Laser on P3AT anyone?

[Bobo]

Your finger must be "IN" the trigger guard. The white area in the photo is the "proximity sensor". Your finger must actually touch the white area. Once the laser comes on it stays on for about 12 seconds and then goes off unless you touch it again.

 

[obxned]

From the results I'm seeing, the Armalaser does indeed seem better than earlier lasers. However, it still adds weight and bulk, and is 1 more thing that can go wrong.

I am happy with the pointability of my gun. Dim light, and I am fine, but total darkness I would be out of luck. However, I can't think of a scenario where I would be caught with the P3AT in total darkness. If it's that dark out and I go walking, I would have a flashlight with blinding brightness.

 

[Bobo]

It adds almost no weight and the very small additional bulk doesn't deter carry one bit. In fact it helps to make it print less like a gun especially in a pocket.

If the laser doesn't work for some reason, guess what - just use the sights or point-shoot like you would anyway.

You don't lose anything with the laser, but it gives you an additional option.

In the end it's sorta like being in love - you don't really know what it's like until you've experienced it.

 

[K-Man]

Quote by Green Lantern:
"So...IS if the Armalaser for $129? That's not too shabby of a deal IMO. Saw the price listed at $155 in a gun mag tonight, and the local dealer is charging in the $160 neighborhood for them.

Still, I dunno if I would or not. The size does not look to make that much of a difference, I do admit that. From a practical standpoint, my #1 question would be "are there any pocket holsters out there to accomodate a Kel-Tyke with the laser?"

---------------------------------------------

The ArmaLaser sells in the neighborhood of $145-$160, depending on where you buy it from.

With respect to the pocket holsters, and other styles of holsters, we offer them at K&D Holsters. We are the ones who make them for ArmaLaser as well. Our holsters are leather, and we plan on coming out with a kydex pocket holster version in the not too distant future. Grandfather Oak currently offers kydex pocket holsters.

We are a dealer/seller of the ArmaLaser as well. If you order both the ArmaLaser and the holster from us, we extend a discount and your wait time is reduced by more than half the normal wait time.

 

[Xanthus]

What about the Pocket Slipper.

I hear and understand the make it lighter thing, but this will allow it to sit right in your pocket and when in your pocket give it a square profile.

This DOES have me asking around if the ATF may have the brilliant idea to call it an AOW, but well any logical reasons not to are useless as the arbitrary nature of gun laws in this country is insane.

Anyone have any experience with this?

 

[M2 Carbine]

What about the Pocket Slipper.

Since the ARMA laser came out my "Pocket Slipper" has been in the spare parts box.


Recently I've been doing a lot of practice with a Crimson Trace equipped Beretta Mod 21A 22LR.
At first it seems foolish to use a laser that costs more than the gun, especially since the gun doesn't double as a defense gun, but the laser has already paid for itself in the cost savings of center fire ammo.

 

[Xanthus]

Any word on an official "no this is not an AOW" from any law enforcement agency?

I agree there are far better sights out there, further I do not use lasers on anything else. I like that it sits it upright in my pocket nicely.

That Arma one does seem quite nice.

 

[rsteward34]

Bad News - Stay Away

I spent many hours studying the Armalaser and comparing it to other solutions out there, and thought it to be the best choice. I ordered an Armalaser for my new P3AT in late May. It arrived the first week of June. I still haven't fired the gun, wanting to get the new sighting system installed before having to pop off several boxes of ammo to learn how to aim it. Now it's late July.

The Armalaser for P3AT has a serious design flaw that the company will not acknowledge or address. The bracket system that is supposed to hold the laser on the gun is mismatched to the pins that go through the unit and through the pistol. It requires several hundred pounds of force to press the pins through the bracket, an assembly step that should be done before shipping it to the customer. A machine shop quoted me $150 to build a special plate to hold the bracket while pressing the pins through so that the bracket and pins aren't damaged by all the pressure necessary. That's more than the Armalaser costs new!

Last week, after waiting a week for a reply, Rick at Armalaser promised that a technician would call me to discuss the problem and make suggestions about how to attach it to a P3AT without damage. A week later, and still nothing. Gun dealers I have since spoken to recommend against installing an Armalaser on a P3AT or P32 because the potential to damage the pistol. KelTec does not support their use either.

I've been a gun lover for 35 years, and this is without a doubt the worst misrepresentation of a product I have ever seen. Do yourself a favor and forget about Armalaser as a viable solution for laser sighting. I cannot recommend any other laser sight for the P3AT, but I can say for sure that this one is definitely not something you want to mess with.

 

[kanewpadle]

Just my 2 cents. My P3AT is a second gun/BUG. Certainly not a primary gun. It is meant for up close and personal use. Some call them "get off me" guns. I don't see any advantage of a laser at this range. It defeats the purpose and the gun becomes a little bulkier and heavier.

I have nothing against lasers. I own two of them. If you draw your laser equipped gun in self defense, waiting for that red dot to appear on the bad guy is slower than using the front sight and a real bad idea. They have their place. But they are useless when drawing from the holster.

 

[oak1971]

It is not hard to learn how to shoot instinctively (point shoot). I can do it with my 1911 and Sig's. Including my Sig 232 in 380. Just practice.

 

[oak1971]

No offense, but that looks like a mismatched set of Lego's.

 

[kanewpadle]

It is not hard to learn how to shoot instinctively (point shoot). I can do it with my 1911 and Sig's. Including my Sig 232 in 380. Just practice.

Deliberate, aimed fire through proper sight alignment will always beat point shooting. But then again, this thread is about lasers.

 

[oak1971]

Depends on how good a point shooter you become. I am better with sights. But at 7 yards I can put em all in a fist size group point shooting. Not for everyone, but I like to train for every scenario. Delta Force guys don't use sights they are trained to point shoot at head size targets. They don't miss either.

 

[HisSoldier]

My opinion became clear after installing an Armalaser on mine. The laser is a good idea (Maybe) on a single action with a good trigger, like a 1911, but my experience was that the forces used to fire double action made holding the dot on the target impossible, at least for me. As for another aspect, the effect of a laser on a BG's chest, that wasn't a factor in coming to my opinion, it was based purely on my demonstrated ability to shoot mine more accurately using the sights than the laser. Actually the results surprised me quite a lot. Others may have different results.

 

[tkopp]

I like the idea of the laser, if only because of the long uneven draw of the p3at. I typically draw most of the way, 'stage' the trigger, then let it loose. Would be nice to just know where my barrel was pointed all the way through.

On the mismatched set of legos -- yes? You could say the same of an AR15. These aren't range guns, fun guns, or high-dollar 'quality' weapons. These are relatively inexpensive working guns. Tacking on some extras may get you in the same size range as another weapon, but *you* will have chosen each and every option to best fit *your* needs. If the stock weapon works for you, congrats. I wrapped the handle of mine in some cloth tape and cut down a hogue grip to slip on. Looks terrible, feels great. Laugh at me if you like, but it makes me happy

EDIT:

It's worth noting that if you order the armalaser direct from the manufacturer they throw in a fitted desantis pocket holster. If you want something fancier they have a whole line of fitted holsters on their web site.

 

[kanewpadle]

Depends on how good a point shooter you become. I am better with sights. But at 7 yards I can put em all in a fist size group point shooting. Not for everyone, but I like to train for every scenario. Delta Force guys don't use sights they are trained to point shoot at head size targets. They don't miss either.

We ain't in Dodge City and you ain't Bill Hickock.

 

[Claude Clay]

waste of $$

use the bucks to get a lee press and dies--make ammo to practice till your eyes see it & the bullet goes there,

practice & good luck

 

[SwampWolf]

I agree with what some posters have already opined; the only reason I see for someone to carry a small, light and compact .380 (like the KelTec 3AT and the Ruger LCP) for self-defense purposes is because some climate/social circumstances limit one's mode of dress options, making the "small, light and compact" advantages especially relevant. Adding a laser sight compromises the very reasons I would carry a "mouse gun" in the first place.

 

[kanewpadle]

That was my point too. Only you said it better.

 

[stonehenge69]

Maybe I'm slow, but I don't see a single down side to adding a laser to a pocket gun that would probably be used only under stressful, adrenaline filled situations.

 

[oak1971]

"We ain't in Dodge City and you ain't Bill Hickock."

Never said I was. I said I can hit with decent accuracy without sights or lasers. At the range most attacks occur, that would be a heart lung shot every time. Not going to have many long range shoot outs in a urban area too much risk of hitting bystanders. Whatever, think what you will.

 

[kanewpadle]

"We ain't in Dodge City and you ain't Bill Hickock."

Never said I was. I said I can hit with decent accuracy without sights or lasers. At the range most attacks occur, that would be a heart lung shot every time. Not going to have many long range shoot outs in a urban area too much risk of hitting bystanders. Whatever, think what you will.

Very true. So why do we need a laser on a pocket gun?

We don't.

 

[PT1911]

how bout the confidence factor of the laser... or the deterrent factor that that little red dot can be (friends can testify to such.) I see no reason to not put it on a gun (especially pocket gun) that is more difficult to shoot. or how bout low light conditions? pull your kel tec or (insert pocket pistol here) in darkness and see if you can hit your intended target (accurately)...I think not... that little dot can make a huge difference...

or how bout this scenario... run, get your heart rate up.... then draw your gun from your handy dandy pocket holster and put your rounds in the 10 circle in any sort of timely manner... you will find that little dot helps a lot...

 

[kanewpadle]

how bout the confidence factor of the laser... or the deterrent factor that that little red dot can be (friends can testify to such.) I see no reason to not put it on a gun (especially pocket gun) that is more difficult to shoot. or how bout low light conditions? pull your kel tec or (insert pocket pistol here) in darkness and see if you can hit your intended target (accurately)...I think not... that little dot can make a huge difference...

or how bout this scenario... run, get your heart rate up.... then draw your gun from your handy dandy pocket holster and put your rounds in the 10 circle in any sort of timely manner... you will find that little dot helps a lot...

One should not have to rely on a little red dot for confidence.

Deterrent? Nonsense. A determined attacker isn't looking for a red dot on his chest. He's looking at YOU.

A laser can help in certain situations. But most people buy them and expect them to solve all thier problems. They expect to be able to hit anything they put the dot on. They don't bother to learn basic marksmanship first.

At bad breath range a laser is useless. Pocket guns such as the Kel Tec are designed to be used at extremely close range and very fast. It's for when you think or know your about to be grabbed, stuck, struck etc.............. You point the gun in your attackers direction and empty the gun. You don't have time for a laser to come into view. It just might be your luck that the battery dies right when you need it.

Like I said before, a laser can help. But you will have to know in which situations a laser can help. Train and practice with the laser for those situations. Go to the range and shoot with and without the laser. But remember a laser isn't not a cure all and not for all self defense situations.

 

[PT1911]

Confidence that your shot is going where you want it...assuming you trained accordingly... no doubt that training is the most important thing the laser is just another tool... and on a small gun, it is an invaluable tool... it stretches the accuracy range of the small gun to that of a midsize or larger depending on its user.. (dont pull the balistics or I should be able to shoot a plate at 100 yards with any gun... not the point)

I have several friends who were saved from fireing their gun because the BG saw a laser tracing up his leg and high stepped the other direction. MOST BG's are cowards who are taking advantage of a situation they perceive someone as vulnerable...the moment their little bubble of confidence is burst they want out.

it you wait for someone to grab hold of you before you shoot your gun you likely just lost.

I dont understand the logic of waiting for the BG to get close... would you do the same with a full size 1911 or Glock? if a BG is coming at me with intent to do me harm or worse I am not going to wait for 10 feet or less... Optimally, warn, pull, (warn...some would say) and shoot...