I switched my chambered round to FMJ. Here's why.

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kungfuhippie said:
Well done handgun midas, may all that you shoot turn to gold
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Finally somebody gets the joke.

doing something that could result in more problems than the $ he'll save.
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More problems? Do you really believe that?
Still a fresh round in the chamber, maybe not optimal,
but a guy still gets shot, right?

If a duder came on proclaiming that it was FMJ for him fo'eva ons,
would he be derided as carrying a paperweight?
Honestly shocked at what a pariah a round nosed bullet can make out of a man



Anyway, today I ran a box of Golden Sabres through without trouble,
and then filled all three mags with another box.
Shot up my old jalopy JHP too, devoid of incident.

For now I'm leaving a Sabre in the chamber, and I will extract it
quite gingerly when switching to the caps.
Depending on how much dry-firing I do at a time, and I've been known to fluctuate,
I may throw a FMJ back in there for a while.

As far as babying my extractor, dropping the slide on a full
chamber is one of those procedures that I've only ever heard
advised against, like dropping the slide on an empty chamber.

BTW, I shoot my P345 the most, so if I did choose to cycle the
ammo every range trip, it'd cost me a lot more than $40 a year.
 
h.g. midas,
The $40 would mean you just shot it up evey 6 months.

doing something that could result in more problems than the $ he'll save.
More problems? Do you really believe that?
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Okay, I come off as illiterate on occation so I'll try hard to explain. I'll use this story;

Lets say you have that 100% reliable FMJ on top. No harm with that, fmj has probably killed more men than JHP. But lets say for example O.J. Simpson with a knife comes at you and you find in necessary to shoot, standing behind O.J. is a wonderful, church going, woman who splits her time between the animal shelter and the orphanage. and your FMJ overpenetrates O.J. and kills the Good Samaritan Granny bystandard. It would be a tragic accident. BUt then G.S. Granny's family (the Garbage Pail Kids) come on the news about some King Midas Redneck Pistolero Coyboy Reckless Redneck who gunned down G.S. Granny just cause he could. Then Scum Bag Lawyer and G.P. Kids tell the D.A. you had a different round on top. In testimony you're asked why all your rounds weren't FMJ or JHP. You explain why and then tell the jury that you knew a FMJ was much more likly to overpenetrate and that's part of why you have JHP after the first round. S.B. Lawyer and G.P. Kids get a ruling of manslaughter because you were blessed with the brightest jury ever. Now S.B. Lawyer and G.P. Kids file a lawsuit and take everything you and your loved ones have. So the outcome is that King Midas Redneck Pistolero Coyboy Reckless Redneck tried to do the right thing and save a little money and in the end S.B. Lawyer and G.P. Kids of G.S. Granny took all his money and freedom.

Yes it's a stretch, but I've seen worse. And if I spend $100 extra a year to avoid telling a muggle jury that I was using a "more dangerous" FMJ to save money and that's why G.S. Granny died when I shot O.J. for attacking me.
 
I'm really not seeing any benefit to it, certainly not any benefit that will outweigh the performance limitation and overpenetration risk posed by the FMJ.
 
kungfuhippie - I find your scenario a little beyond far-fetched! :)

Using your logic, we shouldn't use any ammo at all for self defense. Typically people worry that using hollowpoint ammo will be used against them in court, not the other way around. The famed "He only used hollowpoint ammo because he knew it was more deadly" argument. Now we have the "He only used FMJ ammo because he knew it was more deadly" argument. :confused:
 
That's cause redneck was twice as important:) I put in the disclaimer about being borderline illiterate at times.

Far fetched, yes, but think about all the scumbag lawyers out there that would bring up overpenetration and ask why you had a round ontop that was know to overpenetrate more often that JHP. The "muggle" (thanks springmom) jury of soccer moms types would eat up his words.
 
It's true that an attorney is probably going to make an issue of it no matter whether you choose FMJ or JHP.

However, I can also see where carrying both in the same gun is just handing him/her your own head on a silver platter...

"Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, I submit that Mr. Midas wanted to be absolutely sure the he killed whoever he shot, and therefor took steps to guarantee it by loading his weapon with TWO types of ammunition; one that would expand on impact and cause a horrible wound of shallow depth, and the other to make a hole completely through the person it hit."

Having spent a bit of time in court, I can tell you that the above isn't too far-fetched at all... especially in civil court.

Anyway... it's no skin off my nose one way or the other... just passing along an opinion and observation.

J.C.
 
Cycle your ammo often and try only playing with it at the range. I know it is hard to do but setting around the house playing with your gun is not a real good idea anyway. Sooner or later and accident happens and you or someone in your home pays the price. Accident at the range and 999 out of 1000 only you stand a chance of injury or death.;)
 
So what I've taken to doing is chambering a cheap FMJ, and then keeping the mag filled with JHP. This way the only round that gets repeatedly ejected and chambered is cheaply replacable FMJ round that probably has a better chance of feeding with a scuffed nose.
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Your logic is fine but only to a point. You should never repeatedly reuse a round that get chambered over and over again as you describe. Scuffing up the nose of the round, by repeatedly chambering it, is negligible in how well it will chamber in a correctly operating modern pistol in good condition.

The problem you will encounter though is the one in which after repeatedly rechambering a round, the bullet will start to become pushed further and further back into the shell casing, actually shortening the overall length of the round. This can, and often does, lead to failures to feed.

It would be a better practice to chamber your regular ammunition each time you load, but make sure to use fresh rounds by about every second or third time, to avoid what I described above. Of course, most rounds can go longer, but if you do it everyday, before you know it, the rounds you keep rechambering become shortened, and cause a hazard to you.

All the best,
Glenn B
 
Thank you Jamie C. for explaining in a more literate fasion my thoughts. (Sad that my dad's an english/journalism teacher and I still can't write down my thoughts very well half the time) The average lawyer is more than willing to bend the facts to win. Their job is to win. Mix your ammo, have an incident and the right lawyer/jury and it could go down. It's possible, not sure how likely.
 
kungfuhippie wrote: Thank you Jamie C. for explaining in a more literate fasion my thoughts. (Sad that my dad's an english/journalism teacher and I still can't write down my thoughts very well half the time) The average lawyer is more than willing to bend the facts to win. Their job is to win. Mix your ammo, have an incident and the right lawyer/jury and it could go down. It's possible, not sure how likely.
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You're welcome, KFH... although I think that's the first time I've ever been accused of being literate. :what: :D

Oh, and Handgun Midas... if you ever do find yourself in court after a shooting, I wouldn't advise you to tell that attorney, when he/she asks about you carrying both FMJ and JHP, that you do so because you "dry-fire it as much as I feel is necessary and bond with the weapon", and that doing so chews up your expensive ammo ( which you don't want to have to replace so often). 'Cause I promise you he'll make you look like some sort of raving homicidal lunatic that obsesses over his "weapon". Especially once you explain that "dry firing" is just sitting around "clicking" an empty gun. :uhoh: :p :rolleyes:


J.C.
 
Midas:

I think I'm going to get everyone upset, but... well ... The Old Fuff is pre-tactical... :uhoh:

Sometime back, around 1967 or so, my bedside gun was a Browning Hi-Power, kept with an empty chamber and a magazine loaded with ball ammo.:what:

I later switched to a Government Model .45, and a magazine loaded with 7 rounds of ball.

Over the years I never bothered to worry about what was the latest fad in hollow points.

Right now my bedside blaster is a very un-cool, obviously un-tactical S&W Military & Police loaded with 158grain lead, semi-wadcutters. ('Cuz they shoot to the point of aim).

If somebody should disturb my slumbers I don't think they're going to stick around long enough to check out what the chambers in the cylinder are loaded with, but if in the highly unlikely event I have to pop a cap or two they will probably stay for a lot longer then they planed to... :scrutiny:
 
O.J. Simpson with a knife comes at you and you find in necessary to shoot, standing behind O.J. is a wonderful, church going, woman who splits her time between the animal shelter and the orphanage. and your FMJ overpenetrates O.J. and kills the Good Samaritan Granny bystandard.
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While I get the point of the above, I would like to toss in a couple of cents for consideration.

1. Even in a self-defense situation, before I discharge my pistol, I have to be sure of my surroundings and what or whom that round is going toward. If Granny is behind O.J., I need to readjust my position and try to get Granny out of the line of fire before dropping the hammer on the Juice. JHP'S can clog or fail to expand, taking on the same penetration characteristics as FMJ. In fact, "IF" your JHP expands at all you have hit the jackpot. Always assume that overpenetration will occur.

2. If you are standing in one place popping rounds at the Juice, you are most likely to become Sushi. Movement rules. Stay out of the bad guys line of attack and counterattack from an angle when someone is charging you.

3. It's not what's in the gun that wins the fight, but how well the operator uses it when it's needed.

Of course no one wants to shoot Granny, but good tactics and situational awareness do more than magic JHP's to keep her upright and washing stray puppies the next day :)
 
I swear ta god, that I am dry-firing RIGHT NOW

farlander said:
Ammo = Cheap Hand surgery = Expensive
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I suppose you are right, but... what?

Jamie C said:
explain that "dry firing" is just sitting around "clicking" an empty gun
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But my Ruger is not empty when it is dry-fired. That is the very crux of this thread.

Maybe when the big city lawyer asks why my ammo was mixed, I'll just say that it was an accident.
That is unless one of you mugs rats on me. That gonna happen? Huh? Huh? Any songbirds here?
 
But my Ruger is not empty when it is dry-fired. That is the very crux of this thread.
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It's "empty" to the effect that there's no live round under the hammer. Otherwise, it's "Target practice" not "Dry firing". ( "Dry" denoting no live round in the chamber. )

Maybe when the big city lawyer asks why my ammo was mixed, I'll just say that it was an accident.
That is unless one of you mugs rats on me. That gonna happen? Huh? Huh? Any songbirds here?
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None needed. They'll most likely have a look at your computer and your posts (including the ones in this thread ) on any gun-related forum you're a member of.

So you're basically "snitching" on yourself, right now. :eek: :uhoh: :scrutiny:

Oh, and you wouldn't be the first one that thought "Oh, they'll never find this stuff" and then be bit in the @$$ by it.
Believe me, a "hungry" attorney, chasing both a buck and a reputation, will go to some pretty unbelievable lengths to win a case.

One way or the other, I really think you'd be better off to just pick one... either the JHP or the FMJ... and only carry that as your defensive load.

Oh, and one other thing I just remembered; it's not uncommon for armed robbers and other criminals to have a "mixed load" in their guns when they're caught. Generally because they don't, as a rule, know or care much about ammunition and such. If it'll work in the gun they have, they're good to go.

Wanna take bets on whether or not our theoretical attorney here would try to make a connection between you and that bit of information, if he/she was aware of it?

Then again, why gamble any more than you have to? Life will get tough enough, most likely, if you ever have to use a gun to defend yourself... so why take a chance on making those circumstances even harder when it's not necessary?


J.C.
 
<just a joke to put it into perspective>

Hand Gun ...$600
Topping off with Ball ammo to save money...-$10
Cost of a very good defense attorney cause that new young D.A. wants to screw you for protecting your family with mixed ammo...$50,000

Going to jail and losing your house to the dead BG's family.... Not Funny:neener: :neener:

(did I mention the prison sodomy):(

There are somethings in life money can't buy, that why you carry a gun.
 
Especially once you explain that "dry firing" is just sitting around "clicking" an empty gun.
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lol that does sound weird when you boil it down to what we're actually doing.
 
Well, a couple of you guys sure have typed a lot of words about how foolish I am.
I suppose we're in this for the same reason.

If she manages to slip into page two by nightfall, let's let her stay.

*click* *click*
 
wanna see a REAL dogpile?

At least you didn't say you were carrying in condition 3, in which case you'd not even DESERVE to own a gun.
 
What I find funny is the guys bringing up the "more dangerous" ammo when referring to the jury's view of FMJ when in reality there was a recent self-defense case that one juror mentioned one of the issues he had was the defendent was using JHP ammunition that police use because it designed to only kill and maim.

Yeah.....apparently you should be using FMJ if your worried about juries....not the other way around. But thats just an ACTUAL case against your theoretical case....what do I know.
 
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