Jon Cowan of AGS addresses the DLC to explain how to win the gun vote

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
Dec 26, 2002
Messages
14,613
Location
Texas
Jonathan Cowan was a Clinton-era HUD official in charge of the HUD guyn buybacks during that administration. After the Democrats lost, he went to work for the Democrat-run "Americans for Gun Safety" gun control group.

In 2003, he delivered a speech to the DLC highlighting how gun owners could be split just enough to enact further gun control and how to sell that message to their constituents. This is an opinion piece that everybody here needs to read and understand. The Dems didn't follow his advice in 2004; but they seem to be following it now...

http://www.dlc.org/ndol_ci.cfm?kaid=126&subid=189&contentid=252171

What we want to do here is have a nuts-and-bolts discussion on how to seize the cultural center in three critical areas: national security, role of religion in public life, and responsible gun ownership. And we have two highly qualified people to talk about those issues. Let me introduce them in the order we're going to call on them to speak.

First, Jonathan Cowan, who is president of Americans for Gun Safety, which is the second successful nonprofit group that he started and directed. In 1992 he co-founded Legal Leave, which was the nation's leading generation ex-advocacy group. That's back when you were young, Jon. He was a spokesman for the rising generation, which was shoving us boomers aside, but we didn't resent it too much. Anyway, that organization has chapters in all 50 states and hundreds of colleges and campuses and is tremendously important. And now the work that Jon is engaged in on guns I think is changing the debate, and it's really the Americans for Gun Safety that commissioned and designed what I think is the most creative poll on the gun issue, specifically, but probing public attitudes about a difficult cultural issue generally than I think I've ever seen.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

JON COWAN: Morning, afternoon, wherever we are exactly now. I will try to be brief. I'm kind of sandwiched in between Al, who did some of the highlights from our poll, and the workshops this afternoon, which are going to -- our gun workshop will get into a great deal of detail. So I will cover some of the ground that's going to be covered in both of those places but try to go a little bit of a different direction.

First of all I want to thank the entire DLC team in particular Al and Will and Holly, who made this all happen. Thank you all a lot. It's a real honor partnering with you. Also the team from Americans for Gun Safety is here: Jim Kessler and Deborah Barron.

Why did AGS, Americans for Gun Safety, choose to partner with the DLC in this conference, other than the fact that we were personally fond of Al and Will and Holly? We did because we're a non-partisan organization and our mission is not about either political party. Our mission is reasonable gun safety laws, reduction in gun crime and violence in the country. We partnered with the DLC because the Democratic Party has been the traditional driver of reasonable, sensible gun policy in the country, and as you all know if you've been reading almost any newspaper in the last couple years, the Democratic Party has been really in retreat on this issue.

So, as a gun safety advocate, as somebody who's deeply passionate about the issue, if we're interested in advancing our cause, we have no choice but to make sure that the party that has traditionally been responsible on this issue continues to take that leadership role.

Let me tell you a little bit about Americans for Gun Safety so you have a context. We were started three years ago by a guy named Andrew McKelvey. You all won't know Andy's name but you'll know his company and their ads. Andy owns Monster.com, so I'm sure everybody has seen the Monster ads starting a few years ago at the Super Bowl. Andy had never been in politics -- he's in his late 60s -- and he decided that he was really passionate about the gun issue after Columbine. He has a couple of kids and Columbine really bothered him, and so he gave the majority of the money to fund the actual Million Mom March. And after the march he really decided, you know, I want to do something: I'm an entrepreneur, I want to do my own thing on this.

So he came and he met a couple of us. I was working as Andrew Cuomo's chief of staff in the Department of Housing and Urban Development, and he came to a couple of us, met us with some friends and said, I want to start an organization -- let's do this -- but I want to do it in a different way. The two things I want to be different are I want to see if we can actually make more progress on the issue instead of being kind of ideologically rigid about it; and secondly, I'd like to run it like a business. Andy's expertise at Monster, as you all know, is branding and marketing -- and I want to bring that kind of branding and marketing business discipline to an organization.

So, I'm no fool. If somebody says they'll spend millions of dollars on a cause and they'll put you in charge of it and you get to hire the best people you can find and go take on one of the toughest, most polarizing issues in the country, that's the entire reason I got into politics in the first place, as everybody in this room did, so it was exciting to do.

The AGS, as I said, started three years ago, and our goal was this: to carve out a centrist position in the gun debate. As you all know, the debate is incredibly polarizing, one of the most polarizing in the country. You have the NRA on the right and then you have the traditional gun control groups on the left, and neither speaks to where the center of the country is -- and I'll get into that in little bit more detail. So we set out to carve out a centrist position. The first thing we did was we went into Colorado and Oregon. Both states have ballot initiatives to require background checks at gun shows.

Now, you'd think, well, you know, in the wake of Columbine, gosh, that would be no problem; it would just pass. Closing the gun show loophole is a reasonable policy. In Colorado it looked like it would pass but in Oregon it looked like it was going to fail. It was polling at under 50 percent as a ballot initiative. We stepped in. We were not the ones who put it on the ballot. We stepped in to help out about two months out from Election Day. We spent about $3 million. We recruited John McCain to appear in our ads. We did about half a million pieces of direct mail, a quarter of a million phone calls. We ran a professional campaign like any of you would run for office, and we won overwhelmingly in both states, and in fact, we carried a majority of gun owners in both states.

So that was the first time we really went out and road-tested this question of, is there a center on the gun debate? Can you win over a meaningful number of gun owners? Since then, AGS has gone on to try to carve out this centrist position in Washington on national legislation. And I'll get to that in a moment.

Who do our opponents think we are? Well, our opponents are of course, not surprisingly, the National Rifle Association. And our opponents have had this to say about us: At one of their recent conferences, Wayne LaPierre said that Americans for Gun Safety was a greater threat to American freedom than Osama bin Laden and al Qaeda. (Laughter.) I kid you not. They've gone on to say rather widely in all of their magazines that Americans for Gun Safety is the most lethal of all the gun control groups.

Why do they say that? They say that not just because it helps raise money, which it does; they say that because they realize that we are on to something, that there is really a center position in this debate. And in fact, if you think of the National Rifle Association in a business or marketing context and you question market share -- how much of the market share of gun owners do they have that they purport to speak for? Well, there are about 65 (million), 70 million or so gun owners in the country, gun-owning households, depending on whose survey you look at. Well, the NRA has three million members. Well, that's a lot of members and they have a ton of money and they're very powerful, but that's a tiny percentage of market share. What that means is that the vast majority of gun owners do not feel so threatened about guns and somebody taking away their guns that they feel a need to belong to the NRA. Now, that means, again, that there's a huge percentage of gun owners that fall into this centrist, reasonable, moderate category.

Now, that's the basics of who we are and why we're doing this. Let me step back for a moment and kind of quickly recount recent gun history, the politics of guns, because it really brings me to what we're here today to do and the message we're trying to carry both here and in the workshops.
 
Continued:

During the 1990s we passed a couple of major gun laws. The Brady law and the assault weapons ban couldn't actually handle the issue very well. As Al showed, we actually did pretty well among gun owners and we passed some major laws. Then we had Columbine, and what really happened in the wake of Columbine was the media, everybody, talked about how this would shift the entire terrain and we would now actually start seeing a wave of gun legislation, and this really shifted the politics of everything. We then had the Million Mom March, which was one of the largest marches on the Mall ever.

But what happened was that people really overplayed their hand, and that includes the Democratic Party, and Democrats veered -- and I happen to be a Democrat although I run a nonpartisan organization -- we veered very far to the left. And if you looked at the Million Mom March -- and I thought the march was a good thing and it was an important thing for people to speak out, but if you looked at the march, people were walking around holding signs that said "We love our kids more than you love your guns." Well, that is unbelievably insulting to anybody who owns a gun. And as Al said, that is so polarizing you might as well just wipe off that portion of people. Now, people associated the Million Mom March with the Democratic Party, not surprisingly.

We then had more run -- and won't get into all the dynamics of the Gore race. They're obviously very complicated and go far beyond the gun issue. But guns did matter in the 200 election, there's no question, and they mattered in critical states. Well, if you look at how Gore handled the gun issue -- and I say this as a good Democrat -- he did not handle it well at all. First of all, he tacked way too far left to try to compete with Bradley in the primaries, and he shouldn't have done that. A, he shouldn't have done it because it wasn't the right policy, and B, he shouldn't have done it because it was bad politics. He tacked far to the left then in the general election he ducked. He literally just ducked: I'm done on this. He never talked about it; he avoided it whenever it came up. When it came up in the presidential debates he kind of mumbled some answer that wasn't particularly effective, and guess what happened? Not surprisingly, Al Gore was defined by the NRA on guns -- simple as that.

Now, I don't how many of you have seen NRA pieces of mail and their magazine, but they're unabashed about it. They think that Al Gore -- they defined Al Gore as to the left of Chuck Schumer on guns. During the 2000 election I went -- I grew up horseback riding. That's what I did a lot in my life; I went and shot guns a lot at camp. I really enjoyed it. I happen to really enjoy guns and the outdoors and so on. I went out with my father and some friends riding out West in Wyoming for a week. And we went to a ranch there and we got picked up at the airport and we were driven by a woman who works at the ranch. We started getting into a discussion and she got into -- we started getting into guns. People asked what I do, and you know -- I don't always say the same things -- say what I do in Wyoming, but she started asking, and so I told her. And she said, "You know, I'm really concerned. I'm really, really worried." I said, "What are you worried about?" I'm thinking she'd say, like, the economy is not great, or, gosh, out here I've got to provide for my kids, or, I have no healthcare or something. "I'm afraid that if Al Gore gets elected they're going to take my gun away." I said, "Well, you mean that metaphorically, right, like they'll pass a tough" -- "No, no, no, they're going to come take my gun away." I said, "You mean they're going to come to your house and they're going to" -- "Yes, and the NRA told me that, that if Al Gore is elected they are going to come to my house and they're going to take my gun away."

Well, if you talk to Joe Lieberman, he'll tell you, on the campaign in 2000, he saw this kind of stuff everywhere he went. And what happened was -- and it's true of any issue in politics, and you all know -- and I've never held office; you have and you know this -- your opponent will always fill the vacuum of silence, only your opponent has three million members and $100-plus million to spend. You can bet they're going to fill that vacuum and it's not going to be favorable towards you. And that's what they did toward guns.

So when Al Gore -- when folks went into the voting booth and close to half the electorate that has a gun in the house went to pull the lever, if they pulled the lever for Al Gore they had to pull the lever overcoming this thought: If I pull this lever he might take my gun away. Well, that wasn't necessary. Al Gore could have handled, as we're going to get to, the issue very differently. And if he had handled the issue the way we're outlining today, and we'll outline in detail in the workshop, if he had handled the issue that way, I don't know that he would have won. There are other big forces, obviously -- needless to say, Florida and others -- but he might have. It might have been the single issue that closed one or two percentage points, because these gun owners are movable; many of them are movable. And we'll get to that.

What does that mean, that recent history of guns and the experience with Gore and all that? Well, Democrats concluded the exact opposite of what they should have concluded. Democrats concluded -- and I don't fancy myself a great Democratic general strategist -- no James Carville, et cetera, et cetera -- I've only figured this one issue out with Jim and the rest of our team. And frankly, we really have, I feel, walked the trail that Al and Will and the DLC blaze, which is looking at an issue through a different lens and creating a third way, and we applied the DLC motto to the gun issue. But I will tell you this on the gun issues we've studied in depth: Democrats concluded exactly the wrong thing, and they concluded exactly what the NRA and the Republicans wanted them to conclude. We were literally led down the trail to the place they wanted us to go and we think we're the ones who made the decision to go there. What did Democrats conclude from the last election? We'd better shut up about guns. My god, let's close our mouths. Let's create an even bigger vacuum, and ever-bigger vacuum that will allow our opponents to define us.

So the conventional wisdom in the National Democratic Party in Washington for the last couple of years has been shut up about guns. Just shut up. Don't talk about it legislatively; don't talk about it on the campaign trail. Just shut up. Well, that is a strategy that is doomed to failure. It's doomed in a local election, it's doomed in a statewide election, and it is definitely doomed as a national strategy for the party. Why is it doomed? We'll get into this in great detail this afternoon. But why is it doomed and why are we speaking out as a non-partisan organization to try to change this?

We have three simple messages to Democrats. First -- and people have gone through the numbers; I won't go through them again -- there is a gun gap. Democrats face a bit gap in carrying gun owners. It's real. It's been proven time and time again. Democrats are not carrying gun owners nearly in the numbers that they could, but most importantly, that they need to if they're going to build a national Democratic majority.

Second, their answer to the conventional wisdom has been silence, but silence won't work. Why won't silence work? Well, first of all, silence won't work because nobody ever uses that on a campaign. I mean, I've never heard of such a strategy. If your consultant came to you and said, "You know what? You bounced checks." Remember this scandal? "You bounced checks at the House Bank. I think we should just keep that quiet. Let's be real quiet about it. I mean, it'll be in the papers and your opponent will use direct mail and phone calls on it, but if you don't speak to it, maybe people will think -- oh, it'll just disappear or go away." Whoever heard of such a strategy? None of you use it in your campaigns. Your opponent comes after you and says, when you are city councilperson and now that you're running for state attorney general -- "You know what? There were fewer jobs created." "Okay, you know, I'm going to be quiet about that. That makes sense; I'll change the subject to something else." Well, that's what Democrats did.

Now, there's a second problem besides the fact that it's a stupid general strategy. The second problem is gun owners already have an existing perception of Democrats that is very negative, that is anti-Second Amendment, that is anti-gun, that is -- and this is most important, as Senator Pryor pointed out -- that is anti gun-owner values. Well, if you go into a race and your opponent -- and you've all done this if you've done baseline polling, right, on a candidate -- you look at the attributes going into a race when you run a baseline poll and if one of the attributes is you're 35 years old, you're 33 years old: You're too young, too inexperienced to hold statewide office. Let's say somebody had that as a criteria. Well, guess what? What candidate would go out and not try to fix that poor perception? In effect, one of the core things that people track, particularly in the statewide and national elections, they track that baseline perception of the candidate. And a good candidate has an idea in mind, very clear idea: I'm here, I'm perceived this way, by the end of the campaign I want to be here, and if I can't get from here to here, I'm going to lose.

Well, Democrats right now are perceived in such a negative way by gun owners that unless they actually go out and speak to the issue and actively shift the issue, as you would do in any other issue in any other race, and stop being afraid of the issue and stop thinking that there's some taboo on talking about it and silence will work. Democrats then can actually solve the problem, but first, Democrats at the state, local, and national level in red states, and nationally, are going to have to do the same thing you do when you've got a problem, which is face your problem, admit you have it, and actually do something about it.

Third message -- and this is the good news -- however negative the perceptions are, they can be changed. There is a solution. Remember, Democrats don't have to carry every gun owner. They don't even have to carry a majority of gun owners. Karl Rove knows this and Wayne LaPierre knows this. If Democrats make small, not even huge, small inroads into gun owners, the whole table shifts and now Republicans have real trouble building a majority and carrying a bunch of these states that are won by a very small margin. Tim Johnson in South Dakota won by 500-and-something votes, I believe -- 500-and-something votes. I mean, that means that a small percentage of a piece of the electorate that feels strongly about an issue, if they move your way, you win.

Well, what is the solution? The solution, as I said, steals a page from the DLC play and it's a third-way centrist solution. I'll present what are really kind of the core elements of it now.

I want to say, though, the most important thing about this solution is we are not recommending something that requires the Democratic Party to either lose its core values -- I'm not saying sell out, you know, Democrats must become like Wayne LaPierre. No, that's not what I'm saying. Democrats can retain their core values and progressive principles. Number two, Democrats don't have to give up on their base. The whole point today is not, well, here's our base; lets shift away from our base and pick up new voters and give up on our base. No. We can hold our base and pick up new voters. And that is true on the gun issue as well. And in fact, you'll see in some of the detailed polling this afternoon, if Democrats are carrying the right message on guns, they pick up even more people in the base and even more swing voters like suburban women.

So what is the solution? It has three parts. First, Democrats must embrace, love, own, take back the Second Amendment, period, unequivocally. If you look at Senator Pryor -- and I really believe he's the model on this -- if you look at his direct mail pieces, Senator Pryor's direct mail pieces talk about the Second Amendment. They show him hunting. I mean, we can go down the list. But it doesn't matter whether you are or aren't a gun owner. It doesn't matter if you're a hunter or not. I'm not telling you to go out and start learning to hunt; if you're, you know, 45 and you've never hunted before, take shooting lessons. Although, if you've never shot a gun, I encourage you to do it. It's an interesting experience; I happen to enjoy it. Even if you don't enjoy it, it's an important piece of understanding the cultural piece to this.

Democrats must embrace the Second Amendment for a range of reasons. First of all, Democrats need to strongly embrace the Second Amendment because that's the right thing to do. The Second Amendment guarantees the right to bear arms. I think this is a silly debate that we're having as a country. In fact, polls show that most Americans think that it's a silly debate. As Al put up there, the tiny fringe on both sides believe that there is no Second Amendment right to bear arms and we can have any gun laws no matter how restrictive, and the other side believes there's an absolute right and allows for no gun laws. Seventy-four percent -- and that's the key number -- 74 percent of Americans believe that there is a right to have a gun, to own guns, from the Second Amendment, and that right carries with it responsibilities to the individual gun owner as well as for us as a society and as a country.

So Democrats need to be clear that they are strong backers of the Second Amendment, which by the way, many Democrats already are but they're not enunciating it clearly as a national party. That should be part of our party platform. We should be very clear about that. And that means the Democrats are embracing a rights and responsibilities position.

Second is closing loopholes. Democrats need to -- and this is part of the formula that we've tested, and it's very clear we also have to be right on the policies. Democrats need to embrace and stand up for reasonable, sensible gun laws that fix problems in the system and close loopholes: things like requiring background checks at gun shows, fixing the Instant-Check system to make it more instant and accurate, combating gun trafficking, renewing the assault weapons ban -- very basic, sensible policies that have wide support that are also good and effective gun policy.

Third, Democrats need to be vigorous supporters of enforcing the existing gun laws and take that issue back. I want to talk about that in a little more detail right now. The enforcement issue is a fascinating issue. As you've all, I'm sure, seen widely, Republicans, President Bush, the NRA, their answer to the gun violence problem in America and the gun permit problem is let's just enforce the laws on the books. That's all we need to do, enforce the laws on the books. And, in fact, that actually polls quite well with many Americans, including non-gun owners.

Finally, let's take them up on it. Let's enforce the laws on the books. So what Americans for Gun Safety did that nobody had done before was we went and we FOIA'd about 5,000 pages of Justice Department documents. It took us about nine months to get it. They weren't thrilled to release it. I'm sure whoever released it lost their job. And we took a close look at Clinton's last year and Bush's first year on federal gun prosecutions to see whether Bush and his allies, the NRA, whether they were actually fulfilling their promise to enforce the laws on the books. Well, guess what we found? That on 20 of the 22 major federal gun laws -- 20 of the 22 major federal gun laws, they were being enforced so infrequently by Bush and Ashcroft that they might as well not exist.

Two of the laws, which are important laws in which we're prosecuting felons who are in possession of a gun, they were doing better than Clinton. Not amazingly better, but better in perspective and we give them praise for that. They, however, were ignoring the other 20. I'll give you one very powerful example of that. This became the signature issue for the NRA.

It's a crime called "lie-and-buy." Anybody here -- how many people here own guns? A lot. So, you've bought guns. When you go in to buy a gun from a gun dealer you have to fill out the background check form, and when he fills the background check form -- that's what the Brady Law did -- so that when you go to buy a gun, that you make sure that it's John Cowan, the nice guy who lives in Washington who, you know, never did anything bad except when he was a kid and didn't get caught for it, versus John Cowan who is a known felon.

Well, many people -- I mean, this is shocking but a lot of criminals, bizarrely enough, are stupid enough that they go and they go to gun stores to buy guns still, and they fill out the background check form and they fail the background check test. A hundred and thirty-six thousand of them in 2002 went into buy a gun -- 136,000 criminals went in to buy a gun, filled out the form, it was rejected and they were denied their gun purchase. Well, it's good they were denied their gun purchase, but as the NRA and Bush have pointed out so many times, wait a minute, that's a felony. Lying on the background check form means you illegally tried to purchase a gun. You're a felon. You're a domestic abuser. You're adjudicated mentally incompetent. You can't go buy guns. You should go to prison for that.

Well, let me read you a couple of things that the NRA had to say about this so-called crime of lie-and-buy. This was on "Nightline" in March of 2000. "The question here is, has the president looked into the eyes of Ricky Birdsong's family, because that death is on his hands." Ben Smith, the shooter, who shot this guy named Ricky Birdsong -- "Ben Smith walked into a gun store on June 23rd, was flagged under the Instant-Check system" -- i.e., he filled out a background check form and was denied -- "committing a brand-new federal felony right under the president's nose. The president's policy did nothing to him except let him walk out the door and go home." In other words, there was this guy who committed the crime of lie-and-buy, he tried to buy a gun illegally and President Clinton and Attorney General Reno did not prosecute that crime. Let me just read those words again: "The question here is, has the president looked into the eyes of Ricky Birdsong's family, because that death is on his hands."

Well, let's look at the facts. A hundred and thirty-six thousand people in 2002 committed the crime that Ben Smith did that the president apparently has blood on his hands for, the ex-president. How many of those people, 136,000, were prosecuted under the new Bush-Ashcroft regime of tough, vigorous enforcement of all federal gun laws? Well, there were 501 under Clinton -- and I'm a Clinton fan, but that's obviously not a great record. Well, Bush and Ashcroft, they changed the whole thing: 578 -- 578. Out of 136, 000 people, they increased it by 77. Why do Democrats let them get away with that? You want a gun issue that works in California, New Jersey, Florida, Texas, Georgia, Alabama. You want a gun issue that works anywhere in America? Take back the enforcement issue if you're a Democrat. Hold the Republicans and the NRA's feet to the fire.
 
Final part:

Now, that has a couple of advantages. One, it puts Democrats on the offensive on guns: We're the ones now fighting for enforcing the existing laws -- which is very popular with gun owners. Secondly, it puts us on the right side of policy: We have these laws; they should be enforced. And third, it might help resolve the long-term gun issue: We don't know, if we fully enforced all these laws, how much of a dramatic reduction we might see in gun crime. We might actually see such a dramatic reduction that we've gone a long way to solving the gun crime and gun violence problem in the country. I can tell you this: For Democrats to let Ashcroft and Bush and Republicans get way with not enforcing laws after that was a major promise on guns is outrageous, scandalous and a mistake.

Let me close on this: The, again, silence on this issue is terrible for Democrats. It means we won't win on red states; it means we won't carry a national majority. I care about this as not just a Democrat but as somebody who's a gun safety advocate.

A couple of quick closing points: Why did we call our group Americans for Gun Safety and not Americans for Gun Control? Well, we did it not just because we polled it and "gun safety," as Al said, polls much better, but you don't need to do a poll to figure that out. I mean, it's rather obvious. We don't have "car control," but "gun control?" Well, "gun control" -- we've done focus groups on this -- to suburban, Democratic women, means taking away your gun. That's what it means to suburban, Democratic, non-gun-owning women. What do you think it means to gun owners? I think calling ourselves gun control advocates, as either Democrats or as an interest group, I think that is as foolish and backwards as if you're pro-choice called yourself anti-life and hoping that that's going to work. (Laughter.) And that's what we've been doing for 25 years. We have been mislabeling ourselves to our own detriment.

If you follow the formula we're laying out, I am not saying it is -- no pun intended -- the silver bullet. I'm not saying the NRA is not going to come after you. They're probably still going to call you as bad as Osama bin Laden. They came after Mark Pryor even though the guy's clearly a staunch enforcer and supporter of the Second Amendment and enforcing gun laws and took all the right positions on the issues. But the focus here is not the NRA. They don't matter. I really mean that. They don't matter. They're going to come after you no matter what because they want a Republican majority. That is what they're interested in. They're going to come after you no matter what. You don't need to worry about them. Keep your eye on the ball. Go after gun owners, talk to gun owners, in mail, in phones, in speeches. Go after gun owners because if you carry a small percentage more of them, and you can with a lot of the messages we're going to get into in the strategies this afternoon, you will actually blunt the NRA's edge and you'll be able to win.

Let me give you a couple of quick examples and then I'll close -- messages we tested. I'll give you five messages that tested above 80 percent in terms of, "If a Democrat said this, would you be more likely to vote for them?" -- and this is among gun owners -- "Gun rights come with the responsibility to keep them out of the hands of criminals and terrorists." "I support gun safety measures, like criminal background checks on all sales at gun shows and tough enforcement of existing laws." "American families have a right to own a gun to protect themselves and their families." "I take a backseat to no one in support of Second Amendment rights, but I also support requiring criminal background checks at gun shows and continuing the ban on assault weapons." That message, 83 percent likely would make a gun owner want to vote for a Democrat. Those are messages we can carry.

Let me close on this point: This is where many Democrats already are. This is where they already are, as the other speakers have said. This is not some radical shift. We've been mislabeling ourselves, talking about it the wrong way, fighting for it the wrong way, completely doing it backwards, but most Democrats, particularly in red states, they understand the values of gun owners. They get the cultural division. They support the Second Amendment and they want to stand up for progressive policies. If Democrats come back to their roots, if they take back the Second Amendment, we will permanently -- Democrats will permanently change the policies of guns and by doing that they'll permanently change the politics of America.

Thank you very much.
 
Let me tell you a little bit about Americans for Gun Safety so you have a context. We were started three years ago by a guy named Andrew McKelvey. You all won't know Andy's name but you'll know his company and their ads. Andy owns Monster.com

That's all any pro-RKBA job seeker needs to know.

About five or six years ago when I learned of McKelvey's anti-RKBA position, I posted about it hoping other people would take note.

It seems like everywhere you turn, people on gun boards that are looking for a job are willing to use monster.com despite the anti-gun funding from McKelvey.

:banghead:
 
The problem is that they are still pushing for more gun control and the republicans arent. If it takes them 3 million dollars to win a dead heat gun show loophole campaign in colorado (which has a ton of liberals), that doesnt really tell me they are that strong.

The best they can do is hold the line and keep the left half of their party from passing anything dangerous. Every time they take power they have a struggle with their own party to avoid using that power to pass gun control. The culture in this country is continuing to trend towards more gun rights. Another 10-20 years and they wont even be able to say they support gun show loophole type laws.
 
I was at least mildly interested until I hit this point, which shows clearer than ever that people like this are just volves in sheeps' clothing (and still clueless after all these years):


renewing the assault weapons ban -- very basic, sensible policies that have wide support that are also good and effective gun policy.
 
And that is that. Party leaders will always want to ban and therefore will never win over the logical gun owner.

Also it is very hard as Kerry found out to be both for and against something at the same time. So the old school dems have their backs up aginst the wall. They can not reverse themselves without looking like flip flops. Some of the new dems are talking the pro 2A talk but will they walk the walk? Let us have some votes and we will see.

That said I worry more about the RINOs than the dems. They have the potential to do a lot more harm as traitors to the cause than the party no one trusts already. The overwhelming majority does not want these crazy laws but RINOs would force them upon us and get enough of the right to go with them enough to make them happen as opposed to the galvanizing effect against craziness that the dems cause. Just like the PA that never should have happened.
 
The folks hashing it out in the "compromise" thread should come read this.

That strategy plays right into their hands.
 
The loophole is where your wife says no more buying guns, but you can come back from the gun show with a new gun or two and claim you traded into them and they didn't cost you anything.

That's the only gun show loophole I know of.

John
 
This is a 4 year old speech given by a guy whos organization dosen't exist anymore.

The DLC and its "3rd way" movement are no longer en vogue in Democratic circles.

They tried his way with Kerry in 2004 and still got clobbered. In several states Democratic NRA "A" rated governors were elected on the same ticket where Kerry lost by 10+ percentage points.

The DLC is a dying organization that holds an ever slipping grip on the power levers of the Democratic machinery.

They couldn't force their handpicked candidates on the DNC chairmanship (which was take in a coup by Howard Dean) and have an ever decreasing stable of candidates.

Hillary Clinton is the DLC's last gasp, an IMHO she'll go down in the primaries and seal the fate of the DLC with her. Once the primary season passes and her corporate money supplies aren't able to compete with the more populist methods of fund raising pioneered by Dean, the DLC will have outlived its purpose.

Reading this speech is a lot like judging todays Republicans by reading the Contract with America.

The political landscape has changed since it was relevant, and the people pushing the polices enumerated are in in shorter and shorter supply.

Guys like Jim Webb, John Tester, and Bill Richardson are more indicative of the Democratic parties evolving stance on the gun issue.

Though they did take Jon Cowans advice in one respect, they didn't shut up about gun control. They actively campaign against it.
 
DLC gave us the AHSA as an alternative to Americans for Gun
Safety in the last election cycle. Who was fooled? Not many.

I would like to see the Republican party that gave us
the Contract with America. Where did they go? My son
has sworn not to vote til they return. I have found a few
good people--coincidentally Republican and Democrat--
worth voting for, but the major parties are a huge
disappointment.

In following the gun control debate since the 1960s, the
Democratic National Party has made GC an article of
dogma to the point of blindness, even though local
Democrats are non-believers in gun control.

Bogus "groups" like AHSA--no membership just a website--
hurt the credibility of the DLC and DNC (OK hurt what
credibility they have).
 
The Dems didn't follow his advice in 2004; but they seem to be following it now...
No, they DID follow his advice in 2004. To the letter.

Kerry followed his advice like a script, as did a number of other national Dems. Talk up guns for hunting, say you support the second amendment, and fight tooth and nail to outlaw "assault weapons." The DLC even went so far as to yank Kerry and Edwards off the campaign trail on Super Tuesday to vote for S.1431 (same as H.R.1022 currently).

It bombed, badly.

There is currently a bit of a schism within the Democratic party on the topic. On the one hand, you have new faces like Webb, Tester, Strickland, Casey, Hackett, etc. who tend to be genuinely pro-RKBA, and an authoritarian old guard like Feinstein et al. That war is still being fought. But the AGS approach seems to be pretty much dead, like AGS itself.

(Visit http://www.americansforgunsafety.com for a ray of hope...)
 
I wonder what James Webb thinks of todays events in Roanoke? His name and address were on the list. It might give him a fresh perspective.

Edit: That was a little unclear. He has made no secret of his carry but no one wants to think of themselves as on a list.
 
NRA, CCRKBA< SAF and GOA

have been warning about AGS and similar groups (e.g. AHSA) for years now. There are no secrets out there. After AGS's cover was blown, AHSA was supposed to inherit the "reasonable, common sense gun control supported by gun owners" mantle.

In testimony in Olympia, WA, on February 8th, AHSA executive director Bob Ricker (turncoat NRA and CCRKBA lobbyist) noted that only four million of 70 million gun owners belonged to the NRA, implying that the remaining 66 million supported AHSA's legislative program.

Jonathan Cowan, Bob Ricker and others of their ilk are slick manipulators who will use apathetic, uninvolved ("I don;t want to get political") gun owners for their own ends.

Unfortunately we're preaching to the choir here.
 
Yes I am curious about Webb also. I read a nice essay of his on Vietnam, earned my respect at least there, but I dont know his 2A stance.

This essay (the above, not the web thing) makes for an interesting point - could the 'Gun Control' issue become so small in the D party that in 10 years it could effectively be drown in the bathtub? Let's hope.

(sorry about the compromise thread, I feel like a joker for it)
 
benEzra said:
There is currently a bit of a schism within the Democratic party on the topic. On the one hand, you have new faces like Webb, Tester, Strickland, Casey, Hackett, etc. who tend to be genuinely pro-RKBA, and an authoritarian old guard like Feinstein et al. That war is still being fought. But the AGS approach seems to be pretty much dead, like AGS itself.

Thanks for the update benEzra. I know you do a lot of good work as far as teaching Democrats about the real meaning of the Second Amendment as opposed to Cowan's piece here.

The thing that concerns me about Cowan's piece is his talk that "you don't have to abandon your base" (i.e. you can still try and pass gun control) and the part about "Remember, Democrats don't have to carry every gun owner. They don't even have to carry a majority of gun owners... If Democrats make small, not even huge, small inroads into gun owners, the whole table shifts..."

Cowan seems to acknowledge his approach won't fool all gun owners or even most gun owners; but it will fool enough to allow them to continue to pursue strategies like AWB renewal, etc.

I'd be interested in hearing your opinion about the schism in the Democratic party. I don't think the NRAs intertwining with the Republican party is necessarily healthy for RKBA and I would like to see the return of pro-RKBA Democrats; but they need to be stronger than the pre-1994 Democrats that folded on us at a critical moment.
 
renewing the assault weapons ban -- very basic, sensible policies that have wide support that are also good and effective gun policy.

BZZZZT! You lose. Thank you for playing. Even Bill Clinton gets that gun control causes Democrats to lose, lose, lose.

"The fights I fought... cost a lot --the fight for the assault-weapons ban cost 20 members their seats in Congress." --William Jefferson Clinton
 
How deliciously ironic it is that when the Democrats followed the exact strategy that Cowan told them not to follow (ignore the gun issue altogether), they clobbered the Republicans in elections nationwide.
 
As a side-note about some of the money behind this, Andrew McKelvey has been involved in several anti-2a events, foundations, and campaigning. Last month he resigned from his CEO position at monster.com over a stock options back-dating scandal. Just a little more ad hominem ammo against anti-2a organizations.
 
This is no "middle road". It's the usual "we'll let you keep your hunting guns" fake and fraudulent excuse for a "compromise" these idiots always "offer". And to which I will ALWAYS say NAY!

This under-educated, overpaid fool just doesn't get it through his head...

The Second Amendment is NOT about hunting or "sporting purposes", whatever that silly term means this week. It's about dropping an american Hitler BEFORE he kills millions, it's about defending your home, family, and freedom from those who threaten them.

Until he gets that through his fat head, there isn't even grounds for discussion.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top