SoonerSP101
Member
Is this the .38 +P 158 LSWCHP "FBI Load"
Is this the .38 +P 158 LSWCHP "FBI Load"
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Jim Watson
Member
Meets the description of what I have always called the FBI load or the Detroit load.
SoonerSP101
Member
Thanks. Since it didn't have a "SWC" on the box I'm unsure. Looking at the round it does look like a SWC but ...
jaholder1971
Member
That's it.
FBI load, Detroit load, Chicago load, it's all the same.
It's said that the Winchester bullet is a little softer lead than the Remington, which makes for less penetration and more expansion. The Remington is supposed to be the better performer but it's probably a miniscule difference.
FBI load, Detroit load, Chicago load, it's all the same.
It's said that the Winchester bullet is a little softer lead than the Remington, which makes for less penetration and more expansion. The Remington is supposed to be the better performer but it's probably a miniscule difference.
Stephen A. Camp
Moderator In Memoriam
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Hello. That's it!
Best.
Best.
_N4Z_
Member
Flip flop that.
Remington uses a softer lead. Both Federal and Winchester are harder.
jaydubya
Member
That is it, right down to the serial number, the Remington FBI load that is in my S&W 637 snubby. I agree with the post above: the Remmy is dead soft lead, while the Winnie is a harder cast. Don't drop those Remingtons; they always land on their nose, which basically turns them into range ammo. A week ago the Remingon FBI load was available from Outdoormarksman.com. They often have it.
Cordially, Jack
Cordially, Jack
QuarterBoreGunner
Member
Yup. I've also hear it called 'Metro load'; it's in my S&W 637 even as we speak.
dfariswheel
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"Back in the day" the .38 Special was known to street cops as "The Widow maker" due to the numerous failures to stop.
When the police unions started demanding better ammo, and trial lawyers started suing cities for dead cops families, the cities finally allowed use of the famed "FBI load" and the complaints about ineffective ammo stopped.
The load was known by a number of names relating to the cities or agencies that used it, but the street cops called it "The .38 SPLAT" supposedly for the sound it made when it hit.
While there are newer .38 Special loads, the FBI load is still one of the very best you can use in a .38, and a lot of people use it in their .357's for the lower muzzle blast and recoil.
In any case, a person with a revolver loaded with it is WELL armed.
When the police unions started demanding better ammo, and trial lawyers started suing cities for dead cops families, the cities finally allowed use of the famed "FBI load" and the complaints about ineffective ammo stopped.
The load was known by a number of names relating to the cities or agencies that used it, but the street cops called it "The .38 SPLAT" supposedly for the sound it made when it hit.
While there are newer .38 Special loads, the FBI load is still one of the very best you can use in a .38, and a lot of people use it in their .357's for the lower muzzle blast and recoil.
In any case, a person with a revolver loaded with it is WELL armed.
SAWBONES
Member
Yes, that's definitely it.
There are several premium all-lead 158gr SWCHP .38 Special+P loads out there, but the Remington has the reputation of having the best expansion among them, and I can attest to the Remington bullet lead being softer than the Winchester equivalent.
For some reason, the Remington load often seems difficult to find. I always try to keep a few spare boxes of it on hand.
There are several premium all-lead 158gr SWCHP .38 Special+P loads out there, but the Remington has the reputation of having the best expansion among them, and I can attest to the Remington bullet lead being softer than the Winchester equivalent.
For some reason, the Remington load often seems difficult to find. I always try to keep a few spare boxes of it on hand.
Gordon
Member
The Remington load is faster and softer than the others- it works better.
Actually back in the day I remember that Supervel 110 grain was the Super load that federal agents wanted to use (and did on thir own dollar) they fired a 110 grain gaping semijacketed hollowpoint at 1100+FPS from a 4"(975fps 2") gun and were the first hollow point ammo that actually mushroomed reliably. Later Winchester got the idea and contract to make the similar but better scallop bullet "Treasury Load" in late 70s which was now rated +P+ which is too much for the smaller framed .38s and older K frames too! I wore out a couple Colt Agents quickly with it before I got the idea in the 80's!
Although I prefer the 158grain (remington latest batch)LHP +P for my defensive .38's these days, make no doubt about it the 110 grain 'treasury load" makes a nasty wound that most people cease and desist from right away.It blows up things the size of medium dogs in longer barrel guns like K-38s.
Actually back in the day I remember that Supervel 110 grain was the Super load that federal agents wanted to use (and did on thir own dollar) they fired a 110 grain gaping semijacketed hollowpoint at 1100+FPS from a 4"(975fps 2") gun and were the first hollow point ammo that actually mushroomed reliably. Later Winchester got the idea and contract to make the similar but better scallop bullet "Treasury Load" in late 70s which was now rated +P+ which is too much for the smaller framed .38s and older K frames too! I wore out a couple Colt Agents quickly with it before I got the idea in the 80's!
Although I prefer the 158grain (remington latest batch)LHP +P for my defensive .38's these days, make no doubt about it the 110 grain 'treasury load" makes a nasty wound that most people cease and desist from right away.It blows up things the size of medium dogs in longer barrel guns like K-38s.
The_Shootist
Member
Nod
Its usually on Midway - thats where I get mine.
Its usually on Midway - thats where I get mine.
ArchAngelCD
Member.
SoonerSP101
Member
Thanks All!!! I ordered 100 round from Midway to play with. Should be here tomorrow. that's fast. Thanks again!
Cosmoline
Member
Also, Winchester's version is *really* smokey. I've been trying it at the range and it's like black powder.
45Badger
Member
Any thoughts on the Federal NyClad, 158 gr SWCHP, +P?
Good, bad indifferent compared To the Winchester or Remington loads?
Good, bad indifferent compared To the Winchester or Remington loads?
SAWBONES
Member
Yeah, it's no longer made.
Federal discontinued their Nyclad line a few years ago.
It was clean and accurate in my snubbies.
Jim March
Member
The Federal version (Nyclad OR plain lead 158+P) was under-powered. Avoid.
The Winchester variant will work OK, from a 4" or longer barrel.
The Remmie works in snubbies. So does both Buffalo Bore variants (standard and +P). The BuffBore standard pressure has less peak pressure than the Remmie yet manages to achieve similar bullet speeds. Damned impressive stuff. If your gun is particularly weak or old, spend the extra on BuffBore standard pressure. If your gun is strong by 38Spl standards consider the BuffBore 38+P as it's the most potent 38 defense ammo made, period, end of discussion.
Speer's 135gr +P JHP is a good round but...I suspect the Remmie 158+P as pictured in this thread is better and at less cost. The only time the Speer turns dominant is in VERY lightweight guns of 12.5oz or less. Because lead is very slick, they can yank out of the shells under recoil and the Speer 135+P was specifically designed not to do that even in that insanely light 10.5oz S&W model.
What else...Cor-Bon used to load a 158+P similar to the Buffalo Bore and at similar massive horsepower - but it lacked the gas-check (copper "heat shield" base) and hence leaded the barrel something wild. That's why it was discontinued...and given how long ago this was, I would only shoot these loads in a STRONG gun as they probably got real edgy with the pressure curve.
The gas-checks are part of what drives up the cost of both BuffBore variants.
The Winchester variant will work OK, from a 4" or longer barrel.
The Remmie works in snubbies. So does both Buffalo Bore variants (standard and +P). The BuffBore standard pressure has less peak pressure than the Remmie yet manages to achieve similar bullet speeds. Damned impressive stuff. If your gun is particularly weak or old, spend the extra on BuffBore standard pressure. If your gun is strong by 38Spl standards consider the BuffBore 38+P as it's the most potent 38 defense ammo made, period, end of discussion.
Speer's 135gr +P JHP is a good round but...I suspect the Remmie 158+P as pictured in this thread is better and at less cost. The only time the Speer turns dominant is in VERY lightweight guns of 12.5oz or less. Because lead is very slick, they can yank out of the shells under recoil and the Speer 135+P was specifically designed not to do that even in that insanely light 10.5oz S&W model.
What else...Cor-Bon used to load a 158+P similar to the Buffalo Bore and at similar massive horsepower - but it lacked the gas-check (copper "heat shield" base) and hence leaded the barrel something wild. That's why it was discontinued...and given how long ago this was, I would only shoot these loads in a STRONG gun as they probably got real edgy with the pressure curve.
The gas-checks are part of what drives up the cost of both BuffBore variants.
Drifting Fate
Member
In my experience, Winchester uses a much softer lead than Remington, but both are good loads. And, I have to admit it's been few years since I put a knife to the two to test the difference. I prefer the Win, but would feel fine carrying either one.
Stephen A. Camp
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