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Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Josey, Mar 23, 2004.

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  1. Josey

    Josey member

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    Rumour alert! If I understand my sources correctly, Beretta USA is shutting down pending a new plant being built in a GUN FRIENDLY state. Maryland will not allow any firearms to be manufactured IN Maryland without a built-in locking device. Virginia is in the running for relocation. Beretta has alledgedly CEASED production due to Maryland state law. Can anyone confirm? How many Americans are out of work?
     
  2. 4v50 Gary

    4v50 Gary Moderator Staff Member

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    Maryland's loss, Virginia's gain. Go Old Dominion State!
     
  3. R.H. Lee

    R.H. Lee Member

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    I wonder if that would qualify as an illegal "restraint of trade"?

    Maybe the FTC should have a looksee...........
     
  4. longtom4570

    longtom4570 Member

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    They could come to Arizona:D and i'm not even a fan of Berettas:evil:
    (now if they made a 1911 style:neener: )
     
  5. PATH

    PATH Member

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    This is news to me. Virginia is a fine place to set up shop.
     
  6. cheygriz

    cheygriz Member

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    They would be very welcome in any state in the Rocky Mountains.
     
  7. ceetee

    ceetee Member

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    If anybody from Beretta USA is watching, South Florida has lots and lots of nice tax incentives to offer...
     
  8. 3screw357

    3screw357 Member

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    How 'bout the low-country of South Carolina. The state is always trying to bring in industry. Also a steel plant in georgetown is up for sale, In case beretta dosent want to farm out their castings.
     
  9. Evil_Ed

    Evil_Ed Member

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    ceetee,

    I think you mis-typed when you said this:
    I think you meant to say:

    If anybody from Beretta USA is watching, CENTRAL Florida has lots and lots of nice tax incentives to offer, sepcifically the Brevard County area!! (I would be happy to come work as their network/security admin)
    :evil:
     
  10. Red_SC

    Red_SC Member

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    There's no lack of steel in South Carolina. I'm sure Nucor Steel would be glad to help. I'd be glad to hook them up if there was a gun in it for me....
     
  11. Mikul

    Mikul Member

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    This would be astounding news. I'd have to find a Beretta SOMETHING that I want if they actually do this... just on principle. The new CX4 Storm is appealing.

    Beretta, I hope this is true.
     
  12. Eskimo Jim

    Eskimo Jim Member

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    Josey,
    interesting news

    Riley,
    Very good point.

    -Jim
     
  13. Henry Bowman

    Henry Bowman Senior Member

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    Josey, How reliable are your sources?
     
  14. Razor

    Razor Member

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    You accidently typed CENTRAL when I'm sure you meant Northeast Florida...:neener:
     
  15. Brad Johnson

    Brad Johnson Member

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    TEXAS!

    My little home town of Crowell, TX, is slowly wasting away (the economy there is almost solely ag-based). Crowell could use the industry, and Beretta would find it a great place to live a work. Plus, it's centrally located and only 2-3 hours away from Dallas, Ft Worth, Abiliene, Amarillo, Wichita Falls, Lubbock, and Oklahoma City.

    Plus, the local property taxes are low and there is no state income tax (sales tax only). The land is wide open - it's not called "Big Ranch Country" for nothing! Existing housing is CHEAP, and construction costs are modest. The cost of living is so low it's almost sinful.

    If anyone from Beretta - or any industry for that matter -would like more information they are welcome to give me a call at (806) 781-8838 or (806) 745-1938

    Brad

    edited 03/25 to change "Big Sky" to "Big Ranch". I guess that's what you get when you post in a hurry because you really, really need to pee.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2004
  16. Harry Tuttle

    Harry Tuttle Member

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    Miller aiming to help Beretta navigate law
    http://www.gazette.net/200405/montgomerycty/state/198816-1.html

    by Thomas Dennison
    Staff Writer
    Jan. 28, 2004

    For complete coverage of the 2004 legislative section, go to www.gazette.net/annapolis2004/.

    ANNAPOLIS -- Senate President Thomas V. Mike Miller Jr. has promised to sponsor legislation that would help local handgun manufacturer Beretta USA comply with the trigger lock provision in a landmark gun safety bill passed in 2000.

    Miller (D-Dist. 27) of Chesapeake Beach said Accokeek-based Beretta has not been able to sell its handguns in the state because of a controversial trigger lock provision contained in the gun law championed by Gov. Parris N. Glendening (D). Miller made no bones that he wants to help Beretta -- which is in his southern Prince George's County district -- comply with the law and sell its handguns to Marylanders.

    "Beretta is a very valued employer and very valued industry in Maryland," Miller said. "Because of the law's unintended consequences, Beretta can't sell guns in Maryland that are manufactured right here in Maryland. ... I'm looking for a way to ensure that the guns will comply with the locking requirement and allow Beretta to compete with its overseas gun competition."

    Miller emphasized that his bill will not weaken the provisions of the bill, dubbed the Responsible Gun Safety Act of 2000. It is intended only to clarify the definition of the locking device that has to be built into new handguns.

    Glendening's gun bill, which required "integrated mechanical safety devices" and other provisions aimed at improving safety, even prompted President Clinton to come to Annapolis and praise Maryland's governor and General Assembly.

    The National Rifle Association and gun rights organizations, which fought the trigger-lock bill vigorously, have been saying for the past year that the law has imposed a de facto handgun ban in Maryland. Many manufacturers -- Beretta and Browning in particular -- have said the law prevents them from selling handguns in the state.

    "We're delighted that somebody is trying to look at the present situation and solve the problem of availability of good, quality handguns for law-abiding citizens," said Jim Purtilo, publisher of pro-gun newsletter Tripwire. "Right now, manufacturers like Beretta can't comply with current law."

    Purtilo and other gun enthusiasts are cautious in their support for Miller's bill because they wonder if it will be loaded with anti-gun legislation, such as an assault weapons ban. A strong effort is under way to ban assault weapons, and Purtilo said he is worried that the trigger lock problem could be corrected in exchange for an assault weapons ban.

    "I'm real concerned that there may be some bartering going on, and legislators may feel like they can trade a vote for the Beretta bill in return for a vote on an assault weapons ban," he said. "Our concern is there may be a connection between the bills."

    The assault weapons bill would ban not only the semiautomatic Uzis, AK-47s and other guns included in the federal assault weapons ban set to expire this year, but also copycats and other assault weapons, such as the Bushmaster rifle used in the 2002 sniper rampage. The bill seemed to gather steam earlier this month when Miller blasted Gov. Robert L. Ehrlich Jr. (R) for opposing previous bans while he was a member of Congress.

    Senate Judicial Proceedings Chairman Brian E. Frosh (D-Dist. 16) of Bethesda said he had not been briefed on Miller's bill and would not comment.

    Leah Barrett, executive director for CeaseFire Maryland, said she was unaware of Miller's bill, but at first blush, her organization is likely to be opposed.

    "I don't think it sounds promising at all," Barrett said.

    Paul E. Schurick, Ehrlich's communications director, said the governor applauds Miller for taking on the trigger-lock issue and would be very supportive of the measure. But he stressed that there will be no deal if there is horse-trading with an assault weapons ban.

    "It would go against everything in the governor's soul to sign an assault weapons ban and make a deal like that," Schurick said.

    >>>>>>>>>>>

    Proposal Tackles Law on Gun Locks: Miller's Plan Would Drop State's Requirement for Internal Mechanisms

    by Kimberly A.C. Wilson; Sun Staff
    The Baltimore Sun
    Category: News Center

    March 1, 2004


    State Senate President Thomas V. Mike Miller wants to loosen Maryland's pioneering gun-lock requirement, a measure enacted four years ago over the objections of Italian gun-maker Beretta, which has a U.S. headquarters in Miller's district.

    A bill introduced by Miller would allow gun manufacturers to sell weapons in the state without the internal locking mechanisms required bythe Responsible Gun Safety Act of 2000, a change hailed by gun dealers and bemoaned by the state's gun control advocates.

    "We were against it from the beginning, because careless gun ownerswill be careless with or without a lock," said Sanford M. Abrams, proprietor of Valley Gun in Parkville.

    One the other side, Leah Barrett, executive director of CeaseFire Maryland, worries that passage of the bill "would gut a huge part of thegun safety act."

    The gun law, signed by Gov. Parris N. Glendening with President Bill Clinton in attendance, was the first in the nation to require manufacturers to equip their handguns with built-in locks. Another groundbreaking provision of the law required firearms makers to provide "ballistic fingerprint" information about each handgun to the state police to helpthem solve crimes.

    Senate Bill 547 is set to be considered Wednesday, but its fate could intertwine with another Senate gun bill, which is aimed at enacting a state ban to go into effect when the federal assault weapons ban expires in September.

    "My bill has been overshadowed by the assault weapons bill," said Miller, a Democrat who represents Calvert and Prince George's counties. "Liberals don't really care for it. The pro-gun people like it, but not enough to see it wedded to an assault weapons ban."

    Del. Neil F. Quinter, a Howard County Democrat who introduced the House version of the assault weapons ban, said conventional wisdom suggested that Miller's bill and the ban might cross paths.

    "The fear has been for a while that the Beretta bill would be the cost of advancing the assault weapons legislation. Now it may be the vehicle for advancing the assault weapons legislation," said Quinter, adding that he supports "a compromise to allow Beretta time to comply [with the safety act of 2000] in order to get a state assault ban in place."

    Current law requires internal locks in all new handguns sold in Maryland. Guns with the locks - typically made of a set screw installed flush in the gun that is opened and closed with a tool - can be found on Abrams' shelves, stamped with the names of manufacturers such as Smith & Wesson of Massachusetts, Taurus International of Florida, and Springfield Armory of Illinois.

    But Valley Gun hasn't sold a Beretta in nearly a year, because the Accokeek-based manufacturer hasn't produced models with the requiredlocking mechanisms.

    "We ran out of the ones that were available before the law went into effect on Jan. 1, 2003," said Abrams. "Officers, security guards,merchants, just average people, we just have to turn them away. 'Sorry, I don't have any compliant Berettas to sell to you.'"

    Maryland State Police and Montgomery County officers made up a large segment of Beretta's in-state market. Those officers are required to carry Beretta 9000s when working off-duty, but can no longer buy them because the company is not compliant, Abrams said.

    "It injures other gun manufacturers that aren't compliant, but there's only one Maryland manufacturer of firearms and that's Beretta. They're losing sales and losing money - and I don't think they had that in mindwhen they enacted the law," Abrams said. "It's an unintended consequence."

    CeaseFire Maryland's executive director was unmoved.

    "I think Miller's trying to do a constituent a favor, but it's going to harm Maryland for many, many years," said Barrett. "It's just not worth it."
     
  17. Henry Bowman

    Henry Bowman Senior Member

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    I assume that the problem is that the law prevents them from manufacturing any handguns w/o internal locks in MD and then selling them outside of MD. But Beretta has been advertising its internal locking mechanism (B-LOK system) for at least 6-9 months. Does this mean that they have not produced any handguns with it? Nor any w/o it? What gives? I see these news reports, but they don't make sense to me.
     
  18. Harry Tuttle

    Harry Tuttle Member

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    it does not effect sales out of state
    Beretta uses a Maryland labor force to make guns that Maryland citizens can not buy

    We also have a Ballistic finger print shell casing requirement that many manufactures do not provide

    right now in Md gun shops have Pre jan 2002 handguns
    and only a couple of post 2002 handgun designs

    these are the approved devices:
    http://www.mdsp.maryland.gov/mdsp/downloads/Handgun_Safety_devices.pdf
    Approved Integrated Mechanical Safety Devices
    Bersa Lock (Firestorm)
    Bond Arms Derringer Lock (not the "Allen Key" version)
    Charter 2000
    Cimarron-Aldo Uberti System for SAA
    Ghost,Inc. (for Glocks only)
    Glock's Lock
    Heckler & Koch System
    Saf-T-Trigger by Saf-T-Hammer
    Smith & Wesson Lock
    Springfield Armory, Integral Locking System
    Strahan Firing Pin Lock
    Swiss Safety by Aldo Uberti
    Taurus Systems, separate systems for revolvers and semi-automatics
    Walther 22
    Sig Arms (only on model 229 at this time)



    Responsible Gun Safety Act of 2000
    HOUSE BILL 279
    1 (C) BEGINNING ON JANUARY 1, 2002, A DEALER MAY NOT SELL, OFFER FOR
    2 SALE, RENT, OR TRANSFER IN THE STATE ANY HANDGUN MANUFACTURED AFTER
    3 DECEMBER 31, 2001 UNLESS THE HANDGUN HAS AN INTEGRATED MECHANICAL
    4 SAFETY DEVICE OR OTHER INCORPORATED DESIGN TECHNOLOGY THAT IS
    5 DESIGNED TO PREVENT CHILDREN AND OTHER UNAUTHORIZED USERS FROM
    6 DISCHARGING THE HANDGUN.

    (6) "INTEGRATED MECHANICAL SAFETY DEVICE" MEANS A DISABLING
    8 OR LOCKING DEVICE THAT:
    9 (I) IS BUILT INTO A HANDGUN; AND
    10 (II) IS DESIGNED TO PREVENT THE HANDGUN FROM BEING
    11 DISCHARGED UNLESS THE DEVICE HAS BEEN REMOVED OR DEACTIVATED.
     
  19. JamisJockey

    JamisJockey member

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    If anybody from Beretta USA is watching, Northern Utah has lots and lots of nice tax incentives to offer...
    :evil:
     
  20. Chipperman

    Chipperman Member

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    "The assault weapons bill would ban not only the semiautomatic Uzis, AK-47s and other guns included in the federal assault weapons ban set to expire this year, but also copycats and other assault weapons, such as the Bushmaster rifle "

    So the ban would include assault weapons AND assault weapons. Even when changes are made to comply with the law, they are still being called assault weapons. Why? Because they are semi-auto, black, and have a pistol grip. :scrutiny:

    The law is meaningless to the media. :banghead:
     
  21. clange

    clange Member

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    :barf:
     
  22. WarMachine

    WarMachine Member

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    Now that's what I'm talking 'bout :evil:

    I am glad that Beretta did not cop-out and decide to install the locking devices in their handguns.

    But I still cannot afford to buy one :banghead:
     
  23. Henry Bowman

    Henry Bowman Senior Member

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    Then I wonder why Beretta has advertised its B-LOK system in magazines (such as the NRA mags)?
     
  24. Kestrel

    Kestrel Member

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    What has happened to America? Maryland law is just absurd. It's hard to swallow...
     
  25. Norton

    Norton Member

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    There are couple of levels of insanity in MD. Level 1 is Montgomery County, Prince George's County and Baltimore City. It's so bad there that all sensible people are fleeing those jurisdictions for other parts of the state.

    Level 2 is the insanity that pervades the entire state. When the sensible folks (see level 1) get fed up with this other level of stupidity....they simply leave the state altogether.

    Beretta was located on the Eastern shore where level 1 does not apply. They are simply getting tired of level 2 and are responding appropriately.

    I, for one, hope they go. More ammo for our argument.....
     
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