LCP vs P380

[beag_nut]

I have searched, but couldn't find a head-to-head match up.
REGARDLESS OF PRICE (and I know the difference), which is preferred by people who have owned BOTH the Ruger LCP and the Kahr P380?
You don't have to still own them, but I am searching for the differences between the two handguns, as noted by shooters who have extensive experience with both. Perhaps we could throw in the experience of a range officer or similiar person.
Criteria should include the feel of the actions (especially triggers), magazines and releases, slides and their features, but most of all reliability with various ammo's.
My local range has a P380 to rent (which I will do), but no one I know has a LCP to rent or borrow. I know some regard these as "limp-wristed girlie guns", but I am looking for a reliable BUG. No other models or makes should be mentioned, please.
Thanks ahead of time.

 

[LightningMan]

I have both, and a few others, but for me there is no question that the Kahr P380 is a better pocket pistol. Better sights, better trigger, and has a slide lock. The first two, reasons is probably why I can shoot it much better, and the slide lock will let you know when it's time to reload. The only plus I will give to the LCP is it will shoot that crappy steel cased ammo like TulAmmo or Wolf, which is the only stuff my P380 doesn't like, otherwise they both will shoot anything else. LM

 

[beag_nut]

Thanks, LM.

 

[JN01]

I had a LCP and currently own a P380. The Kahr is much easier to shoot- vastly superior trigger, decent sights, and less felt recoil. My LCP seemed to want to stovepipe fairly regularly also.

The Kahr did require minor tweaking to avoid the slide from prematurely locking back when using Gold Dots, but wasn't really a big deal to fix. It seems a lot of the tiny autos have their own quirks, but luckily most have brand specific forums that help to address those problems. I wouldn't rate any of them as reliable as slightly larger (Kahr 9mm, M&P compacts, etc) pistols, however.

 

[dogtown tom]

I've had both.

Without a doubt the Kahr P380 is the class of the micro .380's.
It has the best sights and the best trigger hands down.

BUT.......

I firmly believe the best value is the LCP.
For a "belly gun" that will most likely be used at less than 15' the sights and trigger of the LCP are perfectly adequate.....at $200 less.

 

[LightningMan]

Oh I forgot to mention, the P380 is rated for the hot stuff like Buffalo Bore ammo and the LCP is not. LM

 

[dogtown tom]

LightningMan Oh I forgot to mention, the P380 is rated for the hot stuff like Buffalo Bore ammo and the LCP is not. LM

Not exactly.

The "Q&A" on the Kahr factory website refers to SAMMI specs.....and SAMMI has no spec for .380 +P ammunition. This Q&A answer was in place prior to Kahr introducing the P380 and refers to 9mm & .45acp.

The owners manual for the P380 makes no mention of it being rated for "+P" .380.

While the P380 might be perfectly safe with Buffalo Bore it is most definitely NOT "rated" for it. As there is no SAMMI spec for +P .380, any manufacturer who says their gun is fine with it is dancing in a minefield.

 

[heeler]

Beag nut,if you have not yet been over to www.kahrtalk.com I am sure a lot of those guys over there have or also own both the P380 and the LCP.
As an owner of a PM9 I gave great consideration around a year ago to buying a P380 even though it was as mentioned at least $200 more than the LCP.
Unfortunately it was on that very forum that I kept repeatedly reading of owner after the owner having to send their P380 back to Kahr for repairs and some of these went back several times.
After my disaster of owning a Diamondback 380 I did not want to take the risk of paying that much money and getting another disaster.
I chose the LCP which has been 100% using all sorts of fmj and hollow point ammunition and I like it so much and was so impressed with it I bought another new LCP two weeks ago.
I certainly like the Kahr and maybe by now they have worked out all the issues on it.
Fwiw my PM9 has been flawless.
Good luck.

 

[beag_nut]

I do go to the kahr forum a few times a week. I started out with my query in this forum (THR) because I thought there would be fewer vested interests in this particular subject, and therefore at least some more honesty.
Your responses so far have been very helpful, and somewhat expected, considering the extra cost of the kahr. HOWEVER, the post by heeler is very interesting.
Thanks again, and if there are any more contributions, I'm all ears.

- beag_nut (I'm a nut for beagles)

 

[bhk]

My P380 is flawless. I have not owned a LCP, but did own the almost identical Keltec for a period of time. The P380 is MUCH easier to shoot well.

 

[CougarRed]

Hi

After a lot of research, I chose to buy a LCP today over the P380 or soon to be released CW380.

I have owned several Kahrs, and have a P9 Covert that I really like. I was looking for a lighter pistol, decided that .380 was the solution.

I test fired a P380 at the range and liked it, but I got spooked after reading too many horror stories about P380 reliability.

I have not shot the LCP yet, but I know it's an improved version of the proven KelTec P3AT design. After 4 years of production, the LCP seems to have worked the kinks out.

My LCP is the 2013 version with improved sights and trigger. For more info:

See this video

Also on the way are:

1. Hogue Hybrid grip sleeve
2. Galloway guide rod & 13 lb recoil spring

My research indicates these upgrades will soften the recoil.

I plan to paint my sights with dayglo yellow in front, and maybe dayglo orange in back. If that doesn't work, I might try nitesiters.

I'm looking into a Uncle George wallet holster and a variety of front pocket holsters.

After studying various ballistics tests (including the wonderful Mousegun blog) I am leaning towards standard pressure flat nose FMJ/Hardcast. Either Winchester white box, Remington UMC Leadless or Buffalo Bore.

I hope to be able to hit the range within 14 days. I'll try to post pics.

 

[g_one]

I don't own and have never shot a P380, so I can't speak for that one.

I do own an LCP and carry it anytime I'm not sleeping, so I can speak for it. In my opinion, it is the perfect balance between small enough to comfortably fit in your pocket 24/7, but big enough to handle the .380 comfortably. I started off with a G26 but it was just too big for pocket carry, so I had to IWB it - but IWB isn't really comfortable for a man of my... erm... stature (overweight, all love handles and no hips), and when I switched to the LCP I could not have been happier. I carry Hornady Critical Defense in it, as (again, my opinion only) something as light and weak (relatively speaking) as a 380 needs Critical Defense for SD rounds. Any other SD round probably works just fine.

There is one thing that I cannot recommend strongly enough, and that is the Hogue grip cover for it. It adds just enough width in the palm swells to make the gun SO much more comfortable to shoot, but it doesn't make it so wide that it doesn't fit in your pocket anymore. It actually mounts directly to the frame so it doesn't wiggle at all and you never have to worry about it coming off.

I clean it with CLP and keep the rails lubed with Mystik automotive grease.

 

[CougarRed]

Thanks G-One

There's an age old debate on 380 ammo re: JHP expansion/penetration vs. FMJ.

I have seen some excellent gel tests for the Hornady CD 380 round in terms of penetration and expansion. I can understand why people like the round.

The one test that scared me off the round was this video. The round could not penetrate bone.

I was very intrigued by MouseGunAddict's test of various FMJ rounds. It seems standard pressure flat nose bullets which tumble can leave quite a stretch cavity.

As I understand it, Ruger advises against "hot" loads in the LCP, but these standard pressure flat nose rounds should be fine.

 

[wnycollector]

I own an LCP. Mine has been flawless in 500+ rounds. I added the hogue grip sleeve and the factory seven round mags so that I can get a nice solid two finger grip on the little sucker I'm carrying WWB fmj flat points in it. That being said, I just picked up a Kahr CW45 and really like that, so when the CW380 comes out, I may just have to add another micro 380 to the stable.

 

[orionengnr]

I've had two LCPs, both of which worked perfectly. (Also, two KelTec P3ATs, neither of which ever worked correctly, despite a lot of time, effort and expense).

Nonetheless, I recently sold my most recent LCP. I am waiting on a Kahr CW380, which I put on order.

 

[pinehtr]

In kahr Q&A , kahr pistols are + p rated.

 

[kokapelli]

In kahr Q&A , kahr pistols are + p rated.

Can you show me where Kahr rates the P380 for +P?

 

[CZguy]

I own both a Ruger LCP, and a Kahr P380. I carried the LCP for several years, and was pleased with it except for the sights and trigger. After having a chance to shoot a P380, I liked it so much that I bought one and put night sights on it. It's shoots similar to the LCP with the exception of felt recoil, and accuracy.

I think that the LCP is capable of remarkable accuracy, if it's shot off of a rest, and you really concentrate on the sights and trigger. But with the P380, it's easy to be a good shot with it, and at extended ranges too. I usually finish up my weekly session by shooting a couple of magazines at a metal silhouette at fifty yards.

I realize that has nothing to do with self defense, but it sure is fun.

The P380 is pretty darn expensive, so the CW380 might be the way to go.

 

[CougarRed]

Nonetheless, I recently sold my most recent LCP. I am waiting on a Kahr CW380, which I put on order.

I think this is EXACTLY the reason why Ruger improved the trigger and sights on the Gen 2 LCP: price competition from the CW380.

Here's a better video showing the LCP improvements. The trigger pull is shorter and breaks sooner. The sights are almost identical to the Rohrbaugh.

 

[CougarRed]

To follow up, here are my range reports for the LCP.

 

[orionengnr]

In kahr Q&A , kahr pistols are + p rated.

Go back and read post #7. And in the future, before posting, it helps to read the previous posts. Especially if there are only a handful.

 

[WRGADog]

I have owned my P380 since their introduction and the gun has performed superbly. I have shot an LCP, but do not own one. The Kahr trigger is far superior to the LCP as are the sights.

 

[SwampWolf]

I've never shot a P380 but I own and shoot the LCP. Mine has been 100% reliable-the first consideration for any pistol intended for self-defense.

 

[CougarRed]

I have owned my P380 since their introduction and the gun has performed superbly. I have shot an LCP, but do not own one. The Kahr trigger is far superior to the LCP as are the sights.

If you shot the LCP before 2013, then you have not shot the Gen 2 LCP with improved trigger and sights.

The Kahr P380 has some advantages over the LCP. But the 2013 LCP upgrades have narrowed the gap. A few simple aftermarket parts narrow the gap even further. There is not $200 difference between the P380 and a slightly modified Gen2 LCP.

Not to mention that the P380 has no edge on reliability, and may even trail the LCP in that regard.

And I have owned 3 great Kahrs and chose a Kahr for my subcompact 9mm. It's not like I hate Kahr.

 

[Buck1959]

Hi

After a lot of research, I chose to buy a LCP today over the P380 or soon to be released CW380.

I have owned several Kahrs, and have a P9 Covert that I really like. I was looking for a lighter pistol, decided that .380 was the solution.

I test fired a P380 at the range and liked it, but I got spooked after reading too many horror stories about P380 reliability.

I have not shot the LCP yet, but I know it's an improved version of the proven KelTec P3AT design. After 4 years of production, the LCP seems to have worked the kinks out.

My LCP is the 2013 version with improved sights and trigger. For more info:

See this video

Also on the way are:

1. Hogue Hybrid grip sleeve
2. Galloway guide rod & 13 lb recoil spring

My research indicates these upgrades will soften the recoil.

I plan to paint my sights with dayglo yellow in front, and maybe dayglo orange in back. If that doesn't work, I might try nitesiters.

I'm looking into a Uncle George wallet holster and a variety of front pocket holsters.

After studying various ballistics tests (including the wonderful Mousegun blog) I am leaning towards standard pressure flat nose FMJ/Hardcast. Either Winchester white box, Remington UMC Leadless or Buffalo Bore.

I hope to be able to hit the range within 14 days. I'll try to post pics.

Overall, I really like my LCP. I own the newest version of the LCP and I have added the Hogue Hybrid grip sleeve and the Galloway SS guide rod & 13 lb recoil spring. The grip sleeve seems to help me manage the recoil slightly better. As far as range ammo, so far the gun eats everything I have cycled through it. It seems to be a fairly accurate shooter and I haven't had any stove pipes after some 200+ rounds.
I got my CCW permit last week and went to my gun shop for some hollow point ammo since I wanted to use the LCP for DC. The guy behind the counter said that the only hollow point that works flawless in the LCP was Hornady critical defense. Of course, they didn't have any and I can't find it anywhere! But at the same gun shop two nights later, the owner told me that his own employee was crazy! He said he has owned four LCP's and stands by them as the best compact .380 for DC. He sold me some Winchester hollow point and swore to me I would have no problems.
I think I am going to cycle through a couple clips of the Winchester ammo this weekend at the range just to see how the gun likes it.