Kahr P380 vs Ruger LCP vs Ruger LCP II vs Sig P238 vs Beretta Pico

[WVsig]

The wife is looking at adding a pocket carry gun. She is looking for a LCP sized gun. It will be a dedicated pocket gun for carry when she cannot carry on the belt. Here are the contenders.

Ruger LCP Gen 2: I have the LCP and she has shot it and it would work but as most of us who own a LCP know its trigger is not the greatest but at $170 it is hard to beat as a pocket gun. This is the size we are looking at. She does not want to go any bigger.

Kahr P380: The other contenders are the P380 which can be had $350 give or take. I have a CW9 and the trigger on the P380 is going to be similar. It is a long trigger pull but it is much smoother than the LCP. My CW9 has been reliable but looking for peoples feedback on the P380.

The Ruger LCP II: The LCP II is larger but not by much. I have read up on the SA nature of the LCP II and I believe in the right holster is safe but would love to hear peoples thoughts. I have not shot this one but am wondering is the trigger pull that much better. How does it conceal in the pocket vs the original. At $200 it is not much of a step up from the original LCP.

Sig P238: The final contender is the Sig P238. I am not fan of this gun historically but it is a soft shooter and Sig after years of beta testing on paying customers seem to have worked out the kinks. It is the nicest trigger of the bunch but is more costly than the others at $450 give or take.

Beretta Pico: This one I have not shot but the newest versions look good on paper. My understanding is that it is a very soft shooter for a pocket gun.

So what are peoples thoughts?

 

[ABTOMAT]

I currently have a couple not on your list. A Taurus TCP and a Kel-Tec P32. The TCP has a remarkably smooth/light trigger and seems excellent quality. The downside to the TCP is that it still has the old Kel-Tec style disconnector that can leave you with a dead trigger if you short-stroke it. The LCP doesn't have that "feature" although its trigger is worse.

Used to own a P238. Shot well but I wouldn't consider it a pocket gun if your pants fit. It's considerably larger and heavier than the other guns you mentioned. Mine also kept losing the slide stop/takedown lever due to a lousy spring design.

Also used to own two Seecamps for completeness's sake--what an awfully overrated gun.

Ruger's CS is excellent so I'd still be thinking LCP in your position. Proably the LCP Custom or whatever the one with the metal trigger is. Never handled a Kahr so can't comment on that.

 

[WVsig]

I currently have a couple not on your list. A Taurus TCP and a Kel-Tec P32. The TCP has a remarkably smooth/light trigger and seems excellent quality. The downside to the TCP is that it still has the old Kel-Tec style disconnector that can leave you with a dead trigger if you short-stroke it. The LCP doesn't have that "feature" although its trigger is worse.

Used to own a P238. Shot well but I wouldn't consider it a pocket gun if your pants fit. It's considerably larger and heavier than the other guns you mentioned. Mine also kept losing the slide stop/takedown lever due to a lousy spring design.

Also used to own two Seecamps for completeness's sake--what an awfully overrated gun.

Ruger's CS is excellent so I'd still be thinking LCP in your position. Proably the LCP Custom or whatever the one with the metal trigger is. Never handled a Kahr so can't comment on that.

It is my understanding that the LCP Custom is discontinued now that the LCP II is out. I also did not love the tall sights on the Custom. For me I felt it would snag coming out of my pocket so I went with the Gen 2 LCP.

 

[Tony k]

I have a Kahr cw380. In case you are unfamiliar, it's basically a P380 with conventional rifling, mim slide stop, and less refined slide machining. It's been a great little shooter and super easy to pocket carry. I think it has very soft recoil, but I have no experience with other small 380s. Trigger is long and smooth.

As is common, mine didn't like fiocchi ammo until I modified the extractor. That's the only malfunction it's had with factory ammo. No malfs with any self defense ammo. I've got somewhere between 500 and 1000 rounds on it since I picked it up this past spring.

I hear a lot of people complain about how difficult they are to rack the slide. I've never had a problem myself, but it comes up pretty often Also, chambering a round in Kahr pistols is supposed to be done by releasing the slide stop rather than the slingshot method. It's never caused a malf in any of my three Kahr pistols, but apparently it can according to the owners manual.

Kahr is worth considering, but I'd steer her toward the Cw380.

 

[C0untZer0]

The manual of arms for the Sig is pretty different from the other guns mentioned. Is your wife OK with flipping a manual safety off?

My issue with the Kahrs is that the slide stop gouges my thumb, but that can be fixed with a Dremel.

I like the Remington RM380. I think its a very soft shooter. Maybe a downside to it is that it has plain iron sights that are milled into the slide (same as the LCP). You can equip a Kahr with really nice night sights.

The Taurus TCP is not a bad gun and you can sometimes get them for as little as $139.99 - shipped.

My experience with the Pico was not a good one and it had already gone back to the factory to get Beretta's treatment to fix the common problems that people complianed about. I thought the Pico I shot needed to be sent to Beretta for whatever upgrades they do, but then I found out it had been sent in ! .

My 5-shot group at 15 feet was about 7 inches and I was shooting low and to the left. I didn't have too little finger on the trigger, wasn't breaking my wrist down, my head wasn't drooping and I wasn't "slapping" the trigger. It just took a lot to pull that trigger. Another shooter fired 7 shots, had an 6-shot group that measured 8" and one that missed the paper, 3 of the shots were low left, 1 shot was way left, one shot was straight under the bullseye by about 4 inches - and this is at 15 feet.

I had some nice shot groups with my other guns afterwards so I don't think it was me.

I also was unable to drop the mag, it came out eventually with a LOT of pressure, (I had to put the pistol on the shooting bench and press on the mag release with my thumb)

Maybe the Picos coming off the line are totally different now - if Beretta made changes to the gun since January of this year, I wasn't paying attention and missed it.

 

[Fiv3r]

I had a Pico and I really liked it. Very well built and a soft, accurate shooter

However, two things turned me off ultimately: I bought mine new, but it was older stock and had not been upgraded. Beretta would not take it back without me paying for it. $50 to ship a $250 gun to upgrade it how it should have been from the factory.
The firing pin is quite fragile. I never had an issue with mine, but it was enough to scare me off after awhile.

I've had the original LCP and it was a great pocket gun. Kept it for years before going with a BG. I went with the Pico over the BG.

However, after tying out the LCP II, I have found it to be the best pocket gun for my needs. Affordable, reliable, accurate, great trigger, Ruger CS.

 

[Tirod]

The LCP II is slightly larger and the Kahr CW380 is very close in size and weight. The original LCP is just enough smaller that it can be incrementally an easier gun to carry in a pocket - but it all depends on the pocket holster you use. A layered, then folded sewn holster can bulk up pocket carry quite a bit.

One issue I've had with the LCP vs Kahr is perceived recoil and trigger pull. The Kahr was a much more pleasant experience with both. At this point in your search it's time to take the lady out and shoot each. HER impression on how they shoot is now more important than our impression of which is suitable. Recoil, trigger pull, slide rack, etc is important.

Another issue is carry - and our impression of how is basically flawed in a lot of respects. Women carry differently, while some men may only consider an IWB with a good pistol belt, a female may prefer a neoprene belly band holster - and there are some really good ones out there now, in styles and colors no "self respecting" male would consider.

It's not about what traditional boned gun leather with metal clip is rated high fashion any more. Sorry. You can actually do better with $30 of sewn synthetics.

Go let her shoot them without looking over her shoulder and live with a happy choice on her part. You do not want to be associated with forcing something on her she doesn't like.

 

[usp9]

I chose the Pico after looking at all other pocket guns. The Pico has the features I want in a pocket carry. It is very thin and hides well. The DAO trigger is the type I prefer and it's connected to a hammer. It is indeed a very soft shooter, (as compared to the Ruger). The Pico has usable three dot sights. Take down and maintenance is fast and simple. The modular design is pretty cool, allowing three different frame to be used, (standard, laser or light as well as some colors if that appeals to you). The Pico is a high quality, solid gun. The "enhanced" model is what you want if you select the Pico. I carry in a Remora holster.

Good luck with your decision.

 

[WVsig]

I chose the Pico after looking at all other pocket guns. The Pico has the features I want in a pocket carry. It is very thin and hides well. The DAO trigger is the type I prefer and it's connected to a hammer. It is indeed a very soft shooter, (as compared to the Ruger). The Pico has usable three dot sights. Take down and maintenance is fast and simple. The modular design is pretty cool, allowing three different frame to be used, (standard, laser or light as well as some colors if that appeals to you). The Pico is a high quality, solid gun. The "enhanced" model is what you want if you select the Pico. I carry in a Remora holster.

Good luck with your decision.

I have seen a lot of reports of Picos going back to Beretta. How do you know you are getting an enhanced model?

 

[usp9]

I have seen a lot of reports of Picos going back to Beretta. How do you know you are getting an enhanced model?

The box the Beretta comes in is clearly marked as such. All new Picos will be enhanced, which involves a different recoil spring, different slide machining and a couple other changes. My Pico has been perfect with a wide variety of ammo brands.

 

[98bluewave]

I bought a Pico about 18 mos. ago, the box indicated the model was a revised version. My hand strength is not good, but I had great difficulty racking the slide. Before I ever shot it I traded it for another pistol. Of the other brands you mentioned, I am only familiar with the Sig P238. The P238 is a very soft shooter, accurate, and the slide is easy to rack.

 

[bgw45]

My son just took the TX LTC class and shot a 248 out of 250 with a Kahr CW380. The barrel is 2.5? The instructor was most impressed. I am too.

 

[WVsig]

Nice most of the shooting for that test is under 7 yards into a B27 right? Still pretty good.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

I have a number of post with the Pico. I have owned 4 LCP's and now shoot only the Pico. Actually two. I liked the first one so well, I bought a second. The New Gen Pico's are totally awesome quality and reliability. Shoot very mild.
Modular design
All Stainless Steel construction except for the Modular grip which is easy to take down
DOUBLE STRIKE CAPABILITY
The easiest take down I have seen on a pistol
Beefed up barrel, take down pin etc. Stainless steel recoil rod.
Mags are all stainless right down to the follower and fit very tight/flush-look like high end custom 1911 mags.
Great trigger for a pocket gun. A little stiff when new but break in nicely-
The gun screams quality.
Thousands of rounds with mixed ammo and reliability.
One of the best sights in Class and very easy to change out to night sights.

Yes I like the Sigs and they are mild shooters as well. I also own a Kahr, but although nice quality is very finicky with ammo. Does not like hollow points and cartridges with long OAL.

Spend some time with the Pico and if you are like myself, actually grips better than my other pocket guns. Solid hold between thumb and forefinger. Anchors like a rock in the fatty tissue between the two.
And as I have mentioned numerous times, a very MILD shooter. Recoil is very low with this gun. I have many post with Pics, but will post more if needed.

Example

 

[gbran]

The wife is looking at adding a pocket carry gun. She is looking for a LCP sized gun. It will be a dedicated pocket gun for carry when she cannot carry on the belt. Here are the contenders.

Ruger LCP Gen 2: I have the LCP and she has shot it and it would work but as most of us who own a LCP know its trigger is not the greatest but at $170 it is hard to beat as a pocket gun. This is the size we are looking at. She does not want to go any bigger.

Kahr P380: The other contenders are the P380 which can be had $350 give or take. I have a CW9 and the trigger on the P380 is going to be similar. It is a long trigger pull but it is much smoother than the LCP. My CW9 has been reliable but looking for peoples feedback on the P380.

The Ruger LCP II: The LCP II is larger but not by much. I have read up on the SA nature of the LCP II and I believe in the right holster is safe but would love to hear peoples thoughts. I have not shot this one but am wondering is the trigger pull that much better. How does it conceal in the pocket vs the original. At $200 it is not much of a step up from the original LCP.

Sig P238: The final contender is the Sig P238. I am not fan of this gun historically but it is a soft shooter and Sig after years of beta testing on paying customers seem to have worked out the kinks. It is the nicest trigger of the bunch but is more costly than the others at $450 give or take.

Beretta Pico: This one I have not shot but the newest versions look good on paper. My understanding is that it is a very soft shooter for a pocket gun.

So what are peoples thoughts?

I have the Kahr P380 and the Sig P238. The P380 is near perfect in size and ergonomics, but for me it has 2 problems. 1st is the slide requires great grip and strength, for more than my GF can manage. I ended up giving her one of my J-Frames instead. 2nd, after nearly 300 rounds and lots of cleaning and oiling, it is not reliable. Kahr said you had to run 200 rounds to break it in.

My P238 has been a dream.

 

[Jeb Stuart]

I would agree with you on the fact that I am not sold on the reliability of My Kahr. The slide worked in fine for me, yes difficult at first, but not something I notice now. In contrast to the Pico which seems to feed any thing I have put through it with great reliability. Both mine very reliable consistently. I really wanted to like the Kahr, I really like the build quality and it is a shame that Kahr just cannot overcome some of the feed issues. I have mine in the shop now and when it comes out and shoots well with the ammo it likes, I will most likely sell it or trade it. It is a fine shooter, very mild, great sights, etc. Just do not really trust it for CCW.