Information found in paper reloading manuals

[GeoDudeFlorida]

You fellows that had mentors were super luckey.

Don't I know it! But, here's the thing: the uncle who taught me reloading skinned my hide more than a few times and took away my shooting privilege's more than a few times for asking questions I could and (and should have) answered for myself just by looking at the notes he made me take and the manuals he made available to me. I wasn't as much TAUGHT as I LEARNED! Popping into a forum and asking, "Hey, what's up with these powder makers not putting out instructions for common calibers, anyway!? They oughta publish loads for my home-built AR kit, just like they do for the fancy store guns! Are they chizzlers or what?" isn't seeking constructive advice.

 

[Rule3]

Unfortunately what happens in a lot of threads or posts is that the replies do not answer the OPs question.

Starts off as one thing and then people are giving what "they do"

"I am looking for a good single stage press as I only load one caliber for hunting"

Oh ,you should look at a progressive press, buy once cry once.

"Is HP 38 good for loading 38 special?"

It's OK but you should use Bullseye.

 

[Charlie98]

Unfortunately what happens in a lot of threads or posts is that the replies do not answer the OPs question.

Starts off as one thing and then people are giving what "they do"

"I am looking for a good single stage press as I only load one caliber for hunting"

Oh ,you should look at a progressive press, buy once cry once.

"Is HP 38 good for loading 38 special?"

It's OK but you should use Bullseye.

That was exactly the point I was making prior. Not that the information one might offer isn't valid... but it is tangential to the OP's likely question. The press one is a good one, too... I always cringe at the 'get a progressive!' when someone new is starting to handload. I'm a fairly handy guy, and if I would have started right out loading on a progressive... well, there are a number of unsavory things that would likely have happened. It's like recommending a big bore sport bike as someone's first motorcycle, etc, etc.

 

[reddog81]

Are there any powders that work well in .38 Special and 9mm? If so can I use it in .30-06 also?

 

[Col. Harrumph]

I believe You Tube is very dangerous. I think there is some good videos and a lot of bad ones.

Not just YouTube! I grabbed some load data from a now-defunct web site dedicated to the 9mm Largo, and am d@mn lucky I didn't grenade my Astra 400. Fortunately that pistol is built like a tank. Lesson learned!

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Are there any powders that work well in .38 Special and 9mm? If so can I use it in .30-06 also?

Easy. Yes: Unique.

 

[Thomasss]

I take all sources with a grain of salt. I was taught to find 3 sources for the same recipe before reloading or other loading procedures.

 

[Archie]

My mentor was my mother's brother. He had four boys, one about my age, and they all were taught the same way as I was: First, you learn to make a decent pot of coffee (one of my cuzins still cant' reload because he failed that step).

Have to agree, if a human being cannot make coffee, they lack some skill. Reloading ammunition is far too similar. (I wouldn't let him drive my car, either.)

And I fully agree with the tenor of this thread. Most of the concept of reloading, shooting and tying my shoes came from observation (including reading) and practical exercise. Others have helped, but only after I grasped the basics. I constantly tell new folks to read the boring part preparatory to the load data.

 

[illinoisburt]

I always recommend getting at least 2 hard copy manuals to new reloaders. Of course I check online recipes on powder manufacturers website when I see something new of unfamiliar on a shelf to see if it might be usable or not.

I take information on many forums with a huge fist full of salt. One website I enjoy perusing for ELD shooting has a popular and truly horrible reloading section. Literally ever load people discuss will be at least 10% over max. I've read recommendations to seat super long so the bullets set back into the case upon loading to allow extra case capacity. It's very irresponsible and I'm sure some people looking for advice do think these people are serious. (Yes there are website disclaimers.)

 

[Charlie98]

Easy. Yes: Unique

Dang it... you beat me to it.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Dang it... you beat me to it.

“Sorry, Charlie”

 

[GaryL]

There are good videos on YouTube for those who refuse to read. Rcbs has an entire series, and I know there are others by actual reloading companies. The time for knowledge exchange needs to be made either in book or video.

A lot has changed in 30 years. I wish I had Youtube for doing research back then. There is so much to be gained from watching good videos to see how to do things.

But I still use 3 or 4 sources of load information whenever starting out with something new, or changing bullets or a different powder, and work up the load.

 

[AJC1]

A lot has changed in 30 years. I wish I had Youtube for doing research back then. There is so much to be gained from watching good videos to see how to do things.

But I still use 3 or 4 sources of load information whenever starting out with something new, or changing bullets or a different powder, and work up the load.

That's still a smart and safe path. I'm a manual in the hand and with me on the bench. Tons of guys use phones and tablets.

 

[GaryL]

That's still a smart and safe path. I'm a manual in the hand and with me on the bench. Tons of guys use phones and tablets.

I also use manuals. The closest I come to electronic load information is if I saved something from THR, and want to give it a try. After comparing the load to all my reference materials of course.

I have gotten information on obsolete powder here, but still compare it to real load data with similar powders to see if it makes sense.

Funny story - I have a daughter who was living out of state, and found out where the local library was. So she checked it out, and told us "I walked into the library, looked around, and inhaled the smell of all those books. It was wonderful." Yes, she likes to read. Just like me.

 

[74man]

Experience is the best teacher, but if someone who has already done it will know the answer, they should answer with experience. Not all the answers are it the loading manuals. Load data states barrel length which gets confusing. Like the M1 Carbine has a load for an 18.5 " barrel but you cannot find a load for the Ruger Blackhawk in 30 carbine, just shoot the Carbine load in a 7.5 in barrel. The load Data for .223 Rem states a 20 " barrel but most .223 rifles are either 16 or 18 or have different twists, that is why some new reloaders ask certain questions because they get confused Some say to wipe the lube off when you are finished loading and I have not found a manual yet the states that and about 50% of the reloaders does it and the rest say it is a waste of time. Everyone who starts reloading is a Noobie, just like the experienced reloaders were when they started out reloading. You might say people ask dumb questions but giving a dumb answer it worse that giving no answer at all.

 

[Charlie98]

Funny story - I have a daughter who was living out of state, and found out where the local library was. So she checked it out, and told us "I walked into the library, looked around, and inhaled the smell of all those books. It was wonderful." Yes, she likes to read. Just like me.

I grew up in a library... I think I was in either the school library, or the public library 4-5 days a week through my school years. As Lynyrd Skynyrd said... '...that smell...' but in a good way.

I still prefer books and papers over looking at something on a screen or, heaven forbid, the stupid phone. It's hard to write notes in the margin of a PC monitor.

You might say people ask dumb questions but giving a dumb answer it worse that giving no answer at all.

Straight up.

 

[Rule3]

Some say to wipe the lube off when you are finished loading and I have not found a manual yet the states that and about 50% of the reloaders does it and the rest say it is a waste of time.

On the contrary, Hornady. RCBS and Lyman all mention removing the case lube and no over applying.But you would have to read that.
As I mentioned in another thread I suggested using a spray lube. Most of which are water based and not a wax. Either leave it or wipe it.

For 223 Rem from Accurate powders:
223 Remington — continued
Barrel: 24" ■ Twist: 1-12" ■ Primer: WSR ■ Bullet Diameter .224"
For shorter barrels reduce velocity below as follows(ca): 20" -3.9%/-130Fps// 16" -9.0%/-300Fp

Don't know what manuals you are looking at?

 

[buck460XVR]

I have no issue with new reloaders that acquire all their info from the internet instead of printed and bond volumes. The internet is a wealth of information and to ignore it totally would be foolish. What bothers me is those folks too lazy to do the research themselves, or even Google a powder manufacturer webpage for a legitimate recipe. Instead they find it easier to ask here "what's a good load for a 158 JHP for my 686?". They don't want to research the loads, nor even test them. They want us to do that and give them the best performing and most accurate load for THEIR gun. But then, I saw this long before powder/bullet manufacturers even offered free recipes. When folks were too cheap to spend the $20 on a manual. They could afford a computer and internet service, but not $20 for a manual. Nowadays, with the availability of free and legitimate recipes online, there's no reason for anyone to ask for a recipe for a specific powder/bullet combo. Period. That's why I will never respond to those who ask for them.

Terminal performance of bullets on game, powders that work well, IMHO, yes.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

As has been said before, using multiple sources is a must. For some very specific, specialty rounds it may be necessary to seek out specialty manuals.

 

[Charlie98]

They don't want to research the loads, nor even test them. They want us to do that and give them the best performing and most accurate load for THEIR gun.

Again, I think you are generally wrong. It's not that they want you to do all the work for them, I think they are usually (there are exceptions, of course...) looking for a nudge in the right direction. Even printed data can be confusing... and looking at the Speer #14 data for your example... that is a 158grn JHP... there are 15 different powders in their data. If you are a noob, how are you supposed to pick one of those using more than a WAG? Considering the lack of components on shelves these days, someone asking what a good powder might be for their 4" 686 isn't a dumb question. Standing at the shelf and looking at one can of H110, and one can of Unique... even though those are both listed in the printed and bound manual, they are 2 very different powders.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Experience is the best teacher, but if someone who has already done it will know the answer, they should answer with experience. Not all the answers are it the loading manuals. Load data states barrel length which gets confusing. Like the M1 Carbine has a load for an 18.5 " barrel but you cannot find a load for the Ruger Blackhawk in 30 carbine, just shoot the Carbine load in a 7.5 in barrel. The load Data for .223 Rem states a 20 " barrel but most .223 rifles are either 16 or 18 or have different twists, that is why some new reloaders ask certain questions because they get confused Some say to wipe the lube off when you are finished loading and I have not found a manual yet the states that and about 50% of the reloaders does it and the rest say it is a waste of time. Everyone who starts reloading is a Noobie, just like the experienced reloaders were when they started out reloading. You might say people ask dumb questions but giving a dumb answer it worse that giving no answer at all.

Did you buy a Ruger in .30Carbine planning to use boxed ammo? Which manuals do you have already? The Lymans pistol & revolver handbook lists loads specific to the Ruger. It would be a good idea to buy a copy.

 

[buck460XVR]

Again, I think you are generally wrong. It's not that they want you to do all the work for them, I think they are usually (there are exceptions, of course...) looking for a nudge in the right direction. Even printed data can be confusing... and looking at the Speer #14 data for your example... that is a 158grn JHP... there are 15 different powders in their data. If you are a noob, how are you supposed to pick one of those using more than a WAG? Considering the lack of components on shelves these days, someone asking what a good powder might be for their 4" 686 isn't a dumb question. Standing at the shelf and looking at one can of H110, and one can of Unique... even though those are both listed in the printed and bound manual, they are 2 very different powders.

I don't think you read my post.

. Nowadays, with the availability of free and legitimate recipes online, there's no reason for anyone to ask for a recipe for a specific powder/bullet combo. Period. That's why I will never respond to those who ask for them.

Terminal performance of bullets on game, powders that work well, IMHO, yes.

 

[Charlie98]

I don't think you read my post.

I did read your post... did you read mine?

It's not that they want you to do all the work for them, I think they are usually (there are exceptions, of course...) looking for a nudge in the right direction. Even printed data can be confusing... and looking at the Speer #14 data for your example... that is a 158grn JHP... there are 15 different powders in their data. If you are a noob, how are you supposed to pick one of those using more than a WAG?

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

I did read your post... did you read mine?

I have to say I get annoyed at being told repeatedly “this data doesn’t exist,” “no one has data for that gun,” “nobody publishes loads for…” only to find exactly what the person is complaining about in seconds using a quick search of the reloading forum. I don’t mind helping people who make an effort but rude whiners can go pound sand.

 

[Charlie98]

I have to say I get annoyed at being told repeatedly “this data doesn’t exist,” “no one has data for that gun,” “nobody publishes loads for…” only to find exactly what the person is complaining about in seconds using a quick search of the reloading forum. I don’t mind helping people who make an effort but rude whiners can go pound sand.

Again... there is a difference between "I bought a 686 and want to reload for it... what do I do?" and "I'm looking at load data for 158grn JHP's and I'm wondering what a good powder would be for a target load in my 4" 686? ...there are 15 different powders listed, but I don't have experience with any of them."