Kids (legal!) solo hunting leads to woman shot in the head!

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Children, as a class of citizenry, are not capable exercising good judgment, time in and time out.
:fire: that has got to be the stupidest thing I have heard anyone say EVER:cuss:
I had no business on state land, alone and armed with a gun.
That's YOU not the rest of the world's kids you can make the call about you and your family. The rest of us will make the call for ourselves.
Just because someone else has an accident doesn't mean that all kids are incapable of hunting responsibly by themselves. I was shooting and hunting by myself at a early age. I have seen many kids I would trust much more than quite a few adults.
 
that has got to be the stupidest thing I have heard anyone say EVER

If that is the stupidest thing you have ever heard anyone say ever, then I presume you 100% agree with it's logical opposite:

Children ALWAYS have good judgment, every time they make a decision. And presuming you agree that a 14 year old is a child, then you must belive that the 14 year old in this story excercised good judgment when he, hunting in the fog, shot the lady in the head.

I guess that is why children are known for only having to tell them something once, always foreseeing negative consequences to their actions, and exhibiting the peek in rational behavior :rolleyes:
 
Kindrox, you are decending into logical fallacies. In an A/B relationship, just because A is not true, does not mean B is true. This is quite simply silly at best, and intentionally deceptive at worse.

Let's look at your logic:

Adults are capable of exercising good judgment, time in and time out.

Children, as a class of citizenry, are not capable exercising good judgment, time in and time out.

When this statement was challenged, you stated that the ONLY logical alternative would be that Children ALWAYS have good judgment, every time they make a decision, and so because when the youngster "shot the lady in the head" it proves that he was incapable of making good judgment. To quote, you stated that:

that has got to be the stupidest thing I have heard anyone say EVER

in response to

Children, as a class of citizenry, are not capable exercising good judgment, time in and time out.

warranted the logic of

I presume you 100% agree with it's logical opposite:

Children ALWAYS have good judgment, every time they make a decision. And presuming you agree that a 14 year old is a child, then you must belive that the 14 year old in this story excercised good judgment when he, hunting in the fog, shot the lady in the head.

You are claiming that either A or B must be true, therefore setting the reader on the horns of a dilemma of your own making: either they are CAPABLE of making a good decision, or else they are INCAPABLE, and therefore the one bad decision seems to prove that all children are incapable of good decisions.

However, we see this logic disproven in the HUNDREDS of cases where adults shoot others in hunting scenarios with shotguns, bows, and rifles. So, let me take your logic, but flipped, with a story that appeared just a few months ago during bow season:

"Adults ALWAYS have good judgment, every time they make a decision. And presumably one must belive (sic) that the 35 year old in this story excercised (sic) good judgment when he, hunting in deep woods, shot his son in the heart with a broadhead arrow.

And so, somehow, this proves that adults are incapable of good and consistent decision making?

How silly.

If ADULTS were always capable of good judgment, does that mean the logical opposite is that "Adults are always INCAPABLE of bad judgment?" Of course not. We see adults make stupid decisions all the time, and very bright decisions all the time.

To turn the horns of the dilema: both adult and "child" can make stupid decisions, and in hunting scenarios in the real world we see a great deal more examples of bad decisions with adults than we do with children hunters. This might be do to the paucity of child hunters, or perhaps to their care for following orders from adults, but that's another debate. Does this statistic, however, prove that adults are incapable of good decisions? Of course not. Simply that people at times make bad decisions.

A proper approach would be to say that if a youngster has demonstrated good judgment, obedience, and care for the four rules, he can be trusted to exercise good judgment in general when hunting. There is no reason to believe that he will suddenly disregard what he has been taught the moment he is out of sight. This goes for an adult; if, on the other hand, an adult has demonstrated poor judgment, disregard for the rules, and general lack of care, of course one would expect that this would be the pattern with a gun in his hand.

Many many children I've witnessed have a deep and abiding care for the rules set out by their elders, and carefully follow them. Many of them are the safest hunters I've ever seen. I deeply believe that they will continue to act as such, having established a pattern of respect, obedience, and responsibility.

Your argumentation, and quite frankly the more you talk and your use of such logical fallacies convinces me that you are more a troll than in an honest debate. Please use honest argumentation or else be treated accordingly.
 
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Since you have done a deep analysis on the flaws of my flip response to Savages’ silly post, perhaps you could expand on the fallacies of general "pro" position:

1. Some children are generally responsible.
2. Some adults are less responsible then some children.
3. Adults can solo hunt.
4. Therefore it is a good idea for all children to solo hunt.

Now I am sure you will take exception with the wording of #4, is a good idea for all children, but that is the law I am criticizing.
Currently, it is legal for all children to solo hunt in the state of Washington.

I still have not heard a good reason for why the need for solo hunting. Again, I am not asking for dad's hands to be on the gun, just that the child knows dad is around. Don't tell me kids act the same on their own versus dad there. The only real reason given so far is maybe dad is too busy. I bet this kid's dad would now be willing to free up some time.

My guess is many of the people in the strong pro position live in lake wobegon and have extreemly above-average kids. The reality of the situations is probably something less.

I wish I had time for the following experiment. It would be awesome to find out where some of you "pros" hunt, and put up signs "Warning, children hunting unsupervised". And then watch your faces as you drove up, looked at the signs, and then your buddies, and drove away! Priceless when the abstract become your reality!
 
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not saying there shouldnt be an age limit, but would say that most 14 year olds is probably quite capable of hunting solo I know I did and many others that posted did also when they was that age. if it was an adult that shot a person they mistaked for a bear would you of even started this thread?
while unfortuanate, accidents do happen and a law restricting age is not really going to prevent them from happening, a hunter safety course would come closer to helping by teaching hunters to identify there target and be aware of whats behind there target but even that is not enough sometimes.
 
You know, sometimes an accident is just an accident.

Yep, and this ain't one of 'em. An 'accident' that is JUST an accident, implies one where no negligence is involved. This is an "accident" by most definitions of that word, but it's not "just" an accident; but rather one involving negligence; in fact, gross negligence.

I do NOT think this one rises to the level of holding the parent's liable, at all. The result as to the kid is about right here, IMO. He will suffer for life from guilt, since he appears to have a conscience, so no need to lock the boy up for years; he's a kid after all. But there still needs to be formal repercussions for such grossly negligent misidentification.
 
bejay, that's a good closing statement for this four pages. There is another thread now running, so folks who have comments can go to that one.

And hold down the emotions; think twice, post once. :)
 
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