How much do you trust your powder charge thrower?

[Jasper1573]

I have read various threads that mention this topic, but I wanted to resurrect it in a new thread to see specifically what powder chargers we believe are best and how much we trust in their accuracy...and to what extent do you believe their variations impact the accuracy of your rounds out past 100 yards.

I only have experience with the RCBS Uniflow powder charger, and I find it to be relatively reliable to within +/- .2 grain with stick powder and about +/- .1 grain with ball powder.

So, having said this, what are your expectations concerning your powder charging device and does it live up to those expectations well enough that you reload your rounds only checking every 10th round or so to ensure it is doing its job consistently?

Also, if the charge varies by +/- one or two tenths of a grain, how much do you believe that this affects the accuracy/consistency of your reloads, especially at ranges out past 100 yards?

It took me about a year to come to the conclusion that I could trust my powder charger to operate consistently and that I didn't have to weigh and trickle every round to get consistently accurate reloads. Do you all weigh every round or check every 10th round or so? In my limited experience, I have come to believe a tenth or two of a grain of powder doesn't adversely affect round consistency...I must qualify that I am not a bench rest shooter, but prefer F-Class style shooting.

I load on a single stage RCBS press and have no experience with progressives.

 

[gamestalker]

I'm probably the worst source to consult because I weigh each charge on my beam scale. Many years ago I used a powder measure and checked it against my beam scale, and even though the variance was not bad, it still bothered me to know my loads were running +/- .2 grs. on a good day. I never had anything bad happen, I'm just a perfectionist I guess, and that is a lot of what inspired me to reload in the first place.

 

[helotaxi]

A stable load isn't going to an appreciable difference in +/- 0.2gn charge for a rifle round. Slight differences in neck tension will have a bigger effect on ES and SD. This is based on the experience of the guy widely regarded as THE expert in benchrest shooting. He went to great lengths to uniform the neck tension on each piece of brass, but he threw his powder charges. He even demonstrated that exact charge weight wasn't the determining factor by building 15 loads, 5 at his normal setting on his powder measure, 5 one step higher and 5 one step lower and then proceeded to shoot them all in the same hole (sub 0.2" group).

 

[kelbro]

With the powders that I throw, I tend to check every 10-20 rounds. Never had an issue but it makes me feel better.

 

[MtnCreek]

With an established load, I drop / weigh about 20, dumping the charges back into the hopper, then I load away until I need to refill the powder hopper. If I'm going to run the hopper dry, I check each charge on the last 15 or so.

 

[cfullgraf]

It depends on the powder measure.

I currently have six different measures, the RCBS Little Dandy, RCBS Uniflow, Redding 10-X, Midway Indespensible, Dillon and Hornady L-N-L. All throw consistent charges within 0.1 grain once set and settled. I use ball, flake and extruded powders with the same accuracy.

Consistent operation is the key. Throw charges the same way each throw.

I check weigh about every 50 cartridges or so. A little more frequently on the progressives until I am comfortable that it is performing well. But the progressives, both the Dillon and the Hornady, has been just as consistent as my other measures.

For a while I had a Lee Perfect powder measure and could never get it to throw consistent charges.

 

[LoonWulf]

Ive got a Lee Perfect, and have found it to be quite accurate. I check every charge for my hunting ammo, and have only felt the need to adjust a few times. My range ammo i stay a grain under max, and check every 10, accuracy is usually about as good as my scale checked handloads.

 

[Jasper1573]

One reason I posted this thread...several months ago at an F-Class match I told several other shooters (in conversation during a lull in the match) that I didn't weigh every powder charge any more because I found my rounds to be just as accurate by check weighing every ten rounds or so. Upon saying this, I got a couple of questioning looks and one verbal, "Really?" to which I replied, "Yep." That was about the end of the conversation, but I wondered if I was really way off base in my opinion.

A quote borrowed from Brad Sauve, 2004 F-Class National Champion,

"Spend more time shooting than loading 'perfect' ammunition..."

 

[ranger335v]

I use a Redding powder measure, I am my own 'thrower' and I trust me completly.

 

[MtnCreek]

Ive got a Lee Perfect, and have found it to be quite accurate.

Does yours choke on flake powders? Always wondered if it was just mine, just me or if they all did it.

 

[wanderinwalker]

At least to 600 yards, as long as you're not experiencing major variations, I don't bother weigh charges either.

I have to agree with the idea that a good, reliable, stable load combination doesn't need to be exact to the N-th degree on charge weight. In fact, if I was shooting a combination that was AWESOME at x.0gr but went south at x.1, I'd go back to and try something different. Life's too short to waste crafting "perfect" rounds that still go in the 8-ring when you miss a wind change or lose the front sight.

Run the powder measure with the same force and technique each time and you might be surprised how accurate dropped charges are.

(Now I'm not condoning sloppy practices, but at the same time I feel it is necessary to take an honest look at what you're doing. A hunting rifle at 100-yards may go from 1.1" to .95" after you turn the necks. And you gained? But if you're a benchrester, the time you spend will be seen in the results.)

 

[RustyFN]

I have three powder measures. I have a Lee pro auto disk, Lee perfect powder measure and a Dillon powder measure. I bought them all at different times so when I started with each one I would check every 10 then 20 then 50. All three measures proved to be very consistant to where now after it's set where I want it when I start I will check maybe once in the middle and then at the end.

 

[Blue68f100]

Once I'm sure how a powder dispenses, I may weigh every round or not, depends on application. For my rifle hunting loads I weigh every one. For my pistol ammo loaded on AP, once dialed in, 1/200 or less.

Large Flake powders like Unique I no longer use since my dispenser spread was too great.

 

[Jasper1573]

I have read at least a couple of posts where a person owns more than one powder charger. Is this because you all tried several trying to find the one you like the most, or because you have each of your powder chargers set up to throw a certain charge?

 

[Winchester101]

For ammo for everyday use, I just throw my charges from a Lyman 55, an RCBS Uni or one of my other measures. As stated above, consistency in HOW you operate the measure is of utmost importance. With my old Lyman 55, if I watch my technique, the charges vary so little that it will barely move the pointer on a scale. Of course, for safety, I will weigh a charge every 20 or so, just to make sure nothing has moved.

When I'm really concerned about accuracy, I use a technique that I developed years ago that ensures the charges have the same weight and volume of powder from shot to shot. Through my own testing with a chronograph, this technique has proven to produce more consistent velocities. Now, lower standard deviations do not always translate into smaller groups, but they never hurt.

After I've developed a good load using weighed charges, and I want to run a batch I set up my powder measure to drop that nominal charge. Let's say 50.0grs. Then during the loading process I drop each powder charge into a scale pan and weigh it. Any drop that varies more than +/- 0.1gr is rejected. For instance, using the 50.0gr example, a 49.9gr charge would go into a case, while a 50.2gr charge would go back in the powder measure.

Again, this technique is no guarantee of better accuracy, especially in a sporting rifle. But since it takes almost no more time than just throwing charges straight from the measure, I use it when I really want to be picky.

W101

 

[LoonWulf]

MtnCreek, Ive never used any flake. I only load ball and stick right now.

 

[RustyFN]

I have read at least a couple of posts where a person owns more than one powder charger. Is this because you all tried several trying to find the one you like the most, or because you have each of your powder chargers set up to throw a certain charge?

I started with a Lee classic turret press and the pro auto disk. A few years later I added the Lee perfect powder measure because I thought I might like it better than using the double disk kit for rifle, and I did. Not too long ago I bought a Dillon 550 because I wanted to speed up a couple of calibers.

 

[jcwit]

I reload in batches of 50 rounds, I check the throw on the first round and on the last throw, throw # 50, I then seat the bullets and crimp. Then throw the next 50 and check the 50th throw, then seat and crimp the bullets.

I've never had to adjust the measure when using my Lee Perfect.

Measures I use are the Lee Perfect, always right on.
Lyman # 55, right on depending on powder
Hornady Bench Rest Grade Lock & Load, again right on depending of the powder.

 

[NCsmitty]

With my old Lyman 55, if I watch my technique, the charges vary so little that it will barely move the pointer on a scale.

When you use the "knocker" on each powder drop, regardless of powder type, the Lyman #55 measure is the most accurate measure that I have ever used. Staggering the measure slides properly with the use of the knocker, will give you tighter than +-.1 grain every time, regardless if it's flake, extruded, or ball powder.
IMO, it's the best measure for accuracy, whatever the price.



NCsmitty

 

[Walkalong]

I have read at least a couple of posts where a person owns more than one powder charger. Is this because you all tried several trying to find the one you like the most, or because you have each of your powder chargers set up to throw a certain charge?

I have a Hornady bushing type measure that I used for years until I replaced it with a Redding 10X. The Hornady worked well, and I made some parts so it would dump automatically on my Projector, but it was limited being a bushing type measure. I would buy extra bushing and hone them in between sizes sometimes to get a charge I wanted, but the 10X can obviously dump any charge weight, and is just dial it in and go.

I bought a BR-30 for use in Benchrest, and still use it for almost all my rifle loading. (.22 Hornet to .30-06) I bought a Niel Jones measure to "replace" it for Benchrest, but I could not throw charges any more consistently with it, so I sold it and kept using the BR-30.

I recently bought a .458 Winchester Mag, and the BR-30 will not throw that size charge, so I started using the measure that came with my LNL for that. The only change there was to buy the micrometer insert.

I am happy with all three of them.

If you keep them clean and oil free, they will drop consistent charges from start to finish of a run.

 

[[email protected]]

I use the hornady measure on my LNL progressive. After I get it set up I usually measure every 10 to 15 rounds if I am using a ball powder like accurate 2 or a small flake like bullseye. Both of these powders throw within .01 grain. If im using unique i normally check one in five. Unique meters good in my measure and is usually within .02 grains. Granted that around 97.365% of my reloading is plinking ammo loaded with a midrange charge for the given bullet and overall length. If I am loading a run of "it has to work" ammo then I tighten up my quality control since it is normally loaded to the MAX. Last week I was loading a run of 223 rem with some surplus wc846 powder and my measure was consistantly throwing 25 grains each time and after a few hundred rounds into it I was only weighing maybe one in 40. I also run a powder cop die and I check it every time.

 

[icanthitabarn]

I was given my only drop, an old Lyman #55. I only use it for rifles and trickle up and weigh on a balance beam. For pistol, I only use dips. No, I don't trust the powder drop, I have seen it vary too much.

 

[James2]

Also, if the charge varies by +/- one or two tenths of a grain, how much do you believe that this affects the accuracy/consistency of your reloads, especially at ranges out past 100 yards?

My Lyman 55 throws pretty consistent charges within .1 gr on most powders. I just load, and don't worry about what little diff .1 or .2 may make on rifle loads that take around 50 gr. Its not a substantial percentage of the total.

Now if that was .2 on a pistol load that only took 3.5 gr I would worry. As noted, operator technique is important to get consistency.

 

[cfullgraf]

I have read at least a couple of posts where a person owns more than one powder charger. Is this because you all tried several trying to find the one you like the most, or because you have each of your powder chargers set up to throw a certain charge?

RCBS Little Dandy was the first powder measure I owned. Used it for pistol. I don't use it much anymore because it is not very flexible with the fixed cavity rotors. Otherwise, it will stay in my inventory. I did get almost all the rotors when they were inexpensive ($2.98 ea).

RCBS Uniflow, purchased for my first rifle loading. It has evolved to be used for small rifle cartridges like 223 Remington and 17 Remington.

Midway indispensable, purchased when on sale, it has now been discontinued. It had a micrometer adjuster that I wanted to try and it has a larger hopper than the Uniflow. That is better for larger cartridges. I now use this measure only for larger cartridges like the 30-06, 6.5x54 Kurz Mauser and 308 Winchester. I liked the micrometer adjuster so I retrofitted it to the Uniflow.

Redding 10-X was purchased to replace the Little Dandy for handgun cartridges. Good measure.

Hornady L-N-L came with the Hornady L-N-L progressive press. After adding a second second baffle to the measure, it has performed well. But, I am considering modifying the Redding 10-X to use on the Hornady press.

The Dillon came with the Dillon SDB progressive press. Also, it works fine.

The Uniflow, Midway and Redding measures have been purchased over the past 30 years so it is not like I dropped a bunch of money at one time. Over time, I have come to prefer to not fool with changing them from one size cavity to another. I know, not a big deal, it is just one of my operating preferences.

 

[kingmt]

I depens on how fast I have it drop. I can set it to be right on the money but +.1 is OK for me. The Smart Reloader is spot on in measurements.