How many rounds needed to verify JHP reliability?
- Thread starter shamus
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NineseveN
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Exactly 347 rounds of 200-230grain, and 461 rounds of 115 to 199grain...anything lower than 115 needs exactly 14 rounds, and anything above 230grain needs 161.
No, I'm not serious. My thoughts are that it would depend on the gun, I usualy run 200-500 rounds into a gun over a short period of time before I badge it as 'reliable'...that included usually 100 or so HP's...more if there are problem experienced during the testing.
No, I'm not serious. My thoughts are that it would depend on the gun, I usualy run 200-500 rounds into a gun over a short period of time before I badge it as 'reliable'...that included usually 100 or so HP's...more if there are problem experienced during the testing.
wally
Member
Personally, once you've established the basic reliabilty of the gun, I'm then happy if the dirty guns feeds all the JHP I plan on carrying.
If it does this, to me after this basic test, the most important thing is to verify it often during the initial carry period to identify any issues that can only show up with actual carry -- things like rounds shifting in the mag causing failures, sensitivity to lint/hair/dirt pickup, problems form moisture and sweat etc.
When a new gun enters my carry rotation I empty it every trip to the range for about the first year, clean it afterwards and try to get to the range no less than once a week the first month, then the frequency drops as I gain confidence in it.
--wally.
If it does this, to me after this basic test, the most important thing is to verify it often during the initial carry period to identify any issues that can only show up with actual carry -- things like rounds shifting in the mag causing failures, sensitivity to lint/hair/dirt pickup, problems form moisture and sweat etc.
When a new gun enters my carry rotation I empty it every trip to the range for about the first year, clean it afterwards and try to get to the range no less than once a week the first month, then the frequency drops as I gain confidence in it.
--wally.
dfariswheel
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My system is to check the reliability of the gun, check the reliability of the gun/ammo combination, the type of lube and cleaning method, the holster and spare ammo carrier, and HOW I personally carry the gun and magazines.
First, I fire at least 200 rounds of cheaper ammo through the gun to break it in and turn up any possible defects in the gun.
After a through cleaning of the gun AND magazines, I'll fire at least 100 rounds of the defense ammo to check reliability and targeting.
This 100 rounds I fire in as many ways as possible, and without cleaning or re-lubing.
I fire slow fire, rapid fire, and with the gun in odd positions.
I always start each magazine off with the magazine fully loaded, a round in the chamber, and the gun in whatever condition it'll be carried in (cocked and locked, double action, etc).
The gun must fire ALL the verification rounds with ZERO failures of any kind.
Once the gun has handled the 100 round proof test, I again give the gun and magazines a thorough cleaning and lube.
I load it up and carry it and the spare magazines for several weeks, WITHOUT unloading, lubing or otherwise disturbing the gun OR magazines.
Then, just as I would in a real defense situation, I draw and shoot the gun empty, reload with the spare magazines and shoot them to check for any problems that might show up from having been carried.
While I check my defense gun EVERY DAY, this test will show up any problems caused by dust or dirt from carrying, degraded lube, ammo shifting in the magazines, or problems cause by the carry method.
As an example, lubes can evaporate, run off, wick off, or gum up.
Ammo in the magazines or in the gun can shift the top round into a position that might cause jams, OR in some cases, ammo can actually work it's way out of the spare magazines.
I once had a magazine pouch that after being carried for a long day, when the magazine was removed, there was a loose round in the bottom that movement had pushed out of the mag.
First, I fire at least 200 rounds of cheaper ammo through the gun to break it in and turn up any possible defects in the gun.
After a through cleaning of the gun AND magazines, I'll fire at least 100 rounds of the defense ammo to check reliability and targeting.
This 100 rounds I fire in as many ways as possible, and without cleaning or re-lubing.
I fire slow fire, rapid fire, and with the gun in odd positions.
I always start each magazine off with the magazine fully loaded, a round in the chamber, and the gun in whatever condition it'll be carried in (cocked and locked, double action, etc).
The gun must fire ALL the verification rounds with ZERO failures of any kind.
Once the gun has handled the 100 round proof test, I again give the gun and magazines a thorough cleaning and lube.
I load it up and carry it and the spare magazines for several weeks, WITHOUT unloading, lubing or otherwise disturbing the gun OR magazines.
Then, just as I would in a real defense situation, I draw and shoot the gun empty, reload with the spare magazines and shoot them to check for any problems that might show up from having been carried.
While I check my defense gun EVERY DAY, this test will show up any problems caused by dust or dirt from carrying, degraded lube, ammo shifting in the magazines, or problems cause by the carry method.
As an example, lubes can evaporate, run off, wick off, or gum up.
Ammo in the magazines or in the gun can shift the top round into a position that might cause jams, OR in some cases, ammo can actually work it's way out of the spare magazines.
I once had a magazine pouch that after being carried for a long day, when the magazine was removed, there was a loose round in the bottom that movement had pushed out of the mag.
Shawn Dodson
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- Dec 28, 2002
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Here's what I use:
Personal Defense Ammunition Functional Reliability Test for Semiautomatic Handguns (see: http://www.firearmstactical.com/briefs25.htm )
Personal Defense Ammunition Functional Reliability Test for Semiautomatic Handguns (see: http://www.firearmstactical.com/briefs25.htm )
M2 Carbine
member
If the gun is normally reliable with whatever practice ammo I've been shooting in it, I'll trust it after running several magazines of the new JHP through it.
When I'm going to shoot up whatever defense ammo I've had the gun loaded with, first thing I'll shoot the gun dry.
If it jams at that time then it's a big deal because those rounds would have been the rounds that I would have been counting on in a real shooting.
When I'm going to shoot up whatever defense ammo I've had the gun loaded with, first thing I'll shoot the gun dry.
If it jams at that time then it's a big deal because those rounds would have been the rounds that I would have been counting on in a real shooting.
schmeky
Member
What is your _ss worth? I say (based on nearly 30 years of handgun shooting) is that you should be able to shoot 500+ rounds with NO MALFUNCTIONS whatsoever with your prefered JHP with whatever auto you plan to carry.
To say 47, or 48, or 49 rounds out of 50 is acceptable is a crock. If your choosen auto cannot do 500+ W/O a jam means you should load your pistol with hardball. PERIOD.
Otherwise carry a revolver, can't remember a wheelgun jamming, or FTF, or FTE, stovepipe, etc.
To do otherwise is asking for a potential major adrenaline rush accompanied by a near death experience.
To say 47, or 48, or 49 rounds out of 50 is acceptable is a crock. If your choosen auto cannot do 500+ W/O a jam means you should load your pistol with hardball. PERIOD.
Otherwise carry a revolver, can't remember a wheelgun jamming, or FTF, or FTE, stovepipe, etc.
To do otherwise is asking for a potential major adrenaline rush accompanied by a near death experience.
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