I'm starting to dislike short barrels

[Youngster]

"Short" as in the typical tactical length of 20" or less.

IMO, they give up a LOT in the name of handiness and portability, but unless you get into SBS lengths they're still awkwardly long in many cases anyway.

I shoot so much better with a sporting length barrel because of the feel and swing, the difference for me is just as big as that between shooting with a PGO and a full stock.

Anybody find this to be the case?

 

[zhyla]

20" works fine for me. You can always add a little weight to the end if you want to mimic the feel of a longer gun, I guess.

 

[Girodin]

I shoot so much better with a sporting length barrel because of the feel and swing, the difference for me is just as big as that between shooting with a PGO and a full stock.

Anybody find this to be the case?

If you are talking about shooting clays, birds or other demanding wing shooting then yes (save that I would say the difference does not even begin to approach that of a PGO shot gun vs a gun with a stock). If you are talking about the type of shooting the are intended for then no I do not find this to be the case at all.

 

[MCgunner]

I have 40+ years of shotgunning our feathered friends. I can adapt to the whippiness of a 20" gun and hunt with a 20 gauge coach gun for dove, but on ducks and geese, I sorta prefer the smoother swing of a longer, heavier gun. The shorter, lighter guns are great for flushing game where you have less time on target, though. A tool for every job, I say. I'd hunt ducks more with the little 20, though, if I could find a 3" steel load that patterns worth a toot. But, truth be told, I really haven't been on the search. I stick to the 12s, 28" Mossberg 500 in OEM camo, mostly, for ducks.

On bigger, heavier gauge guns, I cut back on barrel length to compensate for the slow swing, like on my 9 lb H&R 24" barrel 10 gauge. It swings pretty normal even though it's a heavy beast. I like 24" barrels on 3.5" 12s and pump 10s and such, too, for this reason.

 

[oneounceload]

I hit more targets with 30 or 32 inch barrels than I could ever hope to do with my 18.5 pump. I needed to add a weight to a 25" semi because it was too whippy

 

[Fred Fuller]

I haven't yet seen a thug that could move as fast and erratically as a dove can fly. I like 18" barrels on house guns, and longer barrels on field guns. But I spend more time with riot guns these days than I do with dove guns. I think that makes a difference in what feels good.

lpl

 

[Ben86]

What shorter barrels give up in ballistics won't be noticed at the short ranges it is intended for. Try maneuvering a 28 inch barrel shotgun around your house and see how cumbersome it is to clear room to room with it. The whole reason for the shorter barrel is maneuverability. Of course you shoot the longer barreled shotguns better, but that's not the point.

 

[berettashotgun]

Kinda off the intended flow of the topic, but 2" extended chokes sure opened up some use for a few 26" barreled O/U Berettas I own.
A 2" spreader choke on a SD shotgun would have a nice option for me.
Too bad SD/HD shotguns never seem to thread the barrel - and charge more for less IMHO.

 

[ArmedBear]

I haven't yet seen a thug that could move as fast and erratically as a dove can fly.

Michael Vick? LeGarrette Blount?

 

[MCgunner]

Quote:
I haven't yet seen a thug that could move as fast and erratically as a dove can fly.




Michael Vick? LeGarrette Blount?

Tiger Woods? Okay, well, he crashed, just sayin'.

 

[MachIVshooter]

If you are talking about shooting clays, birds or other demanding wing shooting then yes (save that I would say the difference does not even begin to approach that of a PGO shot gun vs a gun with a stock). If you are talking about the type of shooting the are intended for then no I do not find this to be the case at all.

My thoughts exactly. It's all about the choke, though. Shotguns use fast burning powder, so you don't really give up velocity going from 28" to 18". But since most 18-20" "tactical" type guns are IC or cylinder bore, that's gonna be a major handicap for clay shooting.

When I shoot clays, with a single barrel, usually modified. Double gun, IC & modified. If it's gonna be long handicap, modified and full.

For birds (pheasant), modified or full (or mod and full with a double).

But my 11-87 Police is IC, and that's as tight as I'd want on a defensive gun. When I do the barrel set for my coach gun (receiver is a turn-of-the-century Bayard), it's gonna be cylinder bore.

Just depends on what you're doing with it.

 

[AcceptableUserName]

lol @ tiger woods



Gilbert Arenas

 

[natman]

"Short" as in the typical tactical length of 20" or less.

IMO, they give up a LOT in the name of handiness and portability, but unless you get into SBS lengths they're still awkwardly long in many cases anyway.

I shoot so much better with a sporting length barrel because of the feel and swing, the difference for me is just as big as that between shooting with a PGO and a full stock.

Anybody find this to be the case?

Barrels under 20" are too short for wing shooting, as you've discovered. They are fine for defense and turkey hunting, because in those applications a shotgun is aimed like a rifle and the poor swinging qualities don't matter.

 

[Dave McCracken]

I've done good work on quail and ringnecks over good dogs with a riot barreled 870. However, in the dove field it's more of a challenge than I want.

And on doves, I need no further challenge.....

Frankenstein's bunty little 21" barrel has worked for me on Canada and snow geese, but these days I use a longer barrel and hit them harder/more centered.

 

[Gary A]

On a side note, what about Tiger Woods, whatever his difficulties, would suggest that he is or ever has been a "thug"?

Sometimes I think we (people) just like to go after blood in the water. Lord help the first guy that bleeds - he's dead meat. It's not terribly inspiring. (Now I guess I'm a thug, too.)

 

[Youngster]

What shorter barrels give up in ballistics won't be noticed at the short ranges it is intended for. Try maneuvering a 28 inch barrel shotgun around your house and see how cumbersome it is to clear room to room with it. The whole reason for the shorter barrel is maneuverability. Of course you shoot the longer barreled shotguns better, but that's not the point.

I don't anything longer than 14" to be all that handy in tight spaces anyway, and I don't see myself ever engaging in room clearing.

I've got a 12.5, 18.5 and a 28" barrel for my 870 and an Ithaca with a 30" barrel, each has its place but the longer tubes are just so much more versatile and shootable in my hands.

 

[Girodin]

What shorter barrels give up in ballistics won't be noticed at the short ranges it is intended for.

Shotgun shells use fast burning powders you lose very little in terms of velocity, thus what you give up in ballistics probably wont be noticed period. Buy a chronograph if you doubt this. All the numbers I've come across indicate that even going to a very short barrel like 8" you don't lose much velocity.

 

[oneounceload]

What shorter barrels give up in ballistics won't be noticed at the short ranges it is intended for. Try maneuvering a 28 inch barrel shotgun around your house and see how cumbersome it is to clear room to room with it. The whole reason for the shorter barrel is maneuverability

Typically, the ballistics aren't any different. And while maneuvering is harder with a 28 - IF I find myself in that situation, the LAST thing I am doing is leaving the safety of the bedroom. The police can do that - I'll protect me and mine from that room instead

 

[nicksterdemus]

"...even going to a very short barrel like 8" you don't lose much velocity."

That's swell, but I shot a 3" magnum 000 out of a 18.5" brl and it spit out quite the fireball.

If the powder is that fast burning why am I shooting flames?

 

[A man with a gun!]

Try swinging a 28 or 30" in our thick shoulder deep (or deeper) California brush let alone inside of a house.

I'll take that 18.5 incher anyday!

 

[AcceptableUserName]

Youngster, you're right about anything under 18.5" being fairly clunky in close quarters...


BUT I think the fact remains anything MORE than 18.5" is just that much worse..


and you're also right about the longers being much more pleasant to shoot...


I still take the 18.5" for the reason I gave....out in the open, barrel length doesn't matter...but in that scenario the shotgun as a whole isn't the weapon of chice anyway.

 

[Youngster]

Youngster, you're right about anything under 18.5" being fairly clunky in close quarters...


BUT I think the fact remains anything MORE than 18.5" is just that much worse..


and you're also right about the longers being much more pleasant to shoot...


I still take the 18.5" for the reason I gave....out in the open, barrel length doesn't matter...but in that scenario the shotgun as a whole isn't the weapon of chice anyway.

Riot length barrels and sporting barrels are more alike than they are different in terms of indoor and tight quarter handling, it's only the shorties that really shine. The only area where I really find the riot length stuff a whole lot handier is when stowing it in a vehicle.

Shotgun shells use fast burning powders you lose very little in terms of velocity, thus what you give up in ballistics probably wont be noticed period. Buy a chronograph if you doubt this. All the numbers I've come across indicate that even going to a very short barrel like 8" you don't lose much velocity.

I've seen differently, the velocity figure different may not be huge but they are significant when you're talking the individual pellet meeting the target level. The powder may burn up quickly but I think it still needs time to impart its energy properly.

Going by other's experience I'd expect my 12.5 barrel can expect to lose an average of about 50 fps with shot or buckload compared to an 18.5" bbl, which in turn would give up a bit less than that {maybe 35 fps} to a sporting length barrel, with slugs the difference appears much greater. That's all all pretty much academic though.

What isn't, at least to me, is the massive reduction in blast and flash the longer barrels offer, there's something like a 10 fold reduction in sound level going from a 18.5 to a 28" barrel. It makes a difference if you start getting blast sensitive after extended shooting like I do.

 

[Girodin]

"...even going to a very short barrel like 8" you don't lose much velocity."

That's swell, but I shot a 3" magnum 000 out of a 18.5" brl and it spit out quite the fireball.

If the powder is that fast burning why am I shooting flames?

My chrono measures velocity not fireball size and velocity is the important variable we are talking about.

the velocity figure different may not be huge but they are significant when you're talking the individual pellet meeting the target level.

Going by other's experience I'd expect my 12.5 barrel can expect to lose an average of about 50 fps with shot or buckload compared to an 18.5" bbl,

50 FPS is not significant. Particullary if it is being observed between a small number of shots. There is a certain amount of variation shot to shot. 50 FPS is next to nothing.

The common consensus on this board is always that there is not need for 3" shells for social work that 2 3/4" shells are more than enough and that even reduced recoil 2 3/4" shells have more than enough oomph. The differences between those loads will often exceed 50 FPS . If it is widely seen as being insignificant in the context of shell length it seems that it is a hard sale to say it matters when difference is caused instead by barrel length. There is a difference in the energy levels but I honestly do not believe the differences are significant.

I'd suggest anyone real worried about lost velocity do some testing for themselves. Shoot a significant number of rounds over a chrono with your field barrel and with a 18.5" barrel and test penetration in a media you believe is appropriate with each as well.

To me there is a very big difference in maneuverability when we are talking about roughly 10" of barrel. Blast and noise do not get objectionable to me (presuming I am wearing ear protection) until you get to the real short barrels.

Obviously subjective factors such as feel or sensitivity to blast are just that, totally subjective and might make a longer barrel a better choice for any given individual. That said, there is most likely a reason that the overwhelming majority of guns built for social work are outfitted with shorter barrels.

 

[MCgunner]

Try swinging a 28 or 30" in our thick shoulder deep (or deeper) California brush let alone inside of a house.

I'll take that 18.5 incher anyday!

A 20" coach gun is shorter than an 18.5" pump or auto. Very handly little gun for that sort of hunting. I'll keep my longer barreled guns for waterfowl, though. They do swing smother. I love that little coach gun for doves, though, quick and deadly.

 

[nicksterdemus]

"My chrono measures...not fireball size ..."



I don't doubt that statement.

I'm merely curious because I shot several different 2 3/4 high brass loads out of the 18.5" w/nothing save the blast. The 3" magnum almost singed the hand on the forestock.

Judging from the still it appears to be a foot high and a foot and a half long. That seems to me to be a lot of unburned powder that I've read should be played out in the first foot of brl due to the fast burning shotgun powder.

I'm not denying your claims of velocity or anything else.