Jake 98c/11b
Member
I had an interesting occurrence at work recently and since I am on the management staff of a shooting range we do have some very interesting days. On this day a very pleasant and personable lady came into the shop with her grandfathers gun. Her grandfather, a WWII combat veteran, had recently passed away and she found his gun among his belongings. She said that she had remembered seeing it around the house over the years and never gave it a second thought, she had assumed that it was simply a non-functional display piece. She brought it in to see if it was worth anything, none of the family had expressed any interest in it I suppose. As soon as she pulled it out of the case it was obviously a US issue M3 .45 ACP submachinegun. The wartime finish was a bit thin but it was in remarkably good shape with only a little bit of surface rust and that was easily removed. We stuffed ten rounds into the one magazine she had with the gun and took it onto the range to see if it functioned or if it had been rendered inoperable as a war trophy (there were few if any standards for deactivating war trophies at the wars end) and it functioned just as it was designed to all those years ago. We gave her the short version of the applicable gun laws and explained the artificial market value involving machineguns, that it is possible for four guns made on the same day, at the same plant, by the same worker could have four different values. One could be a transferable gun (can be transferred to any eligible individual) worth between $10,000 and $14,000, the second could be a pre 86 dealers sample (freely transferred among licensed dealers) and worth about $7,000, the third could be a post 86 dealers sample (transferred to licensed dealers only with a request from a government agency for demonstration) worth only about $400-1,000, the fourth could be contraband and worth only a prison sentence of ten years and a fine up to $250,000. Saying that she was not cut out for prison life we looked at other options.
She was somewhat bothered with the fact that her grandfather may have stolen the gun at the end of the war and I told her that it was not all that uncommon for commanders to turn a blind eye to these things. A soldier may have lived through years of war with only his weapon and his fellow soldiers to keep him safe, at wars end he returns to his home and separates from those whom he has come to rely on over the years and his only tangible link to his war years and the friends he made there is his weapon. Some soldiers come to rely on their weapon to the point that it becomes a very strong part of their lives, in some respect it is their life because they know that without it and those carried by other soldiers their life is forfeit. A weapon gives the soldier the ability to influence the fighting around him and even among soldiers who are never called to fire it in combat it is an item of comfort that allows them to continue in spite of the fear they may feel. It allows him to take solace in the fact that whatever may come, he has the means to take care of himself or at least ‘give as well as he gets’. Some commanders knew this and turned a blind eye, allowing some soldiers to keep their issue weapon. This old soldier, one of Americas greatest generation, returned home with his trusty .45 submachinegun. The same weapon he used in the fight against one of the greatest evils of mankind, a weapon like many others that was used to liberate the world from an outside tyranny (often so a homegrown tyrant could take it’s place). With his return to civilian life he kept the weapon that had become a fixture of his life and it became a fixture around his home, his granddaughter said she remembered seeing it several times over the years (always assuming it to be deactivated). I would like to think that that old veteran may have loaded it a time or two during the civil rights era, that would have been one old black gentleman who would have been more than a match for a half dozen hate filled bigots trying to enforce their worldview on others. She and I spoke at some length and discussed her options, we were able to find a lawyer who will look into the issue and see if the weapon was registered during the 1968 amnesty (making it worth 10,000 or more) or if it is a contraband. If it is not on the NFA registry I offered to help her find a museum that she could donate it to as a historic relic, she liked the idea of it being on display and listed as being donated in the family name. If all else fails I will look into the possibility of destroying the receiver and finding a buyer for the rest of the parts, at least that way she can recover a few hundred dollars and a collector can extend the life of a registered curio and relic so a small piece of the history can live on and help to educate another generation of the sacrifice our citizens made to win the war.
As she was thanking me and packing her things to leave I asked if she would be interested in shooting her grandfathers gun, judging by her reaction I can only assume that she never considered the possibility before my mentioning it and she jumped at the chance. After a few minutes of safety instruction (interrupted briefly by a uniformed local police officer who wanted to look at the historic relic on the table) we went onto the range with one loaded magazine and she was able to share one more experience with her late grandfather. As she finished, another customer, who had taken notice of this lady and her machinegun, asked what kind of gun it was. As best I recall her reply, with perfect nonchalance, was “My machinegun, doesn’t everyone have one? Where have you been?†and she walked off the range as if nothing special had taken place.
This was the fourth war trophy that I have seen in the last ten years or so, usually after the death of a family member someone will find the gun in the attic or the back of a closet where it spent the last fifty some years. After explaining the law and the options open to them I tell them of legislation introduced a few years ago that would allow veterans and their heirs to register war-trophies recovered in WWII, Korea and Vietnam. Few soldiers knew it was legal to do that then or register them during the 68 amnesty and it would give them and their family a chance to keep a piece of their family history intact without threat of persecution from the same government they served honorably.
I sent this to the lady involved asking for any added details and asking if she would mind if I were to share this and her reply follows.
Jake:
Your recollection of my visit to your gun store was truly an experience to remember. Your letter made me, a person who has never had two thoughts about guns, except negative thoughts generated from the stories I hear from our youth, gangs and violence, enable me to think of guns in a whole new way. As you stated in your letter, this submachine gun played a huge role in protecting and comforting our nation's protectors.
Although I understand the role of 68 Amnesty Law, it is very unfortunate that it takes away my rights to do as I please with my families property. I am very interested in donating this firearm to a local museum. Could I receive a tax right off for the donation?
Please move forward with publishing our encounter from last Friday but I would prefer to remain anonymous. Again, my experience at your gun store and range was one of the best experiences I have ever had. I can not express in words how much I appreciated you taking the time to educate me on the laws and regulations of gun selling, allowing me to experience shooting the gun ( something I have never ever dreamed of doing) and giving me "sincere" advice on my options. I never thought that I would be an advocate for responsible gun ownership and activity but, I am now!
Please keep me informed on our next step with regards to me turning it over to a museum.
Thanks Jake!
I would like to add that the BATFs own estimate from about 10 years ago was that for each of the roughly 200,000 NFA items (machine guns, silencers, destructive devices, etc.) legally owned in the US there are an estimated 10 that are owned illegally (over 2 million). If the people at the Brady Campaign or the Violence Policy Center (or other gun control groups) were to be believed then we would be hip deep in bodies right now. Truth is that many of the ‘illegal’ guns are, like the one above, in the hands of our veterans and their children. Many of the rest were created by machinists, mechanics and hobbyists (otherwise decent, law abiding people) who have made one or two just to see if they could. Very few are in the hands of hardcore criminals or fringe groups.
If the ATF assessment is correct than with over 2 million unregistered NFA items in the hands of 270 million Americans, that means one per 135 people (man, woman and child). Chances are that you know someone with something in the back of the closet that they just don’t talk about.
She was somewhat bothered with the fact that her grandfather may have stolen the gun at the end of the war and I told her that it was not all that uncommon for commanders to turn a blind eye to these things. A soldier may have lived through years of war with only his weapon and his fellow soldiers to keep him safe, at wars end he returns to his home and separates from those whom he has come to rely on over the years and his only tangible link to his war years and the friends he made there is his weapon. Some soldiers come to rely on their weapon to the point that it becomes a very strong part of their lives, in some respect it is their life because they know that without it and those carried by other soldiers their life is forfeit. A weapon gives the soldier the ability to influence the fighting around him and even among soldiers who are never called to fire it in combat it is an item of comfort that allows them to continue in spite of the fear they may feel. It allows him to take solace in the fact that whatever may come, he has the means to take care of himself or at least ‘give as well as he gets’. Some commanders knew this and turned a blind eye, allowing some soldiers to keep their issue weapon. This old soldier, one of Americas greatest generation, returned home with his trusty .45 submachinegun. The same weapon he used in the fight against one of the greatest evils of mankind, a weapon like many others that was used to liberate the world from an outside tyranny (often so a homegrown tyrant could take it’s place). With his return to civilian life he kept the weapon that had become a fixture of his life and it became a fixture around his home, his granddaughter said she remembered seeing it several times over the years (always assuming it to be deactivated). I would like to think that that old veteran may have loaded it a time or two during the civil rights era, that would have been one old black gentleman who would have been more than a match for a half dozen hate filled bigots trying to enforce their worldview on others. She and I spoke at some length and discussed her options, we were able to find a lawyer who will look into the issue and see if the weapon was registered during the 1968 amnesty (making it worth 10,000 or more) or if it is a contraband. If it is not on the NFA registry I offered to help her find a museum that she could donate it to as a historic relic, she liked the idea of it being on display and listed as being donated in the family name. If all else fails I will look into the possibility of destroying the receiver and finding a buyer for the rest of the parts, at least that way she can recover a few hundred dollars and a collector can extend the life of a registered curio and relic so a small piece of the history can live on and help to educate another generation of the sacrifice our citizens made to win the war.
As she was thanking me and packing her things to leave I asked if she would be interested in shooting her grandfathers gun, judging by her reaction I can only assume that she never considered the possibility before my mentioning it and she jumped at the chance. After a few minutes of safety instruction (interrupted briefly by a uniformed local police officer who wanted to look at the historic relic on the table) we went onto the range with one loaded magazine and she was able to share one more experience with her late grandfather. As she finished, another customer, who had taken notice of this lady and her machinegun, asked what kind of gun it was. As best I recall her reply, with perfect nonchalance, was “My machinegun, doesn’t everyone have one? Where have you been?†and she walked off the range as if nothing special had taken place.
This was the fourth war trophy that I have seen in the last ten years or so, usually after the death of a family member someone will find the gun in the attic or the back of a closet where it spent the last fifty some years. After explaining the law and the options open to them I tell them of legislation introduced a few years ago that would allow veterans and their heirs to register war-trophies recovered in WWII, Korea and Vietnam. Few soldiers knew it was legal to do that then or register them during the 68 amnesty and it would give them and their family a chance to keep a piece of their family history intact without threat of persecution from the same government they served honorably.
I sent this to the lady involved asking for any added details and asking if she would mind if I were to share this and her reply follows.
Jake:
Your recollection of my visit to your gun store was truly an experience to remember. Your letter made me, a person who has never had two thoughts about guns, except negative thoughts generated from the stories I hear from our youth, gangs and violence, enable me to think of guns in a whole new way. As you stated in your letter, this submachine gun played a huge role in protecting and comforting our nation's protectors.
Although I understand the role of 68 Amnesty Law, it is very unfortunate that it takes away my rights to do as I please with my families property. I am very interested in donating this firearm to a local museum. Could I receive a tax right off for the donation?
Please move forward with publishing our encounter from last Friday but I would prefer to remain anonymous. Again, my experience at your gun store and range was one of the best experiences I have ever had. I can not express in words how much I appreciated you taking the time to educate me on the laws and regulations of gun selling, allowing me to experience shooting the gun ( something I have never ever dreamed of doing) and giving me "sincere" advice on my options. I never thought that I would be an advocate for responsible gun ownership and activity but, I am now!
Please keep me informed on our next step with regards to me turning it over to a museum.
Thanks Jake!
I would like to add that the BATFs own estimate from about 10 years ago was that for each of the roughly 200,000 NFA items (machine guns, silencers, destructive devices, etc.) legally owned in the US there are an estimated 10 that are owned illegally (over 2 million). If the people at the Brady Campaign or the Violence Policy Center (or other gun control groups) were to be believed then we would be hip deep in bodies right now. Truth is that many of the ‘illegal’ guns are, like the one above, in the hands of our veterans and their children. Many of the rest were created by machinists, mechanics and hobbyists (otherwise decent, law abiding people) who have made one or two just to see if they could. Very few are in the hands of hardcore criminals or fringe groups.
If the ATF assessment is correct than with over 2 million unregistered NFA items in the hands of 270 million Americans, that means one per 135 people (man, woman and child). Chances are that you know someone with something in the back of the closet that they just don’t talk about.
