Is It Me?

[KAC1911]

It seems like all these states and local legistalors are running around with their heads cut off. Throwing darts in the air hoping to find a answer to solve this problem and keep reinventing the wheel at the expense of the law abbiding gun owner with more rules and regulations that we all know won't do anything or very little to stop the problem. And most don't have a clue about guns but are willing to pass something to look good.

How about using the laws on the books and start prosecuting the law breakers! Doesn't seem like any of them are going after hollywood violent movies with legislation, no legislation on violent games either. Mental health is the only other real finger pointing, and god forbid you serve your country in combat and come back with some ptsd your screwed.

I guess my point is I'm tired of defending (writing to rep, etc) myself when no other responsibility is being shared about this problem. I won't stop writing because they cannot beat us this way, but it's getting old. And sadly look who's profitting from this.

 

[Yo Mama]

hoping to find a answer to solve this problem

It was never about finding a way to solve the problem It was anti gun activists who were waiting to prey on dead children to take American's rights away.

I'm kinda glad the cards are all on the table now. If this doesn't truly wake America up nothing will.

I guess my point is I'm tired of defending (writing to rep, etc) myself when no other responsibility is being shared about this problem

I hear you brother, but keep your head up. The majority of the US is fighting this garbage. You also sound like you'd be someone who would get involved at a higher level, like getting elected to a position that enables you to have more control at a macro level. Maybe think about it.

 

[MedWheeler]

Anyone who still thinks gun-control efforts are about public safety, crime control, or "the sake of the children" just isn't getting it.

When the other side throws those so-called causes at us, they are simply keeping us distracted by an argument that is not real.

 

[The-Reaver]

Lol, you don't really by into this " video games, violent movies did it " nonsense do you?

I grew up on everything from duck hunter to terminator 2 and I'm a responsible gun owner. I still go out of the way for a food action film and war/criminal video games.

Those aren't the issue. Crappy parents are the issue.

 

[Yo Mama]

Lol, you don't really by into this " video games, violent movies did it " nonsense do you?

I grew up on everything from duck hunter to terminator 2 and I'm a responsible gun owner. I still go out of the way for a food action film and war/criminal video games.

Those aren't the issue. Crappy parents are the issue.

It's not nonsense. It needs to be addressed. T2 is nothing vs. what we have now that is force fed on every channel 24/7. It's not monkey see monkey do, it's desensitization on a massive scale. Add in social media, and everyone wanting to one up eachother and you have a mess.

I agree that parents are responsible, and should vote with their televisions and movie selections. PG13 movies today are not like they were years ago.

 

[Justin]

It seems like all these states and local legistalors are running around with their heads cut off. Throwing darts in the air hoping to find a answer to solve this problem and keep reinventing the wheel at the expense of the law abbiding gun owner with more rules and regulations that we all know won't do anything or very little to stop the problem.

This has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with actually trying to solve a problem at all, and everything to do with trying to curry favor with party bosses and high-profile officials in the hopes of gaining an advantageous position for future career advancement.

These politicians have been educated again and again and again, yet no matter how many times they've been told that the sky is indeed blue, they will continue to insist that it's red.

 

[Texan Scott]

"Gun control" is not about crime. Notice they do not call it "crime control".

"Gun control" is not about crimes committed with guns. If it were, rifles would be the last of their concerns, as rifles are used in very few crimes.

"Gun control" is about controlling citizens. A law does not have to make sense or even accomplish its stated intent, as long as it accomplishes its unstated intent: controlling citizens whose views conflict with the views of those seeking greater control.

Gun control takes power from citizens and gives it to whoever controls the government. The Second Amendment was intended to decentralize enough power to keep governments in check.

Citizens must control their own guns and their own government to prevent their government from controlling them with guns.

Insist on it. Insist on it NOW. Insist on it LOUDLY. Insist on it CONTINUALLY. Insist on it ALWAYS.

 

[HighExpert]

Amen Scott. I would like to see a candidate for national office campaign on the premise of ELIMINATING LAWS instead of writing new ones. Let them spend their time reducing the number of laws by at LEAST 75% on the federal level. I would keep this guy in office if I had to vote 3 or 4 times every election...You mean you can't vote more than once? Darn.

 

[hovercat]

+1 Texan Scott. Read the thread on CT.
'at least after I register my rifle I can now put all the tacticool stuff on it...'
at least in IL we just have to have a FOID card
And even here in TX, we talk of how good it is that 'they' may lower the hoops we have to jump through to carry a pistol in my pocket.

There really is no solution or law available. Freedom is messy, scary, dangerous. Limit the freedom of the press, and you no longer have a free press. Start limiting the right to a jury trial, and soon you will have no juries. Do it for the children .

 

[KAC1911]

I hear you brother, but keep your head up. The majority of the US is fighting this garbage. You also sound like you'd be someone who would get involved at a higher level, like getting elected to a position that enables you to have more control at a macro level. Maybe think about it.

They don't want guys like me who speak from the heart.

Texan Scott, couldn't agree more, Amen brother.

Good to see we have some like minds here, just had to get this off my chest. I am a VN vet and a patriot and it kills me to see some of the crap that is going on in this country day after day.

 

[beatledog7]

What anti-gunners say they want to do and insist can be done through punishing 2A supporters can actually be accomplished only through better law enforcement (and I'm not talking about only "gun" laws), stricter sentencing of violent criminals, and honest, open discussion about a return to institutionalization of the demonstrably violent or untrustworthy mentally ill.

Politicians are afraid to address stricter sentencing of proven violent criminals. Politicians are afraid to address real solutions for keeping guns away from mentally imbalanced people who don't know right from wrong. They're afraid to admit that the problem of "gun violence" is not solvable by controlling the law-abiding public's access to guns--it's solvable by controlling the access of violent criminals and dangerous mental patients to guns, and the only way to do that--since guns belong in public--is to control their access to the public.

But it's not only politicians. American society is becoming more and more chicken-poo when it comes to exploring these very real solutions to the problem of people being killed with firearms. We shy away from assigning personal accountability any time we can, and we blame the implement rather than the instigator. As long as we do that, we'll lose more and more gun rights while the problem escalates. And the antis will find a "convincing" argument that the gun control steps we took are working, but we just need to do more. You can bet they're already working on that.

Accountability is the key. If a murderer is released from prison and kills again, we must hold accountable for that murder those who let him out. If mental health pros know a person is untrustworthy, but they don't institutionalize her, and she kills, we hold those mental health pros accountable. Once the heaping of accountability onto those who abet the killing becomes the new norm, the people who make the decisions that allow these killers access to the public will start making better decisions.

 

[BigBore44]

I think if people knew the laws already on the books they might realize how absurd more laws are. They would/may see that the new laws won't work because the old laws aren't enforced.

But politickin ain't bout bein truthful. It's bout makin fokes think theys care bout makin yuns safe.

That's one thing I love about THR. We aren't uneducated. We are (for the most part) articulate. We may disagree with each other sometimes. But our goals are the same. Don't give up. Never give up. We can win this. We can take back our country.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

It seems like all these states and local legistalors are running around with their heads cut off. Throwing darts in the air hoping to find a answer to solve this problem

they have no intention whatsoever of solving the problem. Their intention is to blow the problem all out of proportion and use that as a springboard to seize more power.

 

[buck460XVR]

It's just Human nature to fear things you do not understand. It's also Human nature to grasp at straws to desperately find a solution to a threat against us. History shows us that firearms themselves are a result of this. The antics when AIDS and Mad Cow disease first appeared are another example. So is the ammo and reloading component shortage we have at the present.

they have no intention whatsoever of solving the problem. Their intention is to blow the problem all out of proportion and use that as a springboard to seize more power.

This continued promoting of the unfounded theory that those in Washington are just plotting another Nazi conspiracy to herd all of America into boxcars as soon as they confiscate all our guns has done more to alienate legitimate gun owners from the general public than it has helped us. Those loudest voices against gun ownership are from those that have no political agendas........regular everyday Americans. Misguided as their intentions are, they believe in their hearts that the solutions they push will defer the threat. Those politicians pushing for legislation are indeed looking to continue and further their political career, but they are doing that by following their constituents wishes. Instead of continuing to try and ram all these false conspiracy theories down the throats of intelligent Americans that know better, we need to educate and enlighten them as to why their fears are unfounded and that the solution is not by new laws restricting legitimate gun ownership, but tougher penalties against those that break the laws already on the books.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

This continued promoting of the unfounded theory that those in Washington are just plotting another Nazi conspiracy to herd all of America into boxcars as soon as they confiscate all our guns has done more to alienate legitimate gun owners from the general public than it has helped us. Those loudest voices against gun ownership are from those that have no political agendas........regular everyday Americans.

And it's your theory that those people have no leaders? And that their leaders have no agenda?

Barak Obama, Diane Feinstein, Joe Biden et al are mere figments of the imagination?

 

[buck460XVR]

This continued promoting of the unfounded theory that those in Washington are just plotting another Nazi conspiracy to herd all of America into boxcars as soon as they confiscate all our guns has done more to alienate legitimate gun owners from the general public than it has helped us. Those loudest voices against gun ownership are from those that have no political agendas........regular everyday Americans.

And it's your theory that those people have no leaders? And that their leaders have no agenda?

Barak Obama, Diane Feinstein, Joe Biden et al are mere figments of the imagination?

.....little farther down, one sentence later, I answer this Vern.

Those politicians pushing for legislation are indeed looking to continue and further their political career, but they are doing that by following their constituents wishes.

In order to change the agendas of those in power, one needs to change the desire of their constituents. While many suggest that the simple removal of those in power is the solution, the truth is, that they will just be replaced by others that will continue the agenda of the majority of their constituents. Only by changing the minds of the constituents are we going to change the agenda of the politicians they vote into power. Just the way our system works.

 

[Old Fuff]

As Neal Knox noted decades ago, this is a battle between urban leftists and the rest of the country. Look carefully at where the support for more extreme gun control laws is coming from.

Urban leftists have little or no background in legal use of firearms, and tend to believe in their own authoritative control of the population by "their" government. In rural parts of the country (which are called "fly-over-country," by the leftists) residents have a long history of using firearms for many legitimate purposes, and in an overall perspective are less dependent on government.

Unlike most rural dwellers, who have for the most part a live-and-let-live attitude toward firearms, urban legislators are determine to force their kind of restrictive firearms laws on the rest of the country, and tend to blame their problems on the "easy availability of guns" elsewhere. They view with special alarm the idea that "ordinary people" are allowed to possess military style small arms, when in truth this has been the case since before the American Revolution, and they deny the obvious - that the 2nd. Amendment was intended to protect exactly this, with constant reference to hunting.

I believe that the current drive for additional laws will continue, especially in those states where the legislature and governor's chair are entirely controlled by urban Democrats until the 2014 mid-term elections come about. Hopefully then they will suffer the same losses they experienced in 1994 - but obviously didn't learn anything from. How successful our side is will depend on a determined and unrelenting effort to get rural voters to the polls.

 

[Vern Humphrey]

In order to change the agendas of those in power, one needs to change the desire of their constituents. While many suggest that the simple removal of those in power is the solution, the truth is, that they will just be replaced by others that will continue the agenda of the majority of their constituents. Only by changing the minds of the constituents are we going to change the agenda of the politicians they vote into power. Just the way our system works.

Riiight. A system that takes from those who earn, and uses their money to buy votes for men and policies who are bent on tearing down the wage earners is simply a matter of "persuasion."

 

[buck460XVR]

Unlike most rural dwellers, who have for the most part a live-and-let-live attitude toward firearms, urban legislators are determine to force their kind of restrictive firearms laws on the rest of the country, and tend to blame their problems on the "easy availability of guns" elsewhere. They view with special alarm the idea that "ordinary people" are allowed to possess military style small arms, when in truth this has been the case since before the American Revolution, and they deny the obvious - that the 2nd. Amendment was intended to protect exactly this, with constant reference to hunting.

I believe that the current drive for additional laws will continue, especially in those states where the legislature and governor's chair are entirely controlled by urban Democrats until the 2014 mid-term elections come about. Hopefully then they will suffer the same losses they experienced in 1994 - but obviously didn't learn anything from. How successful our side is will depend on a determined and unrelenting effort to get rural voters to the polls.

Unfortunately, the majority of folks don't live in rural areas anymore. Simply getting the rural folks out to vote isn't gonna do it. In Texas for example, 85% of the population lives in urban areas. This in a state most of us consider "the wide open spaces". The shift in demographics from rural to urban in the U.S. is one reason there has been such a shift in gun philosophies. Thus it's obvious that we need more than just the rural vote if we desire the majority we need to elect those that will support our views. Politicians are also known to change their views if and when their constituents do. This can and does influence how they vote on new legislation before they get voted out. We need to focus on getting all of those that agree with us out to vote. We also need to use positive and legitimate examples when trying to get our point across to those that may be on the fence. These are the folks that will make the difference. The hard core antis are still a minority.....

 

[Neo-Luddite]

This is the path to some reward ~ for most of politicos. Cravens and self-seekers of this stripe are mostly indifferent to what path they are taking for the power and rewards they desire. If we make them suffer for dashing us against the rocks on their journey to self-agrandizement and ego inflation, they'll think twice about tangling the pro-2nd crowd again. I'd say reason with them, but hey, why bother...

 

[larryh1108]

The hardest part is that the main stream media is anti-gun. They use shootings to advertise their news at 5 and 10. When a shooting occurs, there is the picture of a handgun or AR type gun in the background. The tell about they shootings but you hardly ever see howowning a gun saved a life or prevented an act of violence. Nope, no news there. Isn't sensational enough. The media is biased and I have seen how it is nothing more than propoganda. It is so filled with lies and half truths that it is almost comical.

Then we have the politicians who want to take our guns away so they feel safe... safe to further their agenda of taking all our guns away. The Pres is on tv every day, telling Americans that we must to something for the children. Their lives can't be forgotten with nothing being done. He is using that tragedy to further an agenda he's had for years.

CT signs new laws and brags how we now have the toughest gun laws in America. Funny, before this we had some of the toughest laws in America and Sandy Hook still happened here. Maybe tough laws does not mean we won't have crazies shooting people?

The legislators vote how their constituents feel? Funny, in CT, the pro gun crowds out numbered the anti gun crowds when they did have open discussions. On the day of the vote, Cabelas bused in pro-gun supporters to the capitol. Pro-gun people were everywhere yet they voted for it anyway without a care of what we wanted. They acted like we weren't even there. They just don't care what the voters want.

So, we fight every news outlet, the government and the bleeding hearts yet no one hears how it is illegal what they are doing. They want us to fight it in court. They don't care what the voters want. It's time for them to find other jobs. We have to vote them out to show them that it does matter what we want, not what they want.

 

[Yelovitz_503]

*Ahem*

The media is biased and I have seen how it is nothing more than propoganda. It is so filled with lies and half truths that it is almost comical.

Well, it WOULD be funny if so many people didn't accept it as the gospel. They aren't in the business of informing you, they are in the business of selling ad space on their channel and supporting your initial bias. It's sad that true, objective journalism is such a thing of the past.

I too grow very weary of being accused (either directly, or subtly through tone) of being a heartless monster who falls in ranks with these lone gunman psychos. It's maddening, but we have no choice but to continue defending it with well reasoned arguments and these rare things which the media often overlooks... I think they're called "facts"?

Yes gun control isn't about crime, it's about control. People who are too naive, and think that the government wouldn't ever do anything to harm it's citizens, are more than willing to hand over rights that they themselves do not exercise because they have a fundamental misunderstanding, or refusal to understand, the whole scope of the issue.

I would argue that the parents, doctors, and communities which ignored the warning signs which preceded these events bare equal or more responsibility than the weapon used in the incident. Some folks can't understand the fact that there will always be crazies out there who want nothing more than to hurt other people, and they'll find a way to do it with something else if the guns are gone. Or they'll still use a gun in spite of a total ban, and those folks will be scratching their heads saying "but we made guns illegal, how could this have happened?". Probably because these shooters are people who already aren't going to follow the law, after all mass murder is also illegal. It's pretty obvious that the anti-gun efforts at the moment aren't in any way about stopping crime or preventing shooting sprees like these, it's people who were waiting with bated breath for an incident to come along so they can advance the agenda they've always had. I think it is DISGUSTING that one of the parents from the Sandy Hook victims was showing pictures of their own daughter in a coffin to try to prey on people's emotions for the advancement of their goals. That person is exploiting their own child's death and I can think of few things more heartless and despicable. This was always their goal, and it seems like they're actually happy that these people are being killed in terrible massacres because it gives them extra cause to say "look I was right all along!"

It's difficult to not lose patience with people who so routinely skew their facts, misrepresent the truth, or carefully omit facts which debunk their arguments... or I don't know use statistics that are 20 years old to prove a point which has no real weight on it's own.

:banghead::banghead::banghead:

 

[Onward Allusion]

Doesn't seem like any of them are going after hollywood violent movies with legislation, no legislation on violent games either.

Don't worry, they will, but only after they got nothing else to blame for junior being a thug.

 

[Yelovitz_503]

Don't worry, they will, but only after they got nothing else to blame for junior being a thug.

Wait, we forgot gangster rap! Better just simplify all that and scrap the whole first amendment, nobody was using it anyway..

 

[KAC1911]

From larryh1108:

The hardest part is that the main stream media is anti-gun. They use shootings to advertise their news at 5 and 10. When a shooting occurs, there is the picture of a handgun or AR type gun in the background. The tell about they shootings but you hardly ever see howowning a gun saved a life or prevented an act of violence. Nope, no news there. Isn't sensational enough. The media is biased and I have seen how it is nothing more than propoganda. It is so filled with lies and half truths that it is almost comical.

Unfortunatly so many take the abc channels as gospel because they've been watching them so long it must be true. I was raised to watch these channels from my parents too, but back then they actually reported the news. Not sure when things started to change but now you have to look for the truth over a lot of information because of misleading reporting only part of the story line. To many liberal teachers screwing up a lot of young minds. My teacher friends go nuts when I blame them for stuff!