How many guns will fire when dropped?

[BBQJOE]

I don't generally drop any of my guns.
But how many are out there that will fire when dropped?
Does it need to be cocked first?
Will it fire if it lands on the hammer with one in the chamber?

I can't imagine any modern day gun being built that would allow this to happen.

 

[oneounceload]

Some shotguns will

 

[Chevelle SS]

A lot of older shotguns

 

[Archaic]

I know for a damn sure fact that a Winchester Model 97 shotgun will go off if you lay it in the back seat of a Buick and slam the door into the stock.

 

[TanklessPro]

The ones in movies. They can fire several times if dropped down stairs.

 

[hovercat]

I am seriously interested in this topic. I know that my old Colt Police Positive will not, that was one of Colt's sales pitches. But does my 50's vintage S&W I frame have what we call a transfer bar? When did this become the norm?

 

[BK]

-if you lay it in the back seat of a Buick and slam the door into the stock.

That's a refief! Because I have a Crown Victoria.

 

[steelerdude99]

The ones in movies. They can fire several times if dropped down stairs.

I saw some strange show called Strange but True or something like that this past weekend. As we are on the topic of drop guns firing, I thought I would share this one:

Some lady had a bad dream about “having a gun in the house” and worried that somehow a family member would be shot. In her dream, she had a double action revolver which did not fire on several chambers when trying to shoot an intruder. Then in real life a few nights later, the exact same thing happened. The double action revolver did not fire when trying to shoot an intruder. BUT the “intruder” was her son who was “visiting late at night” unannounced. BUT IT gets better… she is so happy to see him and that he did not get shot … she drops the gun at top of the steps and it fires multiple times in the way down the steps. BUT IT gets better… an intruder who had already broken in and was hiding downstairs right next to her son just moments ago. That intruder is shot and killed by the dropped handgun.

The viewing public must be naïve to believe just one part of it… But the entire load of BS back to back!!! The prop revolver used to film looked like a Smith and Wesson which should have a drop safety.

chuck

PS: I was channel surfing and not actually watching.

 

[oneounceload]

But does my 50's vintage S&W I frame have what we call a transfer bar? When did this become the norm?

Doesn't your I frame have the firing pin ON the hammer? Mine did

 

[rcmodel]

But does my 50's vintage S&W I frame have what we call a transfer bar?

No S&W ever made has a transfer bar.

All old S&W DA's, and all post war S&W's have a rebound slide that blocks the bottom of the hammer. It only clears the hammer when the trigger is pulled.

In addition, all post-war S&W's have a positive manual steel hammer block that is always between the hammer and frame unless the trigger is pulled.

You can beat on the hammer with a hammer until you break the hammer spur and it simply will not fire unless the trigger is held back.

rc

 

[dmazur]

1. I believe SA revolvers without a transfer bar could fire if dropped on the hammer with hammer down on a loaded chamber. The safety practice for this type of revolver is to load only 5 and rest the hammer on an empty chamber.

2. Original 1911's did not have either a trigger- or grip safety-operated firing pin safety and these could fire if dropped from a considerable height to land on the muzzle, due to the intertia of the firing pin.

Does it need to be cocked first?

Both of these situations can occur with the gun uncocked. The problem is energy transfer to the primer, not an unintentional sear release of a cocked hammer.

Safety designs block the sear to prevent hammer (or striker) release until the safety is removed and the trigger is pulled, unless the dimensions change from wear, dirt accumulation, or something like "kitchen table" gunsmithing. Once the design is altered, a strong impact can cause a hammer (striker) to release even with the safety on. Or sometimes as soon as the safety is moved to "off", even if the trigger isn't pulled.

One solution to the SA revolver shortcoming was the transfer bar (Ruger), which can easily be seen rising in front of the frame-mounted firing pin as the hammer is cocked. If your hammer doesn't have a flat face, and there isn't a firing pin in the frame, there is a good chance the hammer is the firing pin.

There were two solutions to the 1911 shortcoming: One was to add some kind of firing pin safety, like the Series 80 Colts or the Schwartz. The other was to use a titanium firing pin, with insufficient inertia to set off the primer during the drop test.

This obviously isn't a complete answer to the question, but I hope it covers some of the elements...

 

[swalton1943]

I know for a fact that a cz-52 will fire when dropped with a round in the chamber. Come by and I'll show you the hole in my carport roof. Scared me but no-one hurt. round in chamber, hammer down, safety on!

 

[hovercat]

Thank you, RC. One ounce, yes. I did not know the proper term. Today was not a waste, I learned something new!

 

[SunnySlopes]

An Uzi will keep firing full-auto non-stop when dropped out of an automobile. I saw it in a movie. It kept spinning and firing and shot up Jeff's car.

And I've seen several cases where the gun was dropped down the stairs and every time it hit a step (it kept going like a slinky) it shot a bad guy. Don't remember which movie that was.

Guns are mischievous, that's for sure.

 

[dmazur]

Don't remember which movie that was.

True Lies. (And it is a popular enough Hollywood effect that there are probably many others.)

 

[Dean Weingarten]

I think many of the inexpensive semi-auto handguns such as the Raven are capable of firing if dropped. A lot of rifles can do so as well, espescially those with very light triggers.

I have read of a couple of incidents where the mini-revolvers such as North American Arms can fire if droped and the person who loded it did not use the between chamber safety notch.

Most of the older single action revolvers can fire if dropped on the hammer.

 

[GRIZ22]

What would be considered quality 25s like the Baby Browning or any striker fired gun can go off if dropped in addition to less expensive guns like the Raven. Safeties that only lock the trigger not the hammer like the Beretta 1934/35 or 870. I've seen an 870 go off being dropped hard on the stock.

 

[Jim Watson]

The Remington double derringer is heavy in the butt and has thin action pins that are prone to bend or shear upon impact. That launches a .41 back up at you.

 

[MedWheeler]

If you really want to see some crazy, free-firing guns in action, watch the movie "Shoot 'Em Up." Yeah, I know, real creative title.

Just don't actually pay anything to watch it if you can avoid that.

The Kel-Tec P11 has the potential to fire if dropped just right, as does its great-grandfather, the Grendel P10. These guns have shrouded hammers, so you cannot bump them. But, if the gun is falling muzzle-down and hits the floor, the forward inertia of the hammer can carry it through to discharge the firearm.

The PF9 is of the previously hammer-blocked-by-sear design, so it cannot.

The Heritage Rough Rider S/A revolver can, in theory, fire if impacted just right. Heritage recommends empty-chamber-under-hammer carry for this reason.

Those are just the couple of modern-made guns I have experience with that could fire under the right conditions if dropped. Oh, my Phoenix HP22A probably could, too, if the hammer was at rest on a loaded chamber and the slide-mounted safety was off.

 

[Tomcat47]

I have thought about this from time to time myself and I know some of the cheaper ones would be candidates, and a RG 22 will fire if it falls out of the car and lands on the hammer... My brother can testify to that....

Not only did it do it....... It killed a Plymouth Roadrunner! ... well actually just a little wound....

I have had a few XD's (striker fired pistols) and before I bought the first one, I admit I wanted nothing to do with a striker fired pistol, but then XD and there ingenuity put a grip safety along with the trigger safety and sold me on it.

I now carry XDs .45 and in my thinking it would be on the virtually impossible side to drop a XD and it go off, seeing that two safety mechanisms have to move in opposite directions....

But fear not it will happen on the big screen.... hollywood can make it happen!

 

[r1derbike]

I have thought about this from time to time myself and I know some of the cheaper ones would be candidates, and a RG 22 will fire if it falls out of the car and lands on the hammer... My brother can testify to that....

Not only did it do it....... It killed a Plymouth Roadrunner! ... well actually just a little wound....

I have had a few XD's (striker fired pistols) and before I bought the first one, I admit I wanted nothing to do with a striker fired pistol, but then XD and there ingenuity put a grip safety along with the trigger safety and sold me on it.

I now carry XDs .45 and in my thinking it would be on the virtually impossible side to drop a XD and it go off, seeing that two safety mechanisms have to move in opposite directions....

But fear not it will happen on the big screen.... hollywood can make it happen!

I carry my XD-S around the house by the grip below the grip safety. I used to carry it by the full grip with finger off trigger, but I thought, hey, I've seen some pretty weird stuff happen, so my carry now enables both safeties. May look like a pansy, but at least I'm a living pansy. I usually keep it in a holster, but sometimes it gets carried bare.

 

[BBQJOE]

The Heritage Rough Rider S/A revolver can, in theory, fire if impacted just right. Heritage recommends empty-chamber-under-hammer carry for this reason.

I own one of those in .22. Never dropped it though.

 

[herrwalther]

Stripped apart my AMT Backup and didn't see a drop safety type action. But don't figure it would fire when dropped because of the grip safety.

 

[Twiki357]

I have two O/U derringers, a Rohm and an EIG. The hammers on both actually rest on the firing pins which are in contact with the primers if the user doesn't partially cock the hammer so that it is up off of the firing pins. I have no doubt that they would fire if dropped on the hammer.

I doubt that the Kel-Tec P-11 mentioned in post #19 would fire as it is striker fired DAO and the striker is small and light and relies on spring power to contact the firing pin.

 

[Bigdog57]

My Colt M1991A1 would likely fire if dropped on it's hammer. I removed the Series 80 parts long ago. Improves the trigger pull. I make sure to NOT drop it.......