Hunting big game with AK47

[351 WINCHESTER]

AK's don't belong in the woods at lease not where I hunt. From time to time I see someone with one, usually a kid that couldn't hit the broad side of a barn. I saw a guy hunting with one and asked if he was any good with it. Hell yes, he replied. I set up a bleach bottle at 75 yards and asked him to hit it. He fired 3 shots and didn't even come close. I pulled out my old marlin .30-30 and nailed her clean. AK's have a stigma about them as being bad guns and shouldn't be seen in the woods. I think they are fine for a self defence weapon, but please don't take to the woods for hunting.

 

[R.W.Dale]

Boy howdy this thread really brought the Elmers out in force

If it's a legal firearm that meets the requirements for hunting in that state you're a shelf righteous busybody if you're worried about someone elses hunting TOOL


I know plenty of people who are poor shots with traditional hunting arms, it's the shooter not the firearm.

I pulled out my old marlin .30-30 and nailed her clean.

WOW you mean you actually hit an almost 9" square target at a whopping 75yds. WOW what a crack shot

 

[Clipper]

351, guys like you are counterproductive...Do us a favor and stifle it.

 

[ArmedBear]

I'm forever getting ragged on by the scoped inline crowd when I take my traditional sidelock loaded with patched round ball hunting.

Funny. Seems like it's the other way around, here.

I set up a bleach bottle at 75 yards and asked him to hit it. He fired 3 shots and didn't even come close. I pulled out my old marlin .30-30 and nailed her clean.

What, exactly, does that have to do with the gun?

He can't shoot. HE shouldn't be in the woods until he learns. Not with an AK, not with a 336, not with a scoped Dakota.

 

['Card]

I set up a bleach bottle at 75 yards and asked him to hit it. He fired 3 shots and didn't even come close. I pulled out my old marlin .30-30 and nailed her clean.

...and that proves what exactly? One time I saw a guy do pretty much the same thing with a .30-06 Remington bolt-action with a scope on it. So going by your logic (or lack thereof) because of one doofus who couldn't shoot we should all conclude that bolt-action scoped rifles are worthless for hunting?

Lousy hunters are lousy hunters. It doesn't have a damned thing to do with the gun.

 

[MudPuppy]

AK's have a stigma about them as being bad guns

Actually, a lot of folks see all guns as bad guns. I get to deal with stupid restrictions on "sporting guns", so excuse me if I feel the need to hunt exclusively with AKs, HK-91s, and FN Fals to protect YOUR right to own that traditional firearm. (In case that was too subtle, your guns are next on the ban list once the pesky black plastic ones are criminalized.)

That story about some guy not being able to hit a bleach bottle at 75 yards explains a lot--but not much about the accuracy of an AK...

 

[bearmgc]

Eliphalet, Don't PM me calling me a liar. In fact don't ever PM me again. You are being very rude, and I have better things to do than delete your messages.

 

[eliphalet]

Excuse me I was careful not to call you a lier and didn't want to say that I think your blowing smoke in the forum here and that your so called friend is NOT shooting elk in the head with a SKS. I have hunted plenty of elk over 45 plus years big game hunting, elk don't just hang out and let you shoot em in the head that is unless it is a canned hunt then I guess a 22 would work. I may be wrong but you strike me as a anti hunter type hoping to cause trouble my apologies if that is not so but ya come off like that to me.

Just cause a certain gun/ caliber will work or kill doesn't mean is should be used for every occasion. We need responsible posts from knowledge folks here I would think as lots of newbies and the world of PETA types are watching reading I try to post responsible knowledgeable answers in area I know something about personally in my answers.

I would feel bad telling potential hunters that a barely adequate caliber is AOK and have guys wound and lose animals. That IMHO is not good for hunting as a whole and the person wounding the animal. I have been with someone that did that and it took till the next day to find a hurt wounded deer. That was the last time that person EVER went hunting. Sorry I just like to see folks off on the right foot so to speak.

 

[R.W.Dale]

I try to post responsible knowledgeable answers in area I know something about personally in my answers.

You mean like you did in the .357 thread

 

[eliphalet]

You mean like you did in the .357 thread

Yes, I own, have owned and or shot a 357 many years. i have tested different bullets with different loadings and shot them into varying deferent substances to see what said bullets would do. HP or Wad-cutters respond quite differently. Yes you are correct, a 357 will kill, and probably would anything that walks in North America under perfect conditions but as the post above says doesn't qualify it to be a " good" deer round. I am no expert I just have many years of firearm and hunting experience under my belt but if you will do some checking I think you will find that even the "experts" would not call a 4" 357 an adequate or the proper deer hunting round. I think it is important to be a responsible hunter/sportsman. Sorry you disagree.

 

[R.W.Dale]

I think you will find that even the "experts" would not call a 4" 357 an adequate deer round. I think it is important to be a responsible hunter/sportsman. Sorry you disagree.

If by what's responsible you mean taking what some "expert" in a glossy hunting rag happens to need to advertise that month as gospel then, YES I strongly disagree.

 

[Clipper]

Most of those 'experts' were fine with the .357 in the '70s, until the .454 came out, then the bar seemed to rise and now the .357 was shunned by the same guys who sang it's praises a couple years earlier. Now the .41mag is considered 'marginal'...The only reason they haven't started dissing the .44mag is because they'd be bad-mouthing Elmer Kieth and would be 'Zumbo'd' for it. If you think those idiots are the be-all and end-all, there's little hope for you...

As far as the AK goes, it's not my favorite platform, and I have other, more suitable rifles, but as long as I'm in effective range, have the right ammo and am sure of my shot, I'll live with the guilt just fine, thanks. And the day I worry about the opinion of some AH I meet in the woods, is the day I'll put on an antler hat and wait for him to shoot me.

 

[marksman13]

351winchester, I don't suppose your real name ryhmes with Dumbo does it? Your bogus preachings and teachings sound an awful lot like someone else I've been reading about lately. I've read alot of post on here against the use of an AK or SKS, but have yet to see any REASONS!!! Do any of you nay sayers have logical reason why the AK or SKS is ineffective as a hunting rifle? 351winchester, if you are ever down my way let's break out my old Norinco SKS and put it next to your Marlin in the name of good natured competition. Of course we'll stretch the range out to 200 yards and start from there. The kind of babble you guys are spouting sounds an awful lot like the anti gun crowd, lot's of emotion and no facts.

 

[Plink]

AK's have a stigma about them as being bad guns and shouldn't be seen in the woods.

That makes about as much sense as "Red cars have a stigma about them and shouldn't be seen on the roads". The platform doesn't matter, the cartridge and shooter are all that's important.

The folks you saw that couldn't hit the side of a barn with an AK couldn't have hit it with anything else either. Bad marksmanship is bad marksmanship, regardless what gun they use. The inverse is also true.

 

[351 WINCHESTER]

Thanks for all the comments. Oh, did I offend anyone? Duly noted. I don't care to see anyone hunting on public land using an ak. As I stated earlier ak's have a bad image with the general population - much worse than a hunting rifle. They just look evil. I wonder how far you would make it down the road with an ak in your gun rack before being pulled over by some leo? I wonder how many people would call 911 and report you. That's just plain stupid. Now put a lever action or bolt, or pump or a "legiment rifle" in the same gun rack and truck. Yea, it looks a lot better. For the "dumbo" who hates all guns it may or may not make a difference. I'm sure ak's are great rifles for killing people and I have no doubt they will kill deer. Heck, one day I may own one, but you're not gonna see me in the woods with it - not hunting anyway. Just not my weapon of choice. It gives hunters a bad image. Besides, I don't ever recall seing a 5 round mag. for an ak. If that's true they are illegal in our state and if anyone cares to do some research, the same rule probably applies to most other states.

Think of it this way. Some hunter accidentally kills another hunter with his ak. The media is gonna have a field day. We have enough problems with irresponsible idiots and crazies. We have to maintain a good immage with the general public. We are the minority and it's getting worse. Hell, I love guns, I've got bunches of them, but I no longer have them in my gun rack for all to see, even though it's legal. We are outnumbered and it is our obligation as responsible gun owners not to make things worse. Imagine if you're a game warden and you see someone with an ak. What do you think he's thinking? Probably calling for back up. Not good. What ever happen to good old COMMON SENCE??? If it were legal would you hunt with an rpg just because you could? Why not a .50 browning?
How about a machine pistol. That would be nice, wouldn't it? Show some
consideration to the general public and don't do stupid things that's going to make things worse for all of us. Things are tough enough as it is.

For all you ethical hunters, my hat's off to you. For all you dummies, use a little common sence and don't screw things up for the rest of us.

 

[eliphalet]

Their gonna scream to the rooftops 351 but your correct. Common sense and good hunter responsibility is always a good thing for all gun owners, hunter or not.

 

[ArmedBear]

Besides, I don't ever recall seing a 5 round mag. for an ak.

They sell them. For hunting.

Saigas don't look "evil", and they make 5 rounders for them, too.

If it were legal would you hunt with an rpg just because you could? Why not a .50 browning?
How about a machine pistol.

What does that have to do with anything?

An AK shoots a perfect woods/brush deer round. It's an autoloader, just like a BAR, a 7400, or a Ruger Deerfield. No parallel with a .50BMG, an Uzi or an RPG. This "argument" in favor of "common sence (sic)" doesn't hold water.

Do you also object to someone hunting with a Dirty Harry revolver?

If you are afraid of our public image as hunters, that's one thing.

But if you think a civilian AK with a 5-round magazine as sold for hunting is somehow more "evil", or less sporting, than a .30-30 lever gun in the woods, you can't read a ballistics chart.

That said, I hunt (for) big game with a walnut/rosewood .30-06 bolt gun with a scope. But if you worry about the image of hunters, go bug the Benelli shooters. Nothing uglier than a black Benelli in the field.

 

[marksman13]

351, that "image" that you are so afraid of is exactly what we are fighting from the anti crowd. It is utter nonsense. I guess you don't realize that to a large portion of the US population, your bolt action or lever action rifles are just as scary. When they start voicing a disdain for those will you start using only a bow? Will you give up your bow for a pointy stick? Will you finally give up your dangerous, evil pointy stick and start hunting game with your bare hands? The people who claim that AKs, SKSs, and AR15s are not suitable for hunting are the most dangerous threat to our RIGHT to keep and bear arms. You are willing to throw everyone else to the wolves to protect your image and quite frankly your ignorance makes me sick. This type of eliteist crap and this idea of appeasement of the anti crowd is not only arrogant and ignorant, but selfish as well.

What do you say to the poor man who has only one rifle for defense, hunting, and plinking? Milsurp guns are cheap, efficient and reliable. Should the poor guy not be allowed to hunt because he can't afford the latest, greatest, whiz bang bolt action? Should his rights be infringed upon so that the "image of ethical hunters" is not tarnished? Surely you don't really feel that way?

I love hunting with my SKS and Mosins. They have a nastolgia factor which gives them a uniqueness and character all their own. The history behind these guns gives witness to their efficiency. Perhaps all this means nothing to you, but it does to me, and I could give less than a %@&$ about offending you with their pressence! My offer still stands of my SKS against your Marlin.

 

[Plink]

If it were legal would you hunt with an rpg just because you could? Why not a .50 browning?
How about a machine pistol.

Why not a 7.62x39?

It's ballistically similar to the .30-30. I'm sure you don't have a problem with .30-30s.

An AK with a 5 round magazine (They do make them, I own several) is legal in many states. With a 5 round mag, there's no difference between it and a semi-automatic "hunting rifle" as made by Remington and others.

 

[H&Hhunter]

7.62X39 is nothing more than the communist reinvention of the .30-30. The AK is the working mans gun of the Eastern Block. Just like the Win-94 used to be here.

So basically what you've got is a semi auto .30-30. Accuracy is about the same as many lever guns ballistics are about the same as a .30-30 and if it is legal, I would presume that you'd probably have to have a 5 round magazine capacity as that seems to be the norm in most states, then get after it.

I don't personally have any affection for the AK because I've never played with one that was very accurate. But it would not stop me from hunting with one if I had the chance.

 

[yongxingfreesty]

i dont know about 75yds, but 50yds is a piece of cake with the ak on irons.

 

[351 WINCHESTER]

marksman13

The image of the ak wasn't invented by me. The fact of the matter is the ak is viewed by more people as probably the most evil rifle of modern man.

Now don't go calling me all kinds of names. That's for kids. I'm not, nor have I ever been accused of "throwing anyone to the wolves" to protect my image. My image is a result of good upbringing, hard work, kindness and respect for others and love of God and country. The wolf cares only for himself and his pack.

I never said or implied that the ak isn't capable of killing a deer. I'm not going to argue as to whether a .30-30 is better than a 7.62x39. Both are entirely adequate for deer hunting. I've killed a lot of deer with my .30-30and I think the longest shot was just a tad over 100yds. I've never found her lacking. I didn't know that anyone made a 5 rd. mag. for the ak's. My mistake. That doesn't change my opinion one bit. I disagree with your statement that a lever gun or bolt gun is just as scary to the anti gunners. Just about any person in the world knows what an ak is and what it's main purpose is. Im not nocking the ak. It's a fine weapon for killing people and that is where the trouble is bud. It's the kind of rifle that you can give to a kid and in no time he can learn how to load and shoot it and he doesn't have to perform any maintance on it, or miminal maintance. It's the stigma attached to the ak that is bad. "Arrogant, ignorant, selfish" - NOT HARDLY.

I have no problem hunting with a military weapon. I've got a very nice lee enfield no.5 which I think is an outstanding hunting weapon and a fine piece of history to boot. If I made you sick that's your problem. Call your doctor. That just shows your inmaturaty, lack of character and lack of good old fashion common sence. We can argue this point till hell freezes over and it's not going to change my way of thinking or yours. The fact remains that the ak is viewed by many as an "evil" weapon and therein lies the problem. Might I sugguest that the ones that hunt with ak's have a little respect for the rest of us as we have our image to keep up by keeping a low profile so they don't add fuel to the fire. It might even save their lives. Imagine being pulled over for speeding while on your way to your favorite hunting spot and some leo sees an ak sitting next to you. I wonder whats going thru his mind. I'll bet his hand in on his weapon. Sure hope it's not a glock with a 3.5 lb. trigger. Hope he's not full of caffiene. As Americans we need to do everything we can to insure that our God given right to keep and bear arms isn't infriged upon cause thats the only recource we have if our government gets much worse and if you think for one moment that name calling is going to help than you need to rethink. I don't own or care to own an ak. I'm thinking of getting an ar. I'm not a benchrest shooter, but a hunter and a target shooter. I have no problem with you or any other law abiding citizen from owning whatever legal firearms you choose. As for your invitation to have a shooting contest, sadly, I must decline. I don't know you and you don't know me. Wouldn't want to ruin your macho image anyway. No, I'm not the greatest shot in the world, but I can hold my own. I, too, love hunting with older rifles. Two of my favorites besides my marlin .30-30 is one of my .351 winchesters and a lee enield no. 5. Funny how the game wardens are impressed with non evil guns. Not so funny when they run across some hunter armed with his ak.

 

[Plink]

I guess it's the whole "image" thing that is over my head. I don't use an AK to hunt with generally, but I have used several other guns equally as scary to the antis. I'm not out there to appease them, I'm out there to hunt. The very fact that I have a gun displeases them, and the fact that I'm hunting displeases a whole other group of them. I hunt responsibly, regardless of the platform I choose. But I hunt to please myself, not them.

I don't let others perceptions influence my decisions. The fact that most of my friends ride Harleys because of the "image" doesn't influence my decision to ride rice burners because of the performance. I'm content driven and what others think is entirely irrelevant. Remember that your Enfield was also "a fine weapon for killing people" in it's day. Most of our guns were.

What's most important is that hunters and shooters behave themselves and act ethically. To show ourselves as the responsible, upstanding people that most of us are. If we give in to the media villifying our weapons, guess what? Your inoffensive bolt action is next. They're already being called "sniper rifles" by the media, and afterall, it's not sporting to hunt with a sniper rifle, is it?

Hunting with these guns also gives some legitimacy to their sporting purposes. Remember the Zumbo affair? He blatently called AR-15's terrorist guns and said nobody hunts with them. He was wrong and he learned a hard, fast lesson because of it. There's no real distinction between a "battle" gun and a sporting one (your Enfield is a good example), other than personal taste. Personally, I love blued steel set in fine walnut, but I certainly don't think that those are the only guns that serve sporting purposes.

Remember also that there are as many reasons that people hunt as there are hunters. Some hunt for trophies and nothing but the biggest will do, others keep some sort of "score" like it's a game or competition, some think there should be some type of "fair chase" involved, while some others are just there to harvest an animal for meat, and there are always some who are just there to kill something. I'm sure some of the AK owners fall into that group, but for sure a lot of the "take them at 500 yards with uber scopes and hyper magnums" folks do too.

I guess the bottom line is do we really let them tell us what to think? Do we let others set the "stigma" and "image" for us? It's our sport, not theirs. Lets just enjoy it, each in our own way, with whatever platform we choose. As long as we do so responsibly.

 

[marksman13]

Thank you, Plink. You just saved me a mouthful.

351, why are you so willing to let a non-hunting public dictate the tools that we hunters use in our pursuit of the sport we love? I wouldn't be concerned at all if an LEO pulled me over with a legally owned AK in my truck. It's no different than if I was pulled over going to the range with it. Your logic is flawed. You are correct, however, in stating that the name calling is unjustified. Nothing boils my blood like someone telling me when or how to use MY guns. Can't you see that you aren't doing any of us any favors by continuing this stigmatism? You do realize that one day we won't be allowed to use AKs. Next there will be no semi-autos. After that, they will come for scoped rifles. And soon after, we'll all be hunting with muzzle loaders. Small increments my friend. One piece at a time until they have the whole pie.

Instead of bashing the AK, perhaps you should try one. Show others that it is no different from any other semi-auto hunting rifle. If a firearm is legal to own, legal to use, and is all someone has, why should he not be allowed to hunt with it? We have to break sterotypes, brother, not perpetuate them.

I apologize for the name calling, but I must firmly disagree with your logic.

 

[ArmedBear]

"Arrogant, ignorant, selfish" - NOT HARDLY.

Really?

Arrogant:

Oh, did I offend anyone? Duly noted.

Ignorant:

What ever happen to good old COMMON SENCE???

Selfish:

I don't care to see anyone hunting on public land using an ak.

Some people just don't know how to quit when they're ahead. Or at least ahead of where they end up when they keep going.