Interesting

[Langenator]

Back in March, I bought a USGI M1911A1 with my tax refund. Slide said Remington Rand, but I didn't think to look up the serial number on the frame.

Well, American Rifleman ran an article this month on the GI M1911A1, complete with serial number ranges by date an manufacturer.

Come to find out, my pistol (SN 1888xxx) is a Remington Rand slide sitting on an Ithaca frame. At some point in history, two pistols, probably both unservicable, went into depot maintenance, and only one came back out. A true GI mixmaster.

Since, in my Army career, I've seen many examples of Colt M16s with FN bolt-carrier groups and vice versa, I should be too surprised, especially with a weapon that was in service for 40 years (originally made in 1944).

 

[Bobo]

When I was in the U.S. Army in the late 1960s the company armorers threw any parts together that would make a working pistol. Brand names didn't mean a thing. Most of the pistols out of the company armories would shoot reliably, but accuracy was iffy at best.

 

[10-Ring]

Still a very cool acquisition!

 

[Langenator]

It definitely stayed in service longer than my earlier one (a '44 Ithaca), which as far as I know came home with the soldier who carried in WWII.

So I've got both-one long service gun, and an original.

Now, can anyone spare me a few thousand so I can buy a Union Switch & Signal?

 

[270Win]

That IS interesting!

 

[Dr. Dickie]

If your pistol was mis-matched during an armory re-build, it should have the stamp of the armory that did the re-build.
If you want to learn all about it, go here:
http://forum.m1911.org/
The folks in the US Government Issued pistols forum are VERY knowledgable about the old 1911s, and are very, very helpful with all sorts of information (besides being full blown collector geeks ).

 

[Langenator]

Couldn't find any arsenal marks...just the govt proof and FJA inspector mark.

Theories:

1-gun was reassembled from two others sometime after it left govt service

2-gun was put together from two broken ones by a unit armorer at some point. IE-armorer has two pistols that are beyond repair. One has a screwed up frame, one a screwed up slide. Since only the frame is serial numbered, he puts the good slide assembly on the good frame assembly, then turns in the bad slide on the bad frame as unservicable. Helps keep his maintenance stats looking better, and the kind of thing I woul have told my armorer to do when I was a company XO.

Either way, I've got myself a 60 year old M1911A1. So I can't complain.

 

[Old Fuff]

Arsenal Rebuilds.

Arsenal rebuilds are an interesting sub-class of 1911 pistols in themselves. When a pistol was rebuilt all of the parts, regardless of maker, were considered equal. However during World War Two Remington-Rand (not related to the Remington Firearms Co.) developed what became known as a "hard slide." Previous slides were softer, and were spot hardened in certain places. The R-R slides were hardened throughout so spot hardening was unnecessary.

After the war pistols being rebuilt were usually fitted with a hard slide, either one made by Remington-Rand or other subcontractors that made replacement slides - one of which was Colt. A lot of referbishing went on before, during and after the Korean War. By the time we got to Viet Nam very few of the pistols still in inventory still had their original slides.

Frames were never marked with the maker's name, and slide markings are worthless in identifying the original maker. You have to go by the serial number (which were assigned to various contractors in blocks) and the principal government inspector's stamp.

Always check this before buying a gun! Many buyers have been stung after paying out big bucks for an original (fill in the blank) 1911A1 because of the slide markings, and then discovered that they really have a rebuild. This isn't necessarily bad, as they are interesting - but they are seldom or ever worth what the original gun would be.