national level.

No. You're wrong again.

The thread asked how can others help California.


Your only intention by posting in this thread was to mock Californian and it's citizens.

 

[JO JO]

danez71 do you think you are the only one that can have an opinion to post
on this topic ?
danez71 you by far are the worst one here you attack each post it is really unfair to the good folks on THR.
I guess you are a party of 1 as only your OPINION counts !

 

[danez71]

Jo Jo

If that's how you feel when some one corrects another, then so be it.

 

[barnbwt]

danez71 do you think you are the only one that can have an opinion to post on this topic ?

A crude person might make a crack about Californians' high opinion of their opinions, but I'm too high and mighty for that.

Danez71;
"The thread asked how can others help California."
I'll try to summarize my long paragraphs;
-You say Californian gun owners are fighting with all their strength at this point, and I have no reason to disbelieve you
-You are clearly descending and at an increasing rate into a dystopia where guns are banned in every way imaginable
-There is a very limited degree to which non-residents can in any way influence your local politics, even if your politics influences theirs through the district courts (which is why it's really dumb to think those outside your state "just don't care" or are taunting you for kicks)

Tell me how victory is even conceivable given those conditions. Whether you feel the efforts of the gun groups is appreciated, or genuine, or righteous, is irrelevant. We're talking about victory. Depending on what kind of Californian you are, it may seem strange that any "assistance" be tied to realistic or even plausible results, but it is a finite resource whose potential benefit to your state must necessarily be weighed against its actual benefit locally. The only "help" California can get is a more rapid descent into collapse & some kind of federal stewardship (by a government more concentrated with pro-gunners due to their exodus from CA, btw) a la Reconstruction to bring your corrupt governments back closer in line with the nation as a whole. Won't be fun, nor pretty, nor will the results most likely be desirable for a long time, but I suppose it's better to deal with it now than later (an attitude surely not found among the previous generations who let things deteriorate to this degree)

"Why don't those in other states start pressuring your State and US Reps to support CA and the other anti 2A states?"
What would this look like, exactly? Don't you think it'd be a bit presumptuous for Texas State Government to begin meddling directly in sovereign Californian affairs (not to mention probably illegal)? What, is our governor supposed to deploy our national guard to enforce the rule of law and justice in your state? Subsidize your political groups with our tax dollars, illegally? Do you see the problem, here?

Vern;
"Which is due to lack of WORK on the part of Conservatives in California."
Darn straight. If it makes the Californian dissidents 'feel' better, you guys do appear to be actually fighting nowadays, now that you've already lost the war. Small consolation. But the fact of the matter is, that previous generations, who didn't have such steep obstacles to overcome, were not only not defending gun rights, they were among the sources of the worst kind of short-sighted Fuddery around. The mid-west, too. When Reagan shut down open carry because of the Panthers...did anyone care? Or did the great majority of even gun owners think it was responsible policy in the face of scary civil unrest? Same question about Nixon's rise to power, one of if not the most overtly anti-gun president we've ever had (look it up; the man hated guns, but had little political capital to spend on them)

Danez;
"Because of the lack of WORK of all those other states, including you and yours, we lack a 'true conservative candidate' running for president."
For all the talk about how he only ever took off because of Trump, Cruz had this election in the bag with a long term strategic path to victory. He had constructed or infiltrated local, grass roots political orgs the whole nation over (all that primary "corruption" with delegates Trump was whining about was basically due to Cruz's people having seized the machinery of the GOP out from under the party leaders) with a very serious and shrewd campaign with a lot WORK, but relied on a 'slow burn' effect of organic growth in popularity over the contest (his poll numbers actually rose very steadily right up until he was in contention for the lead, whereas most every other candidate peaked and fizzled rapidly). Sadly, neither he nor anyone else had counted on dealing with a full-on media frenzy lasting six whole months (seriously, the media has never been so fixated since Obama ran, and even he never took off till halfway through the primary) --were it not for media appeal, Trump's utter lack of any kind of strategy or plan for cobbling together a political party beyond winning the office for himself would have ultimately doomed his chances. Contrary to popular belief, there actually is a reason for political parties, and the notion he'd be able to run as basically an independent without losing his down-ticket congressional support was and still is laughable. He's recently showing signs of finally getting wise to this gambit & trying to act like a leader instead of a heckler, but it may ultimately be too little too late.

"there are people in CA that are fighting."
The way an infant may fight Muhammad Ali. The resistance is of course fierce among the few left fighting there; you guys have practically no alternative if you are to remain gun owners at this point. The only gun owners left in CA who would speak out (i.e. non-criminals), are those so die-hard about owning weapons they would bother with all the onerous registrations and regulations and fees --and of course those policies make them mad as hell, and eager to let the world know. But far, far greater numbers of gun owners have either left to states that are more in line with the amount of effort/risk they wish to expend on the issue, or given up owning guns in CA completely.

These laws which dissuade the less-motivated have the effect of basically 'radicalizing' (ideologically) the members of the afflicted group to a more distilled mass, with clearer goals and greater unity. This makes the now-smaller group more effective for its size, and actually is one of the ways free speech keeps a popular government stabilized against abusing its minority groups.

There is still a limit, though, and CA is clearly beyond the point the few remaining True Believers can defend the Pass of Thermopylae from Kamala Xerxes, no matter how great their strength of will. That's why ya'll are about to lose semi-autos, from what I understand; that was your must win fight, and losing it means victory cannot come from within. As I stated earlier, there are necessary restraints on what kinds of assistance can come from without, and it's basically just through the courts --sadly, the courts themselves are 'within' CA at the district level for all intents and purposes, and the only authority higher is from an even more corrupt morass in DC.

CA may need your fighting resolve, but it no longer deserves it. Better you spend it shoring up solid or winnable territory, wise to exactly what is being fought against, than to squander it in a Quixotic ordeal that ultimately breaks you. I'd love to see what all the members of Calguns could do for the other 45 states, working just as hard to spread the word and inform the ignorant just how important this issue is. I'll bet they'd convert a hell of a lot more senators than they ever will in California. Maybe at that point, the 45 free states would be unified enough to MAKE California respect their peoples' civil liberties.

CA can't win the battle itself. There are no practical legal avenues by which those outside your state can win your battles for you. There is no long-term victory on the horizon --even the brilliant Peruta ruling was simply ignored and discarded arbitrarily when push came to shove. It will only get worse so long as you keep doing the same thing. Leave. Withdraw what remaining legitimacy you grant their system by continuing to live within it, and cease allowing them to siphon you for taxes and business. You might as well escape that collapsing star before passing over the event horizon --before your last property is stolen at gun point to support the dying apparatus keeping you disarmed*

TCB

*hint; this is the final step, such that there is one. It is almost exclusively what led to the historic mass-migration waves into this country

 

[wolf]

CA does not need help

very thoughtful replies to a "problem" that in not isolated to CA..and will be coming to a city and state near you soon..

like the plot of the movie Invasion of the Body Snatchers..it all will seem normal "after the conversion"

I have been in Los Angeles for almost 50 years..its all changed..if you were not here then..you would not believe me about how it used to be..every aspect is different..

now several mayors of los angeles proclaim..in public and in the mainstream media.."Los Angeles is a Mexican City.." at first I was angry at the statement..but then I realized..its true...Los Angeles county-largest population in the US-is 55% Hispanic..and growing ..

CA is a sanctuary STATE..immigrants (the state dropped any and all qualifications to this term) will soon have voting rights as soon as the register through motor voter..when they apply for and are granted a drivers license..

Mexico's government has very tight restrictions on gun possession..certain types and calibers are allowed in the home but not in public..AFAIK you can only purchase/obtain a hand gun from a govt approved outlet/army base etc..Mexico took over all private/retail sales stores.

so it will not be much of a change to the population of los angeles if gun stores are taken over by federal/state law..and in time few will remember when you could buy a 12 guage-no questions asked-at a walk in sporting store..

recent events of "mass shootings" and the political environment in CA will bring change to the gun issue faster than in most other states..the recent decision of the 9th Circuit court is a barometer of this attitude..should the Federal politics change in November..you will see drastic change in gun laws in CA..Los Angeles already has passed several regarding ammo and magazine limits..and wants more laws passed regarding "smart guns" and storage.

there really is only one political party in CA..again much like Mexico..it will be a familiar structure to all our new citizens..

there was a ground swell of political activity to change the direction of the state in 1994--Prop 187--the measure passed at 66%..it was overturned by the courts..and the One Party system was assured at its death...

I find it fascinating to observe - the metamorphosis - of a socio-political organ such as a state..that really is very different from the rest of the country..the extremes of political..financial..educational..and welfare concerns are here and in full bloom..

the state is broke..really..no one seems to care and few actually know about it..the governor is a character from the mad hatters tea party..funding a bullet train for 100 billion+ that will take approx. 25 years to build..no one seems to mind..there are no demonstrations or ballot measures to stop it..

the woman who is in charge of the states university system is out of central casting..few know who she is..the board of regents has turned into a rubber stamp factory of tuition hikes and tax increases to fund the schools..its sad..CA schools used to be the best in the nation..now there are rebellion warehouses

the beaches are crowded every weekend and folks seem to be having a great time ..

who needs help...

 

[Al Thompson]

And, we are done.