I'm tired of CNN and their 2A/SYG rhetoric

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Except when the selection of the people reported is primarily on the basis of the race as opposed to behavioral criteria which are exhibited.

Thank you for posting that link. It provides good insight into the behavior which I am pointing out. Start reading at A NEIGHBORHOOD IN FEAR. It recounts several cases of young black men victimizing a neighborhood, stealing a bike and laptop among other things. Things were so bad in the neighborhood that one of the kids living there was accused of stealing a bicycle, and had to prove it was his to police checking the serial number. It just so happened to be that he was a black kid. Maybe it wasn't racial and they went to every kid to check bicycles...


I am not sure you and I are taking the same language. If a particular neighborhood is being plagued by crime, and it is all or mostly by a particular race, what exactly are the people living there suppose to do?

Another words if a stranger who is green is seen lurking around at night when it is cold and raining, and it just so happens that most of the crimes have been caused by green people, should that not make the people living there suspicious?
Or should they say to themselves, gee, I do not want to think the worst of green people, so I am going to ignore this person because assuming they might be up to no good is wrong.
That maybe the Utopian world you wished we lived in, but in the real world it would be asinine to think and react that way.



Going to McDonalds the next day doesn't preclude grieving. Unless you're talking about social grieving, not psychological grieving. And not altogether helpful to your argument in the first place.


First of all I am not arguing. Second, I did not bring up the "girlfriend", you did. I am simply pointing out that according to the latest reports, she is denying being his girlfriend, and her lack of grieving goes well beyond her going to McD's the next day. In reality she will play little to no roll in the case since what she has to say is limited in scope.


It's only laughable with a poor understanding of road rage. Road rage can happen between a motorist and a pedestrian. Aside from that, your assumption is false regarding the turning of it into a racial issue if they had been reversed. There is enough information to support the argument that there were racial issues present when Martin was shot. Your own linked article corroborates that argument. That would not happen for the Adkins incident, unless for some reason similar information was uncovered.


My goodness you are being obtuse. Of course the Adkins situation should not be considered racial, just as the Martin case should not have. My only point is that the media picks and chooses which stories they will frame as racially motivated based on their own inherent biases and political thinking. Why are you so unwilling to accept that?

My argument was never predicated on the idea that he was a white racist wannabe cop. The wannabe cop argument stands on it's own without having to involve how white he is, with the "aoles who always get away" comment.
As much as the media is drinking their own koolaid, I have no desire to get koolaid of a different flavor from the people who are doing their best to make every mental contortion from poor analytical psychology red herrings to avoid any discussion that might look poorly on SYG.

I will be happy to discuss any aspect of the Martin case you wish. However I also want to discuss how the liberal media frames and distorts most of what we read and watch. The only difference in this case is that they are in large part responsible for stirring racial animus in the Martin incident when it did not exist.
More importantly, most black kids that are shot on a regular basis are killed by fellow blacks, yet the media does not turn those incidents into international news. Instead they are willing to misidentify the race of the shooter and imply that another innocent black has been killed at the hand of white people, ignoring the fact it is a statistical rarity.

So ask me questions and/or discuss the case with me, but also answer and discuss the medias role in this as well if you want some back and forth.
 
Originally posted by Neverwinter. Except when the selection of the people reported is primarily on the basis of the race as opposed to behavioral criteria which are exhibited.
That's not what happened.

The tapes of all the calls Zimmerman made have been made public. Zimmerman never reported a suspicious person by race. The only time he mentioned race is when the dispatcher asked him the race of the person.
 
That's not what happened.

The tapes of all the calls Zimmerman made have been made public. Zimmerman never reported a suspicious person by race. The only time he mentioned race is when the dispatcher asked him the race of the person.

Of course, in the widely circulated first-cut "news" report, the question by the dispatcher was mysteriously edited out -- an "oversight" for which an NBC "Today" show producer, and an NBC-affiliate "reporter" who compiled a similar sound bite, were both fired.

But of course, no "journalists" are guilty of lack of clarity, ethics, or other mundane attributes in pursuit of a juicier story...


.
 
If a particular neighborhood is being plagued by crime, and it is all or mostly by a particular race, what exactly are the people living there suppose to do?

Another words if a stranger who is green is seen lurking around at night when it is cold and raining, and it just so happens that most of the crimes have been caused by green people, should that not make the people living there suspicious?
The article does not mention that the majority or all of the incidents were perpetuated by such. Maybe that's a failing of the media in accurately conveying the data.
Does that justify reporting all young black males that are seen in the community? Observe from outside the lens of privilege, that not all young people have access to a car for when they go to the convenience store.

My goodness you are being obtuse. Of course the Adkins situation should not be considered racial, just as the Martin case should not have. My only point is that the media picks and chooses which stories they will frame as racially motivated based on their own inherent biases and political thinking. Why are you so unwilling to accept that?
The point is that your Adkins case doesn't prove that statement because the reasons that Martin was identified as being racial are not present in the Adkins incident. Your own statement was that race should play a factor in determining whether people are suspicious. There is nothing so far to suggest that Adkins was selected to be almost run over and shot because of racial animus.

I will be happy to discuss any aspect of the Martin case you wish. However I also want to discuss how the liberal media frames and distorts most of what we read and watch. The only difference in this case is that they are in large part responsible for stirring racial animus in the Martin incident when it did not exist.
Except that there was racial animus in the Martin incident, as corroborated by the Reuters article you provided. You even agreed with the concept of the racial animus. Claiming that the media is biased by not injecting racial issues into the non-racial Adkins case doesn't make sense. There are racial issues with the Martin case, and the media is reporting on them.
 
That's not what happened.

The tapes of all the calls Zimmerman made have been made public. Zimmerman never reported a suspicious person by race. The only time he mentioned race is when the dispatcher asked him the race of the person.
Reporting is different than selection.

Vector has kindly provided ample evidence for the role of race in selection.
 
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Except when the selection of the people reported is primarily on the basis of the race as opposed to behavioral criteria which are exhibited.

Incorrect. Zimmerman reported behavior, the police asked questions about race.

You are claiming he made his selection on who to report, based on race. There is no evidence to support your assumption.
 
Quote by Neverwinter. The article does not mention that the majority or all of the incidents were perpetuated by such. Maybe that's a failing of the media in accurately conveying the data.
Or maybe it's also the fault of people who believe what they want to believe, and keep repeating it long after it's been refuted.
Quote by Neverwinter.
Does that justify reporting all young black males that are seen in the community?

You have evidence of that? Can you give us a cite that shows he reported all young black males who were seen in the community?

Or is that just your imagination?
Quote by Neverwinter. Observe from outside the lens of privilege, that not all young people have access to a car for when they go to the convenience store.
Nor do all White people.
 
Or maybe it's also the fault of people who believe what they want to believe, and keep repeating it long after it's been refuted.
Oops. You're right. CNN reports it:
Zimmerman neighbor, fmr. Neighborhood Watch captain: Prior burglaries were by 'young black males;' 'if you plant corn, you get corn'

"Frank Taaffe, George Zimmerman’s neighbor and former Neighborhood Watch captain, tells CNN’s Soledad O’Brien that prior robberies in area were by young black males and that Zimmerman protected his residence from a potential burglary on February 2nd. Taaffe denies telling The New York Times that the prior burglaries were done by “Trayvon-like dudes with their pants down."

Taffe says, “We had eight burglaries in our neighborhood all perpetrated by young black males in the 15 months prior to Trayvon being shot. It would have been nine - there would have been nine, but George Zimmerman through his efforts of being a neighborhood watch captain helped stop one in progress, documented in the 911 calls February 2. My house was being robbed, and George on his nightly rounds watched this burglary in progress, called Sanford P.D., waited for them, and helped ensure that nothing bad happened to my house. And it's documented the 911 call for February 2. That was my residence that George Zimmerman helped stop.”

Taaffe continues, “All of the perpetrators of the burglaries, the prior burglaries, were young black males.”"

You have evidence of that? Can you give us a cite that shows he reported all young black males who were seen in the community?

Or is that just your imagination?
Sorry, the selection of ALL vs ANY was poor word choice that doesn't correctly describe it. It was that his selection of Martin was based on race since walking instead of driving a car in the rain was the behavior observed for Zimmerman's perception of suspicion.
 
Oops. You're right. CNN reports it:
Zimmerman neighbor, fmr. Neighborhood Watch captain: Prior burglaries were by 'young black males;' 'if you plant corn, you get corn'

So if your neighbor says something that someone might interpret as racist, that would make you a racist?

There is no evidence that Zimmerman ever called in to report someone as Black. In every incident in which he mentioned race, it was in response to a question by the dispatcher.

It was that his selection of Martin was based on race since walking instead of driving a car in the rain was the behavior observed for Zimmerman's perception of suspicion.
What evidence do you have that he "selected Martin based on race?"
 
The article does not mention that the majority or all of the incidents were perpetuated by such. Maybe that's a failing of the media in accurately conveying the data.


WRONG

Now I see why you are having trouble comprehending what I am saying because you have selective reading and listening problems. Here is a quote from the link I provided;

"Let's talk about the elephant in the room. I'm black, OK?" the woman said, declining to be identified because she anticipated backlash due to her race. She leaned in to look a reporter directly in the eyes. "There were black boys robbing houses in this neighborhood," she said. "That's why George was suspicious of Trayvon Martin."

Does that justify reporting all young black males that are seen in the community?

Another incorrect assumption on your part. You have no way of knowing how many calls Zimmerman made about people of different races except what is reported.
Regardless the Miami Herald reported that some of the calls Zimmerman made that they knew about did not relate to black males.
As to this incident, if he saw any young guy he did not recognize walking around townhouses back yards at night in the cold rain, he certainly sounds like the type of person who would report it, regardless of race.
Wouldn't you, especially if there had been a rash of burglaries in your neighborhood and you were part of the neighborhood watch?

The point is that your Adkins case doesn't prove that statement because the reasons that Martin was identified as being racial are not present in the Adkins incident.


Wrong again. The non existent racial aspect was not relevant in either.
So I was pointing out the hypocrisy of the media in that if they were going to frame the Martin incident as racial, then they should be consistent and do the same for the Adkins incident. he fact that they didn't, and typically don't when minorities are the shooters just goes to further my point.


Your own statement was that race should play a factor in determining whether people are suspicious. There is nothing so far to suggest that Adkins was selected to be almost run over and shot because of racial animus.


You have again gotten it wrong. I said race should only play a factor in the event that enough prior incidents reflected that a majority of the crimes in a neighborhood were committed by a particular race(i.e. Little Havana example). The same would relate to gender in that I'd be much more suspicious of boys and men than girls and women. I guess that would make me a gender profiler in your mind, right?


Except that there was racial animus in the Martin incident, as corroborated by the Reuters article you provided. You even agreed with the concept of the racial animus. Claiming that the media is biased by not injecting racial issues into the non-racial Adkins case doesn't make sense. There are racial issues with the Martin case, and the media is reporting on them.

:rolleyes:
Read above as to the apparent conflict in your mind regarding the two incidents. Lastly, the racial animus I speak of is related to what the media and the race baiters created by turning it into a racial incident, which it clearly was not.
 
He has none. Merely conjecture and assumptions based on a personal bias.
You hit the nail right on the head.

It's the Dan Rather syndrome: "Yes, the document is a forgery, but what it says is true."

"How do you know that, Mr. Rather?"

"Well, I believe it!"
 
You guys seem to know him, and him either being obtuse and/or trying to obfuscate the subject is a pattern with him?
 
Getting back to the o.p; Yes, all news reporting should be fair and unbiased.Also

1. The world should be full of rainbows and unicorns.
2. The husband should be the master of his home.
3. Pedestrians should always have the right of way.
4. Everyone should always have a parking space.
5, All pregnancies should be planned.:rolleyes:
 
He mostly spends his time sitting under a bridge and waiting for the Three Billy Goats Gruff to come by.:rolleyes:

I assume he is a gun owner, just of the liberal persuasion then?

Getting back to the o.p; Yes, all news reporting should be fair and unbiased.

What I would love to to know is how the average American citizen which tends to be center-right can effect positive change on an industry that is fairly far left for the most part?
 
What I would love to to know is how the average American citizen which tends to be center-right can effect positive change on an industry that is fairly far left for the most part?
By watching another channel, of course. As the audience drops off, so does revenue.
 
Amen, Vern. To paraphrase Peter Finch in "Network":

"We'll tell you any sxxx you want to hear."

Great movie. It was made in 1976 and still rings true today. The line between news and entertainment is gone.
 
It's the Dan Rather syndrome: "Yes, the document is a forgery, but what it says is true."

"How do you know that, Mr. Rather?"

"Well, I believe it!"


“Opinion has become the new truth. And many people who already have opinions see in the ‘news media’ an affirmation of the opinion they already had, and that confirms their opinion as fact.” ~ Orson
 
By watching another channel, of course. As the audience drops off, so does revenue.

I agree with that, but it is not enough. People think FOX is conservative because they are so use to left wing news sources. However if we had a channel that was as extreme right as most of the media is left, many would begin to see FOX as genuinely moderate or as they say "fair and balanced". I am of course talking about their actual news, not the talking head and commentary shows.

So aside from changing the channel or not buying the only newspaper in town, what other things can we do to affect change?
 
So if your neighbor says something that someone might interpret as racist, that would make you a racist?
How did you get to calling Zimmerman racist? That link was to a CNN article with a neighbor noting that all of the burglaries were committed by young black males, despite the Reuters article only using the words "several". This was a thread regarding CNN's coverage.

What evidence do you have that he "selected Martin based on race?"
From his own call with a number of false perceptions, namely drug use and being one of "those aoles who always get away" that were based on behavior which is normal for someone without a car who has to walk. If we are to take that behavior as being suspicious, then countless white/black, young/old people are now suspicious in their daily life. Either that or race played a significant factor in his selection of Martin as suspicious, which is what is assumed to be the case given that "race should only play a factor in the event that enough prior incidents reflected that a majority of the crimes in a neighborhood were committed by a particular race".

Vector said:
"Let's talk about the elephant in the room. I'm black, OK?" the woman said, declining to be identified because she anticipated backlash due to her race. She leaned in to look a reporter directly in the eyes. "There were black boys robbing houses in this neighborhood," she said. "That's why George was suspicious of Trayvon Martin."
That quote only indicates that there were black boys robbing houses in that neighborhood. Nothing about how many of the total robberies were committed by them, unless the reader assumes that white/latino/etc were not also significantly represented among the thieves.

Regardless the Miami Herald reported that some of the calls Zimmerman made that they knew about did not relate to black males.
As to this incident, if he saw any young guy he did not recognize walking around townhouses back yards at night in the cold rain, he certainly sounds like the type of person who would report it, regardless of race.
The fact that not all calls were regarding black males doesn't preclude the selection of suspicious people on the basis of being black males.

ABC: Trayvon Martin Shooter Zimmerman’s Audio Tapes Show Calm
Since August 2011, Zimmerman has called in to a non-emergency police line seven times, according to documents released by the Sanford Police Department. Of those calls, five were made to report a “suspicious person.” In the audio released by Seminole County Sheriff’s Department, he describes the suspicious characters as black or African-American, though never mentioning race until after he was asked to describe the characters. These five calls all began similarly, with Zimmerman saying that he was calling as a result of past break-ins or robberies.

Wrong again. The non existent racial aspect was not relevant in either.
So I was pointing out the hypocrisy of the media in that if they were going to frame the Martin incident as racial, then they should be consistent and do the same for the Adkins incident. he fact that they didn't, and typically don't when minorities are the shooters just goes to further my point.
You're asking them to report on something that doesn't exist, as opposed to a case where it does exist and multiple sources corroborate it.

I said race should only play a factor in the event that enough prior incidents reflected that a majority of the crimes in a neighborhood were committed by a particular race(i.e. Little Havana example). The same would relate to gender in that I'd be much more suspicious of boys and men than girls and women. I guess that would make me a gender profiler in your mind, right?
If all other variables are the same. I'm not sure why you're picking a fight with a dictionary here. If you select boys as being suspicious primarily on the basis of them being a boy, you are profiling by definition.

Lastly, the racial animus I speak of is related to what the media and the race baiters created by turning it into a racial incident, which it clearly was not.
Except for the people in the that community who agree that it was, among the other available information.

I agree with that, but it is not enough. People think FOX is conservative because they are so use to left wing news sources. However if we had a channel that was as extreme right as most of the media is left, many would begin to see FOX as genuinely moderate or as they say "fair and balanced". I am of course talking about their actual news, not the talking head and commentary shows.
Their "fair and balanced news" quotes their commentary and talking head shows as sources.

If the new channel does happen, we'll finally know the answer to the question:
"Is a sufficiently right wing source indistinguishable from Colbert?"
 
based on behavior which is normal for someone without a car who has to walk. If we are to take that behavior as being suspicious, then countless white/black, young/old people are now suspicious in their daily life.

That's a pantload of crap and you know it.

Big difference between "walking" and "walking at night, in the rain, through all your neighbors backyards". One activity is normal, the other - not so much. Especially for people living in a gated community.
 
That's a pantload of crap and you know it.

Big difference between "walking" and "walking at night, in the rain, through all your neighbors backyards". One activity is normal, the other - not so much. Especially for people living in a gated community.
It seems that being out at night in the rain and taking shortcuts to go home should not be acceptable in a gated community.
 
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