Identity and Date of Manufacture of S&W Revolvers
- Thread starter Brian Williams
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Radagast
Member
usmcfo:
You have a post war .38 Military & Police, manufactured between 1948 & 1951 in the serial range C1 to C223998. also known as the Pre Model 10 as the Model 10 designation was introduced in 1957.
Value in excellent condition could run as high as $350, the more wear it is showing the lower the value.
Your gun incorporates the hammerblock safety introduced in World War II, so it is safe to carry with all chambers loaded. Assuming good condition it will be safety to shoot with any standard pressure or PLusP loaded ammo, a search on member Saxon Pig will bring you several discussion threads where he has tried to wear out or destroy a Military & Police of that vintage using PlusP ammo, with no success.
You have a post war .38 Military & Police, manufactured between 1948 & 1951 in the serial range C1 to C223998. also known as the Pre Model 10 as the Model 10 designation was introduced in 1957.
Value in excellent condition could run as high as $350, the more wear it is showing the lower the value.
Your gun incorporates the hammerblock safety introduced in World War II, so it is safe to carry with all chambers loaded. Assuming good condition it will be safety to shoot with any standard pressure or PLusP loaded ammo, a search on member Saxon Pig will bring you several discussion threads where he has tried to wear out or destroy a Military & Police of that vintage using PlusP ammo, with no success.
Radagast
Member
I'm3rd:
Your Model 10 .38 Military & Police was manufactured in 1972 or 1973. Serial range for those years was D420001 to 510000.
26696 is an assembly number used to track parts in the factory, it has no meanng after the gun is assembled.
NPD 567 does sound like a departmental marking, but I can't confirm that.
Your Model 10 .38 Military & Police was manufactured in 1972 or 1973. Serial range for those years was D420001 to 510000.
26696 is an assembly number used to track parts in the factory, it has no meanng after the gun is assembled.
NPD 567 does sound like a departmental marking, but I can't confirm that.
KSCCHTrainer
Member
Safety Hammerless .32 S&W(Short)
Picked this up in a trade a couple of days ago. It is in very good mechanical condition and doesn't appear to have been fired much as the lockup is tight and the fore/aft play in the cylinder is less than most more modern revolvers. Finish appears to be about 40-50 percent. Grips are intact and original hard rubber with no apparent cracks.
After a quick range session, it turns out to be an excellent shooter as well.
The front sight is milled into the barrel so from what I've found it is a "Third Model"
Wondering if anyone can date it and give me an approximate value. Serial # is 188,2xx
Picked this up in a trade a couple of days ago. It is in very good mechanical condition and doesn't appear to have been fired much as the lockup is tight and the fore/aft play in the cylinder is less than most more modern revolvers. Finish appears to be about 40-50 percent. Grips are intact and original hard rubber with no apparent cracks.
After a quick range session, it turns out to be an excellent shooter as well.
The front sight is milled into the barrel so from what I've found it is a "Third Model"
Wondering if anyone can date it and give me an approximate value. Serial # is 188,2xx
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Radagast
Member
KSCCTrainer:
Unfortunately the Standard Catalog of S&W doesn't give a breakdown by year on that model.
The .32 Safety Hammerless 3rd Model was manufactured between 1909 & 1937 in the serial range 170000 to 242981. The earlier 2nd Model averaged roughly 10,000 guns a year, so its likely that your gun dates to around 1910 to 1915.
The only way to be sure would be to obtain a factory letter from S&Ws historian, Mr Roy Jinks. The letter costs $50 (he has to manually research the original shipping papers) and the gun is only worth around $125-$185 in that condition per the Standard Catalog of S&W, so its probably not a worthwhile option unless the gun has family history.
The third model was manufactured after S&W started advertising them as suitable for smokeless powder, so it should be fine with current factory ammo.
Unfortunately the Standard Catalog of S&W doesn't give a breakdown by year on that model.
The .32 Safety Hammerless 3rd Model was manufactured between 1909 & 1937 in the serial range 170000 to 242981. The earlier 2nd Model averaged roughly 10,000 guns a year, so its likely that your gun dates to around 1910 to 1915.
The only way to be sure would be to obtain a factory letter from S&Ws historian, Mr Roy Jinks. The letter costs $50 (he has to manually research the original shipping papers) and the gun is only worth around $125-$185 in that condition per the Standard Catalog of S&W, so its probably not a worthwhile option unless the gun has family history.
The third model was manufactured after S&W started advertising them as suitable for smokeless powder, so it should be fine with current factory ammo.
KSCCHTrainer
Member
Thanks. It has no family history with me, but the father of the person I got it from had it from new. His father passed a number of years ago and he doesn't know when it was originally purchased which was the reason for my query.
I have fired it with modern Winchester ammo and it's remarkably accurate for what it is. I reload and cast my own bullets so ammo won't be a problem even after .32 S&W is discontinued -
JesusismyPapa
Member
S & W .32 Long CTG 3-1/4"
I have had this beautiful little handgun for several years now and am getting more and more interested in the "whole handgun thing," so I am trying to find out how old this is and maybe who it's past owners were. The gun is very clean and hardly used. On the underside steel of the grip it displays only numbers as follows: 351545. On the right side of the 3-1/4" barrel it displays: .32 Long CTG. On the left side it has the words Smith & Wesson. On the top it shows the patent info as follows: Pat. Feb. 8. 08. Sept 14. 09. Dec. 29. 14. The wooden grips are in excellent condition with the number 364168 penciled on the inside and “Pat. 1917” stamped on the bottom where the wood joins itself. They do not have any medallions on them, but it does have the original screw in it with the threaded companion on the other side. I could not see any markings on the steel under the grips. The butt is rounded with the S&W crest on the left side only. There are 4 screws on the right side plate opposite the S&W crest. The top is smooth (verses Serrated) with a notched rear sight looking down to a half moon fixed front sight. On the stationary part where the cylinder swings down the numbers 78651 appear. The only sign of wear is at the tip of the barrel where there is a little holster wear and a little pitting where the finger rested when not on the trigger pull. Thank you, for your time in this matter. I know there are a lot of very knowledgeable people who are kind enough to help, so I hope I can, at least, find out how old it is. Thank you again. God bless America!
I have had this beautiful little handgun for several years now and am getting more and more interested in the "whole handgun thing," so I am trying to find out how old this is and maybe who it's past owners were. The gun is very clean and hardly used. On the underside steel of the grip it displays only numbers as follows: 351545. On the right side of the 3-1/4" barrel it displays: .32 Long CTG. On the left side it has the words Smith & Wesson. On the top it shows the patent info as follows: Pat. Feb. 8. 08. Sept 14. 09. Dec. 29. 14. The wooden grips are in excellent condition with the number 364168 penciled on the inside and “Pat. 1917” stamped on the bottom where the wood joins itself. They do not have any medallions on them, but it does have the original screw in it with the threaded companion on the other side. I could not see any markings on the steel under the grips. The butt is rounded with the S&W crest on the left side only. There are 4 screws on the right side plate opposite the S&W crest. The top is smooth (verses Serrated) with a notched rear sight looking down to a half moon fixed front sight. On the stationary part where the cylinder swings down the numbers 78651 appear. The only sign of wear is at the tip of the barrel where there is a little holster wear and a little pitting where the finger rested when not on the trigger pull. Thank you, for your time in this matter. I know there are a lot of very knowledgeable people who are kind enough to help, so I hope I can, at least, find out how old it is. Thank you again. God bless America!
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cyclopsshooter
Member
1. Pre War M&p
2. fixed sights
3. 4"
4. six shot
5. 38 special
6. square
7. Serial no. 185590
Thanks!
2. fixed sights
3. 4"
4. six shot
5. 38 special
6. square
7. Serial no. 185590
Thanks!
Radagast
Member
JesusismyPapa:
Could you post a pic?
The grips are from a .32 Regulation Police, the serial number 364168 is the serial number of the gun they were originally fitted to. These were a patented square butt grip that adapted the round frame. The Regulation Police stocks were not interchangeable with the earlier .32 Hand Ejector stocks.
If your gun is a Regulation Police then there should be a notch in the rear of the grip frame so that only part of the back strap is visible. The serial number should be stamped on the front strap of the grips frame. The .32 Regulation Police was not marked as such, it is the grips that identify it as different to the round butt .32 Hand Ejector.
The grips did not have S&W medallions during that period and the 3.25 inch barrle was a standard factory option.
351545 is the serial number for your gun, it was made sometime between 1917 (serial number 260000) & October 1923 (serial number 379160). With rougly 120,000 guns made over a six year period I would guesstimate 1922 or 1923 for your gun.
78651 is an assembly number, used to track parts in the factory, it has no meaning after the gun is completed.
Could you post a pic?
The grips are from a .32 Regulation Police, the serial number 364168 is the serial number of the gun they were originally fitted to. These were a patented square butt grip that adapted the round frame. The Regulation Police stocks were not interchangeable with the earlier .32 Hand Ejector stocks.
If your gun is a Regulation Police then there should be a notch in the rear of the grip frame so that only part of the back strap is visible. The serial number should be stamped on the front strap of the grips frame. The .32 Regulation Police was not marked as such, it is the grips that identify it as different to the round butt .32 Hand Ejector.
The grips did not have S&W medallions during that period and the 3.25 inch barrle was a standard factory option.
351545 is the serial number for your gun, it was made sometime between 1917 (serial number 260000) & October 1923 (serial number 379160). With rougly 120,000 guns made over a six year period I would guesstimate 1922 or 1923 for your gun.
78651 is an assembly number, used to track parts in the factory, it has no meaning after the gun is completed.
Radagast
Member
JesusismyPapa:
A little more info, the .32 Regulation Police was manufactured on the small I frame, modern grips will not interchange.
Your gun has a heat treated cylinder, so it should be safe to shoot with standard factory loads. It is not made of modern steel though, so don't feed it hot hand loads.
Heat treatment began at serial number 321000 in 1920, so 1920-1923 is your date range.
Your gun lacks the positive hammer block safety introduced during World War II. If dropped it could fire, so leave the chamber under the hammer empty.
A little more info, the .32 Regulation Police was manufactured on the small I frame, modern grips will not interchange.
Your gun has a heat treated cylinder, so it should be safe to shoot with standard factory loads. It is not made of modern steel though, so don't feed it hot hand loads.
Heat treatment began at serial number 321000 in 1920, so 1920-1923 is your date range.
Your gun lacks the positive hammer block safety introduced during World War II. If dropped it could fire, so leave the chamber under the hammer empty.
Radagast
Member
cyclopsshooter:
You have a pre World War I .38 Military & Police Model of 1905 3rd Change manufactured between 1909 & 1915. Serial range was 146900 to 241703.
Your gun predates heat treatment of cylinders, so stick to standard velocity lead loads only. No PlusP, +P+, jacketed or semi jacketed ammo.
It also predates both the positive hammer block safety (1944) & the non-positive hammer block (1917). If dropped it could fire, so leave the chamber under the hammer empty.
You have a pre World War I .38 Military & Police Model of 1905 3rd Change manufactured between 1909 & 1915. Serial range was 146900 to 241703.
Your gun predates heat treatment of cylinders, so stick to standard velocity lead loads only. No PlusP, +P+, jacketed or semi jacketed ammo.
It also predates both the positive hammer block safety (1944) & the non-positive hammer block (1917). If dropped it could fire, so leave the chamber under the hammer empty.
JesusismyPapa
Member
Concerning the grips, the grips are flush to each other for 1-1/2" then the back strap is visible for the duration. I tried to post these pics, but the file manager wouldn't let me because I had posted these is a similar link, so I retook these just now. If you need other views please let me know. Thank you for your help. BTW I am 6' 4", but am lacking the 360 by about a third!
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Radagast
Member
JesusismyPapa:
Its definitely a .32 Regulaton Police from the early 1920s. Has the Early grip style, early ejector rod, lacks the Made in the USA stamp introduced in the 20s, S&W trademark on the left side of the frame as used from 1917.
Its definitely a .32 Regulaton Police from the early 1920s. Has the Early grip style, early ejector rod, lacks the Made in the USA stamp introduced in the 20s, S&W trademark on the left side of the frame as used from 1917.
Outdoorsman DOB
Hey All, this is my first post & I hope the pictures attached correctly.
Can you tell me something about this, it was my Grand-dad's we figure he purchased in the 30's. From other descriptions, I think it's an Outdoorsman but it has something extra behind the trigger guard.
22 caliber
6in barrel
6 shot
6633xx
My Dad has a newer model as well, a K22 with serial number K2031xx. I was able to shoot my Dad's last month and fell in love with the piece.
Can you also explain the difference between round & square grips shapes?
Hey All, this is my first post & I hope the pictures attached correctly.
Can you tell me something about this, it was my Grand-dad's we figure he purchased in the 30's. From other descriptions, I think it's an Outdoorsman but it has something extra behind the trigger guard.
22 caliber
6in barrel
6 shot
6633xx
My Dad has a newer model as well, a K22 with serial number K2031xx. I was able to shoot my Dad's last month and fell in love with the piece.
Can you also explain the difference between round & square grips shapes?
Attachments
Radagast
Member
RichC123:
We wants it! We wants it! My Precioussssss...
A little more serious, your grandads gun is a K22 Outdoorsman 1st Model manufactured between 1935 & 1940.
The Outdoorsman was/is S&Ws first K frame .22 target revolver.
The item behind the trigger is a tyler grip adaptor. They were quite popular back in the time before S&Ws Goncalo Alves target grips were introduced. As the grips appear to be original to the gun I wouldn't be surprised if the adaptor dates tot he same period as the gun.
A total of 19,500 K22 Outdoorsmen were manufactured between 1931 & 1930, so they are not exceptionally rare, but they rarely show up on gun forums such as this.
Keep in mind that the gun predates the modern hammer block safety introduced in 1944 after a fatality with a dropped gun. It would be prudent to only load five rounds, leaving the chamber under the hammer empty.
In 2006 hte Standard Catalog of S&W gave a value of $1000 in excellent condition.
Your dads gun is a K22 Masterpiece / Pre-Model 17 manufactured in 1953. The Model 19 designation was introduced in 1957. It K22 Masterpiece was different from the K22 Outdorrsman in that it used a ribbed barrel and was weighted to have the same balance as the K38 & K32 Masterpiece target revolvers.
We wants it! We wants it! My Precioussssss...
A little more serious, your grandads gun is a K22 Outdoorsman 1st Model manufactured between 1935 & 1940.
The Outdoorsman was/is S&Ws first K frame .22 target revolver.
The item behind the trigger is a tyler grip adaptor. They were quite popular back in the time before S&Ws Goncalo Alves target grips were introduced. As the grips appear to be original to the gun I wouldn't be surprised if the adaptor dates tot he same period as the gun.
A total of 19,500 K22 Outdoorsmen were manufactured between 1931 & 1930, so they are not exceptionally rare, but they rarely show up on gun forums such as this.
Keep in mind that the gun predates the modern hammer block safety introduced in 1944 after a fatality with a dropped gun. It would be prudent to only load five rounds, leaving the chamber under the hammer empty.
In 2006 hte Standard Catalog of S&W gave a value of $1000 in excellent condition.
Your dads gun is a K22 Masterpiece / Pre-Model 17 manufactured in 1953. The Model 19 designation was introduced in 1957. It K22 Masterpiece was different from the K22 Outdorrsman in that it used a ribbed barrel and was weighted to have the same balance as the K38 & K32 Masterpiece target revolvers.
Radagast
Member
pabner:
You have a post war .38/32 Terrier manufactured between 1948 & 1957. To refine the afge down a bit, if there is a tensioning screw in the front strap of the grip then it 1948-1953 and is manufactured on the I frame. if there is no screw then it is 1953-1957 and manufactured on the improved I frame. If there is a screw in the side plate just in front of the hammer then it is a 1955 or earlier gun, if there is no screw there (only three screws in the side plate) then it is a 1955 to 1957 gun.
You have a post war .38/32 Terrier manufactured between 1948 & 1957. To refine the afge down a bit, if there is a tensioning screw in the front strap of the grip then it 1948-1953 and is manufactured on the I frame. if there is no screw then it is 1953-1957 and manufactured on the improved I frame. If there is a screw in the side plate just in front of the hammer then it is a 1955 or earlier gun, if there is no screw there (only three screws in the side plate) then it is a 1955 to 1957 gun.
harmon rabb
Member
- Joined
- Mar 14, 2009
- Messages
- 2,699
Model 10-5, 38spl, 5 inch barrel, serial number: C935612
pic:
Any ideas?
pic:
Any ideas?
Radagast
Member
LawAbider:
The serial number for the Model 19-4 Combat Magnum should have a K as part of the serial number,which should be between 10K0001 & 311K23. The number you are quoting is probably an assembly number, used to track parts in the factory. Assembly numbers have no meaning after the gun is completed.
You may have to take off the grips to see the serial number. It will be stamped on the bottom of the grip frame and may be duplicated on the frame under the cylinder yoke. Post it and I'll give you the year made.
The Model 19-4 was produced between 1977 & 1982.
Your Model 586 Distinguished Combat Magnum was manufactured in late 1982. Serial number AAF9000 shiped in October & ABL3999 in December of that year.
There is a recall on this particular model, with some magnum ammo the primer can flow back into the firing pin bushing, locking upthe gun. Under the recall S&W will pay shippng both ways and install a new firing pin & bushing.
If your gun has been modified under the recall there should be an M stamped after the model number under the cylinder yoke. If you wish to have your gun modified give S&W a call and they will send you a shipping label.
The serial number for the Model 19-4 Combat Magnum should have a K as part of the serial number,which should be between 10K0001 & 311K23. The number you are quoting is probably an assembly number, used to track parts in the factory. Assembly numbers have no meaning after the gun is completed.
You may have to take off the grips to see the serial number. It will be stamped on the bottom of the grip frame and may be duplicated on the frame under the cylinder yoke. Post it and I'll give you the year made.
The Model 19-4 was produced between 1977 & 1982.
Your Model 586 Distinguished Combat Magnum was manufactured in late 1982. Serial number AAF9000 shiped in October & ABL3999 in December of that year.
There is a recall on this particular model, with some magnum ammo the primer can flow back into the firing pin bushing, locking upthe gun. Under the recall S&W will pay shippng both ways and install a new firing pin & bushing.
If your gun has been modified under the recall there should be an M stamped after the model number under the cylinder yoke. If you wish to have your gun modified give S&W a call and they will send you a shipping label.
Radagast
Member
harmon rabb:
Your Model 10-5 .38 Military & Police tapered barrel was manufactured in 1966 or 1967. Serial rage for those years was C810533 to C999999. The grips are probably replacements, the correct grips for those years had an uncheckered diamond around the grip screws. The diamondless style was introduced in 1968.
Your Model 10-5 .38 Military & Police tapered barrel was manufactured in 1966 or 1967. Serial rage for those years was C810533 to C999999. The grips are probably replacements, the correct grips for those years had an uncheckered diamond around the grip screws. The diamondless style was introduced in 1968.
rcmodel
Member in memoriam
1975.
rc
rc
