Just saw the ad in Shotgun News for... (WARNING-NSFW)

[RazorMan]

BeltSword

Re: Joe Demko; correct the system is designed to miss the front two belt loops. I have not had any problem missing the front loops and keeping the belt in place. I would guess (no guarantees) that your duty belt should stay at or about your waist without any upward movement. The back loops keep the belt in place. With a shorter blade 24” to 29” you will only miss the front left loop and the front right loop may be threaded. This should keep everything in place. The longer the RazorSword the farther to the right side it will go.

Re: Owen you are correct if the handgun is in a typical holster. Place a handgun concealed behind a long sleeve shirt and see if you can deploy it as fast as the BeltSword. In the end it really is who reacts faster…all I know the RazorSword will never jam and never run out of bullets and it is cool.

Re Owen: The idea of any airplane wing cutting a thick steel cable is exactly my point and you proved it for me. Kinetic energy, a rounded steel dull blade will inflict bone crushing injury. I witnessed a 135 small man beat the heck out of a 225 giant. The 135 pound guy was a boxer and the big guy was not. The speed of his little hands beat the big guy. The bottom line, unless you carry a gun everywhere the BeltSword is a very comfortable alternative and one minor hit from this weapon may arrange that meeting with the Almighty. Besides that handgun is so “dog-gone” loud…if I am going to eliminate a bad guy I would rather do it quick and quite...as a ghost.

TrapperReady: There was a pizza delivery person in Milwaukee that was carrying a handgun and shot an attacker. The DA’s office told him if you carry a weapon again we will charge you with CCW. About one year later he again shot an attacker and was subsequently charged with carrying a concealed weapon. It went all the way to the Wisconsin Supreme Court. The court sided with the pizza delivery person. Basically it was his God given right of self preservation. Good call!!!

I believe our founding fathers would laugh at some court telling U.S. citizens that we cannot protect ourselves. My choice; I will obey Gods law and protect my family. If I go to prison…so be it…after all this country was founded upon those that broke the laws of England. I am not saying to become a vigilante.

Never Prey…Never! “To create fear in those that prey upon the fearful.”

You say I could go to prison and lose my freedom…if I surrender to the street thugs, lying politicians, and ridiculous court decisions; I have already lost my freedom. At least this way I will do it on my terms…that is the American way...the American spirit…of have we forgotten.

“From my cold dead hands”

 

[TrapperReady]

Razorman - I also live in WI, and have followed many of the pertinent cases. There's no doubt that things are looking better for us; however, there is also a big grey area where you can be charged.

As I understand things right now, it probably falls into the "positive defense" category, where you probably won't be charged if you are carrying concealed but have to defend yourself. But, we are a long way from being able to legally carry concealed weapons.

Frankly, if I was going to take the risk of carry concealed, I'd opt for something more conventional and proven than a belt sword.

 

[H088]

Could you post a video of the sword being deployed faster, as well as a video of the sword striking objects?

Unless you can hit a target straight on it looks like the sword will bend and the strike will be more of a slap then a slice.

 

[JShirley]

Mr. Koehler and I are talking about this. I assure you I will attempt to cut or otherwise deform targets, and not just slap them to death.

 

[DAVIDSDIVAD]

The material is 1075 or 1095 special tempered and hardened high carbon spring steel. I order about 1.5 miles of steel at a time that is made custom for me at an HRC of 54-57.

So you have each sword shipped to you machined and ready?



Do you do the stock removal on each piece of metal?

 

[Don Gwinn]

Mr. Koehler, keep in mind that we don't allow anyone to advocate illegal activity here. Not that you've exactly advocated anything illegal so far, but I know when I read that bit about how you want to take out criminals "quiet, like a ghost" my first thought was "Now why would that matter?"

Other than that, I'll wait to see what John has to say when he's used the weapon.

 

[RazorMan]

Beltsword Manufacturing

I buy about 1.5 to 2 miles of hardened strip spring steel in coils 1.5 inches wide. It is then shipped to a production facility where it is cut to size, and finished. There is actually no metal reduction; rather just cutting to size and the katana point is cut at a 22 degree angle.

I have spent a lot of time and money on research and equipment like dies to stamp the belts, dies to stamp the containment clips…special made to order barrel nuts and matching screws, etc.

Everything is overbuilt to take a beating. Example: each containment clip is so strong you can stand on it and stamp on it with a boot and not harm it. I am sure if you keep it up for an extended period you may begin to bend it.

Now that I think of it I will run one over with my car and see what happens. The containment clips are tempered spring steel that are attached to the belt and holds the RazorSword in place.

In the end it does not cost that much more to make an incredibility strong product. Most of what I make is from Wisconsin. (We have the best cheese too) I will leave the junk(s) in China.

 

[Brian Dale]

Now that I think of it I will run one over with my car and see what happens.

Hey, that's how I think, too.

I like your style!

Now, I'll encourage everyone to wait on the speculation till I have a chance to wring one of these out. I'll be sure Mr. Koehler is okay with me actually using this on stuff before I receive one.

John, I'm guessing that he's going to say Yes.

 

[RyanM]

Just a couple off-the-cuff impressions.

Advertizing is way over-the-top. Excessive hype is one of the reasons why I tend to stay away from Cold Steel products, despite their decent reputation. For an as-yet untested, unproven product, with about 20 times more hype, you can probably imagine my overall impression.

Also, I'd say the price is probably pretty high for your intended market. I realize prices on everything are going up, but you can still get a servicable "real," truly "battle-ready" sword for about $150, maybe a bit less, if you know what manufacturers are good at that price point. And those are swords made out of the same quality material, but considerably more of it, and several times more labor put into them.

I'm not going to pretend to know how much it costs you to make them, and how much you have to charge to keep a roof over your head, but to me, the value of such a product is about $40-50 tops. And that's only if they get decent reviews.

Other than that, the concept doesn't seem that outlandish to me. A thin piece of metal will ruin your day easily, and it looks like they're tempered well enough to not take a set from being wrapped around your waist.

Actual practicality, I'll wait for the review. I might be interested in testing one, actually, if you want the opinion of someone with only minimal training in blade-related martial arts.

 

[JShirley]

Guys,

This is probably going to take a couple of weeks. I will post a new thread as soon as testing can begin.

Peace,

John

 

[AJ Dual]

Involved with the WCCA as I am, and taking a grain of salt, and with the rather large caveat that I am not a lawyer, I would say this definitely would violate Sec 941.23 of WI state law concerning concealed deadly weapons.

And at least with a handgun and an otherwise clean record, it would seem that right now most state DA's are aware of the potential for sending up more pro-carry case law to the State Supreme court and are giving otherwise "clean" violators of 941.23 with handguns the kid-glove treatment.

I think anything perceived as being so off the beaten path as a concealed spring sword in your belt would strip the WI carrier of what tenuous protection he/she has under the current "Supreme Court/Vermont Carry balance of terror", and the actual affirmative defense in the last decision handed down that we currently have in WI.

But I applaud innovation. And with the right marketing to be taken more seriously, you might do well enough to make a profit on your product. Good word of mouth with forums like this is an excellent start. And being willing to engage us as you have is the way to do it.

Best of luck to you.

 

[nwilliams]

Razorman....

Have you taken this concept over to the folks of www.swordforum.com yet? I have been a member over there for almost a decade now and know you'd get a lot of good feedback and maybe some business by some of the members over there. As an avid sword collector for many years I'm always interested in new blades and concepts and I think your idea while extravagant is also very interesting and inventive. If you havent done so yet introduce yourself on the swordfourm site and tell everyone upfront who you are, and what you're all about. Welcome to THR and don't take any negative comments the wrong way, your invention obviously isn't going to appeal to everyone but I think you have a marketable item there and I wish you the best with new product and hope you see some good profits from it!

-Nate

 

[Okiecruffler]

I almost hate to wake this one back up, but I was watching Shanghi Noon yesterday (I'm a Jackie Chan fan, so sue me) and at one point the bad guy pulls a belt sword. Was just wondering if maybe this was one of these belt swords.

 

[Eleven Mike]

Being struck accidentally with the edge of a non-descript piece of sheet metal will split skin and muscle and notch bone. Seen it happen....even if it is just a piece of sheet metal cutinto a vaguely sword-like shape it is capable of inflicting wounds you wouldn't likely just laff off.

I have a scar that can attest to that. Eight stitches.

 

[Devonai]

The RazorSword sharp will cut deeper into ½ inch plywood than a machete or Samurai Sword. Why; because the thin RazorSword has little resistance and the “thick” Samurai gets stuck. (could some Samurai Swords or machetes beat my RazorSword…probably…but not by much)

What your product can do to plywood does not interest me. What I would like to see is your product used in traditional Tameshigiri. Until then put me in the skeptic category.

 

[Landlocked Pirate]

After clicking on the link at work and catching a quick glimpse, can I now assume (too late) that "Not Safe For Work" means "not safe to look at on company computers"?

 

[JShirley]

Curt should be in GA next week. Testing will be for usability and practicality (ie, time/space needed to present).

Testing is tentatively to be held in Statesboro, so Derek can provide photographic proof.

John

 

[Brian Dale]

Cool. Thanks for the update, John.

 

[JShirley]

No problem.

I'm fine with Curt being there, but I didn't tell the specific tests we would do, just so he couldn't bring "ringers" designed especially for certain tasks.

Other than perhaps for short guys with 34" waists and 6' guys with 45" waists!

 

[Brian Dale]

Dude...clarity is all. You mean that the "short guys with 34" waists and 6' guys with 45" waists" will be using the swords, right?

Devonai's "traditional Tameshi giri" reference brought some unpleasant images to mind.

Well, maybe I don't need to know that. I'll wait for your report.

 

[JShirley]

Doh!

Er, yeah. "For use by..."