ECVMatt
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- Jan 7, 2004
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- 2,883
How would you handle this situation...
- Thread starter ECVMatt
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680x0
Member
Am I the lion, bicyclist, bystander, park ranger, or what?
I doubt a mountain lion would tackle me as I'm twice it's size
I doubt a mountain lion would tackle me as I'm twice it's size
TallPine
Member
Smaller rocks and higher velocity
OrvilleYertleson
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- Joined
- Nov 20, 2003
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- 398
well, like most people on this board, I would shoot the mountain lion.
If I did not have a gun, I would try to stab it with my knife.
If I did not have my knife and were completely unarmed, I would use whatever I could to make the mountain lion change it's mind about eating my friend. I wouldn't, however, have thrown rocks from a distance (I can't aim well enough to not hit the victim) and I wouldn't just tug on the body and yell.
If I did not have a gun, I would try to stab it with my knife.
If I did not have my knife and were completely unarmed, I would use whatever I could to make the mountain lion change it's mind about eating my friend. I wouldn't, however, have thrown rocks from a distance (I can't aim well enough to not hit the victim) and I wouldn't just tug on the body and yell.
El Tejon
Member
Magic pixie dust. Makes the pumas, bears, and black helicopters disappear.
Vern Humphrey
Member
Offer the lion some steak sauce.
:
After all, the people of California in their wisdom have decreed lions shouldn't be hunted. That means they have to be fed -- and what better food for a lion than a left-wing Kalifonicator?
:After all, the people of California in their wisdom have decreed lions shouldn't be hunted. That means they have to be fed -- and what better food for a lion than a left-wing Kalifonicator?
It appears that this was handled in the appropriate California PC manner. The victim gets to fight back with hands and rocks, then the "authorities" euthanize the animal. If the animal has offspring, establish a fund for the orphaned animals.
I really like these parts:
QUOTE]Three years later, a state law was passed prohibiting people from hunting or killing mountain lions.[/QUOTE]
It appears that there is no connection between the ban on hunting and the mountain lion population. It's all about encroachment by people.
I really like these parts:
QUOTE]Three years later, a state law was passed prohibiting people from hunting or killing mountain lions.[/QUOTE]
It appears that there is no connection between the ban on hunting and the mountain lion population. It's all about encroachment by people.
La Pistoletta
Member
Can't they use some tazer or powerful anaesthetic? Killing endangered species isn't good.
TallPine
Member
Where the heck are you from ....?
Mountain lions are no more endangered than white tail deer or black bears or coyotes.
La Pistoletta
Member
Somewhere east, from where you are.
But still, top predators should be left alone. They take a lot of time, effort and resources to produce.
But still, top predators should be left alone. They take a lot of time, effort and resources to produce.
VaughnT
Member
La Pistoletta, you speak of that which you do not know. While there can be no denying that "top predators" take a long time to mature and require a large landbase to thrive, there comes a point where you have to draw the line between their lives and ours. Would you feel it was appropriate to live and let live if that was your child being eaten by a cougar/coyote/bear/rottweiler?
And don't think you're safe living in some metropolitan area. I've seen coyotes in right near downtown Greenville, SC and would expect that most major cities have them, just like they have feral dogs.
Were I standing nearby as a friend was attacked, I can't say what I would really do. I can only hope that I would acquit myself better than the individual in the story.
And don't think you're safe living in some metropolitan area. I've seen coyotes in right near downtown Greenville, SC and would expect that most major cities have them, just like they have feral dogs.
Were I standing nearby as a friend was attacked, I can't say what I would really do. I can only hope that I would acquit myself better than the individual in the story.
680x0
Member
I think he was just saying that maybe hunting apex predators for sport is something that should be regulated. I know if it was up to my grandpa's generation there would not be a single living wolf left in America.
In self defense I don't think anyone would say you can't defend yourself with a firearm.
In self defense I don't think anyone would say you can't defend yourself with a firearm.
Ryder
Member
Not unless you're Goliath. I saw one in a display case that was at least 12 foot long nose to tail. Why do you think they call them lions? Maybe you're thinking bobcats?
680x0
Member
12 foot mountain lion?
Well a tail doesn't have any muscle personally I've never heard of one over 130 lbs.
I've also heard that the majority of mountain lion attacks are directed at children or short people
edit: http://tchester.org/sgm/lists/lion_attacks_ca.html
Well a tail doesn't have any muscle
personally I've never heard of one over 130 lbs.I've also heard that the majority of mountain lion attacks are directed at children or short people
edit: http://tchester.org/sgm/lists/lion_attacks_ca.html
aroshi
Member
Keep in mind, these are predators. They train themselves everyday, by virtue of their life, to hunt and kill. Don't think an 80lb (all muscle, claws and teeth) mountain lion can't take down a 200lb human male. They know what works, they take out other animals larger than themselves.
Granted, I've had to fight off a couple dogs before, and it's not fun. Go into it knowing you're going to get cut up pretty bad. Practice good first aid. Use what is immediately available, sticks, hand-sized rocks, whatever... and make a lasting impression on it.
Don't throw the rocks, beat it with them. Aim for bone and skull, not body. Get a long sturdy stick, place it on the ground near the animal, then drop it on the animal and step on it. Leverage works to your advantage. Then proceed with the rocks. Just a suggestion.
I'm told most of the mountain lions around here fear humans enough not to attack. I still don't want to find out first hand whether that really is true or not.
Granted, I've had to fight off a couple dogs before, and it's not fun. Go into it knowing you're going to get cut up pretty bad. Practice good first aid. Use what is immediately available, sticks, hand-sized rocks, whatever... and make a lasting impression on it.
Don't throw the rocks, beat it with them. Aim for bone and skull, not body. Get a long sturdy stick, place it on the ground near the animal, then drop it on the animal and step on it. Leverage works to your advantage. Then proceed with the rocks. Just a suggestion.
I'm told most of the mountain lions around here fear humans enough not to attack. I still don't want to find out first hand whether that really is true or not.
680x0
Member
Well I'm always carrying so the supposition is largely academic
If I had to bet on an fight between a very strong man with a good pocket knife and an 80lbs cat, I'd probably put my money on the man.
If I had to bet on an fight between a very strong man with a good pocket knife and an 80lbs cat, I'd probably put my money on the man.
0007
Member
680x0 -
Ever see a house cat work over a large dog? An 80-90 pound couger is so fast and strong that you don't even know that you are hit until you start to bleed. Knew a vet that had one he had hand raised. My wife used to stand outside on the deck smoking and petting it. But she also said that she could be on one end of the 40' deck and take her eyes off the cat on the other end and before she could blink the cat would be in her face wanting to play...
Ever see a house cat work over a large dog? An 80-90 pound couger is so fast and strong that you don't even know that you are hit until you start to bleed. Knew a vet that had one he had hand raised. My wife used to stand outside on the deck smoking and petting it. But she also said that she could be on one end of the 40' deck and take her eyes off the cat on the other end and before she could blink the cat would be in her face wanting to play...
TallPine
Member
Well sure - like buying licenses and observing seasons, etc ...
But lion hunting in CA was completely banned. Now the lions are overpopulated and hurting people.
See the other thread over in General Discussion.
Animals that are regularly hunted are protected most by those that hunt them, for perpetuation of the sport.
Some people have been watching "Bambi" too much ....
Geezer
Member
COUGAR STUFF
First of all, it probably isn't true that there is an overpopulation of cougars in CA. There are many, many killed each year legally by folks who apply for and get "predator permits.", permits to kill the big cats that are alleged to be killing livestock. Almost any large ranch can get as many of these permits as they care to. I understand a certain huge ranch near LA is now legally killing two to three times as many cougars as they did when it was legal to hunt them.
The problem is that when the cats are not hunted with dogs, they lose their fear of human contact, and start hunting us. When they are hunted with dogs they stay away from humans. I understand this is the problem with bears arising in Colorado now because they outlawed the use of dogs.
You legalize hunting with dogs, or you don't, same number of cougars, but with the legalized hunting humans are safer, and there is a great revenue gain for the Department of Fish & Game as well as local outfitters, motels, restaurants, etcetera.
It is normal to see cougars inside the city of LA, in the Santa Monica mountains, and the last cougar I saw was a couple of years ago in Emma Wood State Park, broad daylight. That is in the middle of an urban area in Ventura County.
Speaking of urban predators, we now have fairly common incidents of coyotes attacking small children inside the city. There have always been a lot of coyotes inside LA proper, but lately they seem to be getting bolder and bolder.
I live in Simi Valley, and if you want a real lesson in urban ecology, take a walk in the hills around the valley..In places the ground is literally littered with the skeltons of housecats that have been brought there to be eaten by coyotes and cougars.
As for betting on a human with a knife against an 80 pound cougar, that's like betting that the next Powerball ticket you buy is your pension plan.
I think it is really important to remember that the best way to protect an apex predator is with managed hunting. You cannot increase the numbers by banning hunting. (The big bears eat little bears, and that controls their population when not enough are killed by managed hunting. How's that grab all you folks who learned your ecology from Gentle Ben & Bambi?
God bless and y'all be careful out there.
First of all, it probably isn't true that there is an overpopulation of cougars in CA. There are many, many killed each year legally by folks who apply for and get "predator permits.", permits to kill the big cats that are alleged to be killing livestock. Almost any large ranch can get as many of these permits as they care to. I understand a certain huge ranch near LA is now legally killing two to three times as many cougars as they did when it was legal to hunt them.
The problem is that when the cats are not hunted with dogs, they lose their fear of human contact, and start hunting us. When they are hunted with dogs they stay away from humans. I understand this is the problem with bears arising in Colorado now because they outlawed the use of dogs.
You legalize hunting with dogs, or you don't, same number of cougars, but with the legalized hunting humans are safer, and there is a great revenue gain for the Department of Fish & Game as well as local outfitters, motels, restaurants, etcetera.
It is normal to see cougars inside the city of LA, in the Santa Monica mountains, and the last cougar I saw was a couple of years ago in Emma Wood State Park, broad daylight. That is in the middle of an urban area in Ventura County.
Speaking of urban predators, we now have fairly common incidents of coyotes attacking small children inside the city. There have always been a lot of coyotes inside LA proper, but lately they seem to be getting bolder and bolder.
I live in Simi Valley, and if you want a real lesson in urban ecology, take a walk in the hills around the valley..In places the ground is literally littered with the skeltons of housecats that have been brought there to be eaten by coyotes and cougars.
As for betting on a human with a knife against an 80 pound cougar, that's like betting that the next Powerball ticket you buy is your pension plan.
I think it is really important to remember that the best way to protect an apex predator is with managed hunting. You cannot increase the numbers by banning hunting. (The big bears eat little bears, and that controls their population when not enough are killed by managed hunting. How's that grab all you folks who learned your ecology from Gentle Ben & Bambi?
God bless and y'all be careful out there.
680x0
Member
http://www.bigcats.org/abc/attacks/victoria.html
I'm not saying it's a sure thing, but I'd give better odds on a strong man with a knife over a cougar that is most likely sick or starved if it's resorting to human predation. About 25% of cougar victims survive and the vast majority of cougar attacks are sneak attacks on children or small women. A cougar cannot fit a man's head in it's mouth, unlike it's african cousin whose majority of quick kills comes from it's ability to crush a human skull in it's teeth. This is NOT an african lion, and people have killed em hand to hand. Being involved in a big cat sanctuary I've learned something about feline movement and attack patterns, and I think these cats are used to dealing with 4 legged animals and are at a disadvantage as far as leverage and reach. Do I think it would be a stunning victory on the man's part? no, I think he'd be ragged as hell and close to bleeding to death, but if I had to drop my money on one or the other it would probably be the man.
I can't believe I've just spent 5 minutes typing up an arguement for a man being able to kill a cougar in mortal combat... God bless the internet
I'm not saying it's a sure thing, but I'd give better odds on a strong man with a knife over a cougar that is most likely sick or starved if it's resorting to human predation. About 25% of cougar victims survive and the vast majority of cougar attacks are sneak attacks on children or small women. A cougar cannot fit a man's head in it's mouth, unlike it's african cousin whose majority of quick kills comes from it's ability to crush a human skull in it's teeth. This is NOT an african lion, and people have killed em hand to hand. Being involved in a big cat sanctuary I've learned something about feline movement and attack patterns, and I think these cats are used to dealing with 4 legged animals and are at a disadvantage as far as leverage and reach. Do I think it would be a stunning victory on the man's part? no, I think he'd be ragged as hell and close to bleeding to death, but if I had to drop my money on one or the other it would probably be the man.
I can't believe I've just spent 5 minutes typing up an arguement for a man being able to kill a cougar in mortal combat... God bless the internet
Out friend the Mountain Lion-
680x0-
80# is a female cat in these parts, and not a real big one, near as I can tell. A friend of mine took a tom a few years back, estimated live weight about 200#, estimated by a Game and Fish biologist, not me. He is also over 5 1/2 feet long from a** to nose, now I realize this was a monster, hell it had to be mounted on an african cat body. Most adult males I've seen and heard of are 120-160#... so I'll let ya wrestle away if your up to it! Just roll in meat drippings and wander thru the Laramie Peak range and don't worry about looking too hard they'll find you. LOL
I do agree MOST of the time adult humans are probably safe just due to our size, but I still pack a pistol when I wonder in the woods, because I know I am no longer on top of the food chain! They trap or kill 1 or 2 right in town every couple of years, last one was in a tree by a grade school. I saw G&F trap a black bear roaming in a city park 2 years ago, and I do live in a city, rare as they may be here in WY. So remember we are never really on top of heap!
LaPistoleeta-
The mountain lion is FAR from endangered here! Highest numbers is in many, many years! and top predators, well....nothing personnal but it is.....RANT TIME!!!
As for other predators... let's get the damn Griz off the Endangerd Spiecies list! Things are a menace here in WY, gun shots in the Wind Rivers during Elk Season are like a damn dinner bell! AND I for one can't wait for Wolf Season....coming soon to a Western State near you!!! Wolves have destroyed the Elk, Deer, and Moose herds in the western part of the state! Now I realize the drought hasn't helped, but several Biologists have give serious credit to the wolf! Thanks to all who worked so hard to bring the wolf back to Yellowstone!!! I want to see them re-introduce 4 legged predators to Centeral Park! Remember folks you don't have to out run the predator...just out run whom ever you are with
680x0-
80# is a female cat in these parts, and not a real big one, near as I can tell. A friend of mine took a tom a few years back, estimated live weight about 200#, estimated by a Game and Fish biologist, not me. He is also over 5 1/2 feet long from a** to nose, now I realize this was a monster, hell it had to be mounted on an african cat body. Most adult males I've seen and heard of are 120-160#... so I'll let ya wrestle away if your up to it!
Just roll in meat drippings and wander thru the Laramie Peak range and don't worry about looking too hard they'll find you. LOLI do agree MOST of the time adult humans are probably safe just due to our size, but I still pack a pistol when I wonder in the woods, because I know I am no longer on top of the food chain! They trap or kill 1 or 2 right in town every couple of years, last one was in a tree by a grade school. I saw G&F trap a black bear roaming in a city park 2 years ago, and I do live in a city, rare as they may be here in WY. So remember we are never really on top of heap!
LaPistoleeta-
The mountain lion is FAR from endangered here! Highest numbers is in many, many years! and top predators, well....nothing personnal but it is.....RANT TIME!!!
As for other predators... let's get the damn Griz off the Endangerd Spiecies list! Things are a menace here in WY, gun shots in the Wind Rivers during Elk Season are like a damn dinner bell! AND I for one can't wait for Wolf Season....coming soon to a Western State near you!!! Wolves have destroyed the Elk, Deer, and Moose herds in the western part of the state! Now I realize the drought hasn't helped, but several Biologists have give serious credit to the wolf! Thanks to all who worked so hard to bring the wolf back to Yellowstone!!! I want to see them re-introduce 4 legged predators to Centeral Park!
Remember folks you don't have to out run the predator...just out run whom ever you are withClipse,
While I would love to offer a Poltergeist as an explanation the truth is that there is probably a short in one of the circuit boards. I had the same thing happn to a TV that I used to own. First it came on in the middle of the night a couple times. It is very unnerving to wake up to voices that you know are in the next room when you live alone. After a little time the TV would turn off out of the blue and sometimes if my son was playing in the room the vibration would cause it to turn off. After about the 3rd incident of coming on during the night over a few month period I decided that I had to replace it because I did not want to be putting a round into it during the night. LOL
While I would love to offer a Poltergeist as an explanation the truth is that there is probably a short in one of the circuit boards. I had the same thing happn to a TV that I used to own. First it came on in the middle of the night a couple times. It is very unnerving to wake up to voices that you know are in the next room when you live alone. After a little time the TV would turn off out of the blue and sometimes if my son was playing in the room the vibration would cause it to turn off. After about the 3rd incident of coming on during the night over a few month period I decided that I had to replace it because I did not want to be putting a round into it during the night. LOL
Clipse,
While I would love to offer a Poltergeist as an explanation the truth is that there is probably a short in one of the circuit boards. I had the same thing happn to a TV that I used to own. First it came on in the middle of the night a couple times. It is very unnerving to wake up to voices that you know are in the next room when you live alone. After a little time the TV would turn off out of the blue and sometimes if my son was playing in the room the vibration would cause it to turn off. After about the 3rd incident of coming on during the night over a few month period I decided that I had to replace it because I did not want to be putting a round into it during the night. LOL
While I would love to offer a Poltergeist as an explanation the truth is that there is probably a short in one of the circuit boards. I had the same thing happn to a TV that I used to own. First it came on in the middle of the night a couple times. It is very unnerving to wake up to voices that you know are in the next room when you live alone. After a little time the TV would turn off out of the blue and sometimes if my son was playing in the room the vibration would cause it to turn off. After about the 3rd incident of coming on during the night over a few month period I decided that I had to replace it because I did not want to be putting a round into it during the night. LOL
680x0
Member
I'd really rather use my pistol
But I might try the rolling in meat drippings some time, probably good for the skin
But I might try the rolling in meat drippings some time, probably good for the skin
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