Mr.Revolverguy
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- Feb 24, 2007
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45 SUPER VS 10MM CONCLUSION
I could not leave well enough alone, I have been on a journey with 45Super for a number of years now and it’s all Brett’s fault. Though I have known of 45Super since the inception by Dean Grennell, with assistance from Tom Ferguson and Ace Hindman. It just never received much attention from me because I am a 10MM fan, I mean go figure growing up in South Florida during the Miami Vice Days. Then Brett introduced me to the Springfield V16 and then things got heated.
IS THERE ROOM FOR BOTH 45SUPER AND 10MM IN THE 1911
The 45 Super approaches the power of the 10MM at pressure of 28,000psi compared to the original 45ACP at 21,000 psi max pressure. Both are very capable out of 6in 1911’s.
Tremendous velocity gains dumping a massive amount of energy into the clear ballistics gel because of it. Though there NEVER seems to be a perfect choice, the velocity increased caused the freedom pills to open in a dramatic way. Causing each projectile to self destruct and loose a massive amount of weight. Some ballisticians may call this a total failure on the projectiles part.
230gr 45Super
200gr 10MM
Even with the performance of the 45Super in the Springfield V16, I received a tremendous amount of criticism because of this pistols porting. Many believed porting caused a major loss in velocity therefor minimizing it’s performance in the gel block test.
HERE I GO AGAIN
Where can I find another platform for testing 45Super? Enter the MK23 with a 5.8in barrel it’s close enough and without a doubt strong enough to handle the increased pressures of 45Super.
Springfield V16 Underwood 230gr = Avg Velocity 5 Shots 1109FPS, 36 Extreme Spread, 13 Standard Deviation
H&K Mark 23 Underwood 230gr = Avg Velocity 5 Shots 1151FPS, 13 Extreme Spread, 5 Standard Deviation
By the numbers you can see that the Non Ported Barrel of the Mark 23 turned in on average 56.5FPS more velocity than the ported barrel of the Springfield V16 with the exact same Underwood ammunition.
PUSHING 45SUPER AND 10MM TO THE BRINK OF FAILURE
All of this lead to, if 45Super and 10MM see’s this type of performance. What are they capable of out of a 16inch Carbine. As you can tell it took me a while to find someone who had the right testing carbines. For the 45Super The M1 Thompson, and the Kriss Vector Gen2 for 10MM. We will be using the exact same lot number of ammo as we used in previous tests.
CHRONOGRAPH NUMBERS
We will start with the chronograph numbers
The 45Super out of the Thompson picked up a tremendous amount of velocity of 466fps. The 10MM on the other hand did not benefit as much from the longer barrel only picking up on average 87fps. The gel test told about the same story except in one category, from previous testing with the 45Super achieving greater penetration at 17in and the 10MM at 15in. The freedom pills themselves told a totally different story almost disintegrating, with the massive energy dump the wound track in the gel was huge.
45Super Underwood
45Super Underwood
10MM Underwood
10MM Underwood
The results show with both calibers at these speeds lost a lot weight in the gel 45Super 230gr to 165gr, 10MM 200gr to 150gr. Do you consider this a total failure or acceptable performance of these freedom pills? Especially if you take into consideration gel depth is almost identical across all barrels.
Video Testing
I could not leave well enough alone, I have been on a journey with 45Super for a number of years now and it’s all Brett’s fault. Though I have known of 45Super since the inception by Dean Grennell, with assistance from Tom Ferguson and Ace Hindman. It just never received much attention from me because I am a 10MM fan, I mean go figure growing up in South Florida during the Miami Vice Days. Then Brett introduced me to the Springfield V16 and then things got heated.
IS THERE ROOM FOR BOTH 45SUPER AND 10MM IN THE 1911
The 45 Super approaches the power of the 10MM at pressure of 28,000psi compared to the original 45ACP at 21,000 psi max pressure. Both are very capable out of 6in 1911’s.
Tremendous velocity gains dumping a massive amount of energy into the clear ballistics gel because of it. Though there NEVER seems to be a perfect choice, the velocity increased caused the freedom pills to open in a dramatic way. Causing each projectile to self destruct and loose a massive amount of weight. Some ballisticians may call this a total failure on the projectiles part.
230gr 45Super
200gr 10MM
Even with the performance of the 45Super in the Springfield V16, I received a tremendous amount of criticism because of this pistols porting. Many believed porting caused a major loss in velocity therefor minimizing it’s performance in the gel block test.
HERE I GO AGAIN
Where can I find another platform for testing 45Super? Enter the MK23 with a 5.8in barrel it’s close enough and without a doubt strong enough to handle the increased pressures of 45Super.
Springfield V16 Underwood 230gr = Avg Velocity 5 Shots 1109FPS, 36 Extreme Spread, 13 Standard Deviation
H&K Mark 23 Underwood 230gr = Avg Velocity 5 Shots 1151FPS, 13 Extreme Spread, 5 Standard Deviation
By the numbers you can see that the Non Ported Barrel of the Mark 23 turned in on average 56.5FPS more velocity than the ported barrel of the Springfield V16 with the exact same Underwood ammunition.
PUSHING 45SUPER AND 10MM TO THE BRINK OF FAILURE
All of this lead to, if 45Super and 10MM see’s this type of performance. What are they capable of out of a 16inch Carbine. As you can tell it took me a while to find someone who had the right testing carbines. For the 45Super The M1 Thompson, and the Kriss Vector Gen2 for 10MM. We will be using the exact same lot number of ammo as we used in previous tests.
CHRONOGRAPH NUMBERS
We will start with the chronograph numbers
The 45Super out of the Thompson picked up a tremendous amount of velocity of 466fps. The 10MM on the other hand did not benefit as much from the longer barrel only picking up on average 87fps. The gel test told about the same story except in one category, from previous testing with the 45Super achieving greater penetration at 17in and the 10MM at 15in. The freedom pills themselves told a totally different story almost disintegrating, with the massive energy dump the wound track in the gel was huge.
45Super Underwood
45Super Underwood
10MM Underwood
10MM Underwood
The results show with both calibers at these speeds lost a lot weight in the gel 45Super 230gr to 165gr, 10MM 200gr to 150gr. Do you consider this a total failure or acceptable performance of these freedom pills? Especially if you take into consideration gel depth is almost identical across all barrels.
Video Testing
