Improperly seated primers

[Topgunner]

I'm in the middle of reloading 44 Magnum brass, and have noticed that there have been several primers that have not been seated deeply enough, causing the cylinder to hang up when trying to fire single or double action.

I will investigate whether or not there is "crud" in the primer pockets interfering with proper primer insertion, as well as inspecting Station Two on the XL650 to ensure that the primer system is functioning properly, and trying to find specs for Winchester Large Pistol Primers and mic-ing the primers to see if they are within spec.

Squeezing the cartridge in a vise (eyes, ears, caution, etc.) successfully seated the primers and allowed them to function normally in the revolver.

Do people who load on a progressive press deprime cases and clean each primer pocket before running the brass through the rest of the reloading process?

 

[LHB1]

Quote: "Do people who load on a progressive press deprime cases and clean each primer pocket before running the brass through the rest of the reloading process?"

No, but I do check my priming system to be sure it is clean and seating primers to full depth before each loading session on my Hornady L-N-L progressive presses. I also make sure to push the press arm hard against arm stop on upstroke (seating primer) to minimize chance of high primer.

Good shooting and be safe.
LB

 

[The Bushmaster]

Primers are supposed to be just below the case head. It is only necessary to run your finger over the case head to feel if the primer is seated properly. Most primers are suppose to be ever so slightly flattened when they are seated by the ram...This is suppose to arm them. And insure that the guns hammer or firing pin is not seating them instead sometimes requiring a second blow by the hammer/pin to set them off...

 

[Poodleshooter]

and trying to find specs for Winchester Large Pistol Primers and mic-ing the primers to see if they are within spec

I've had a lot of problems with Winchester LP primers in the last two years. They often haven't seated fully in my .45 and .44 brass. Generally I can seat them with heavy pressure and they work fine in my .44, but my .45 Glock often has to restrike primers that are not fully seated. I see it about 2-3times per 50 rounds, so it's quite annoying.
I've had no problems with other brands,or with other sizes of Winchester primers,so I don't think it's my technique or my brass prep to blame.

 

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Topgunner,

You might also check the cartridges with the high seating problem to see if they're in spec while you have the mic out. If brass isn't good on a couple, a primer hole uniformer will take care of that pretty quick. That's something I do with the S&B brass I have because of shallow primer hole depth.

Regards,

Dave

 

[loadedround]

Topgunner: I too load 44 mag in a Dillon 550B progressive press and I only use Winchester primers in all my pistol loads. I do not clean my pocket pockets o decap prior to loading. I strip down and clean my press about every 1000 rounds or so. So far I have never had a primmer problem. I suggest you call Dillon and talk with them about your problem. I thought I knew all there was to know about my 550 until I ran into a slide return problem and after an hour of playing with it, I called Dillon and they had me up and running in 5 minutes. Dillon's motto: "Don't suffer in silence".

 

[Frohickey]

I've had a lot of problems with Winchester LP primers in the last two years. They often haven't seated fully in my .45 and .44 brass. Generally I can seat them with heavy pressure and they work fine in my .44, but my .45 Glock often has to restrike primers that are not fully seated. I see it about 2-3times per 50 rounds, so it's quite annoying.

Hmm... I've had the same issue with Winchester Large Pistol Primers with my Sig P220/P245.

Cleaned primer pockets, hand-priming or press-priming of the 45ACP cases with Winchester Large Pistol Primers, checking to make sure that the primers are seated to the proper depth.

I would get a few FTFs from my reloads, and inspecting the brass of the fired ones, the primer strikes look a little light, even on the ones that fired the first time.

I, then got some reloads from a friend of mine (who I trust). He uses CCI/Federal primers, and the primer strikes look deeper on the fired cases, from my guns. My (Winchester primered) reloads have light primer strikes on his guns.

My conclusion is that somehow, Winchester substituted (thicker) large rifle primer cups in a batch of their large pistol primers, and that makes it harder to ignite them.

 

[callgood]

Thanks for the post. I just reloaded some practice rounds for a Sig 220 with the Winchester LP primers. I use a RCBS hand primer and everything "felt" right, but I'll recheck the primers before I go to the range. I usually use CCI but came on a box of these recently.

ETA: this was range brass, and I used a Sinclair pocket uniformer on it, which cleaned the pockets out pretty well. I'm not forseeing any problems.

 

[stoky]

On my 650 I get high primers when the bolt holding the shell plate is not tight enough. It seems like it wants to be tighter than the fraction of a turn (1/8?) specified in the manual. I tighten it two finger snug and back off just enough so the shell plate turns freely at the bottom of the stroke.

 

[bobaloo]

On my Hornady LNL I can feel the primer dragging when the shell plate rotates if it's a little high, so I just immediately stop and manually turn the shell plate back a few degrees and reseat the primer, it almost always goes in fine. It normally just means I didn't quite finish the stroke firmly enough.

Every once in a great while, maybe once in 3-4,000 rounds, I'll get a primer that slips in a little crooked and jams in the primer pocket at an angle, I just toss those.

The only time I prep primer pockets if for serious ammo, never for range ammo which I load by the 1000.

 

[Poodleshooter]

Hmm... I've had the same issue with Winchester Large Pistol Primers with my Sig P220/P245.

Some reloaders on Glocktalk have had similar experiences. It sucks because Winchesters tend to be the best deal around here. I've switched to Remingtons for my .45, but I have about 500 Winchester primed .45 brass still. Luckily my Super Blackhawk eats them fine. I haven't had any of the high primer issues that lock up revolvers.
Your conclusion might be a possibility. Aren't large rifle primers deeper than large pistol primers though? Or is that small rifle/small pistol? I can't remember...

 

[sako_75]

I've shoot thousands of rounds through my Sig 220st using CCI primers and never had a single problem. The last time I needed primers though, my dealer was out of CCI so I bought a brick of winchester WLP's. Out of my first 100 rounds with them, I have had 2 FTF. Both of the FTF's fired on the second try. I've got 500 cases primed with the WLP's but I'll save them for informal plinking and go back to the CCI primers for IDPA. I don't need any FTF's in a match.

 

[Topgunner]

Wow, thanks for all the informative replies

I can see that I have a lot of reading, measuring, and notetaking ahead of me before I really get the hang of all of this. There's all sorts of important details to pay attention to - I'll make note of the headstamp on the brass I'm having trouble with, tighten everything down on the press, and maybe try some different primers.

I noticed in another thread that someone said that a bench that isn't sturdy enough is a leading cause of poor primer seating. I reload at a relatively slow and steady pace, making sure that I lean into the press handle on every downstroke, and after every pause I lean down on it again just to make sure I didn't miss seating a primer.

Are the any guidelines for determining if the bench I'm using is "sturdy" enough? Is these something specific to look for - something that I can objectively measure and diagnose?

Thanks as always,

Topgunner

 

[Topgunner]

Primer back-out

I prepped a bunch of brass for loading Speer 240 gr Gold Dots (#4455 Which Speer annoyingly has no loading data for) and worked from 12.3 [starting load for other 240 gr bullets] to 13.7 [max load] HS-6. CCI large pistol magnum primers, rounds crimped into bullet cannelure.

Fired from a dirty (240 gr lead RNFP over 9.5 gr HS-6, WLP) Dan Wesson 6".

{Great trick by the way - coloring the primers to keep track of loads after firing. Thanks. The color in the groove between primer and pocket stays the best.}

I uniformed the pockets with a Lyman tool screwed onto a military cleaning rod section and chucked in a Makita drill. Some pockets were chamfered with the Lyman pocket reamer and some with the RCBS/Wilson case neck chamfering tool.

After firing, I had someone who handloads take a look at the fired cases - his first comment was that the primers seemed backed out - flush with the head - and some looked to me like they might be flattened - but mostly right in the middle at 13.3 gr, and less flattened at 13.5 and 13.7.

* Is this typical for primers to back out when the pockets have been uniformed / chamfered?

* What defines "flattening?" The primers are no longer smooth, and have what might be the grain of the revolver's recoil sheild on them.

The recoil sure didn't seem that bad, the groups (hand held) were pretty good (better than usual ), and there wasn't much noticable difference in recoil as I progressed upward in charge.

I need to get me a chronograph. I need to get me some money so I can buy me a chronograph.

Topgunner