Lee ProAutoDisk and Lee scale and Modern reloading dont add up...

[Red_Dog_Leader]

Ok, Heres what I'm trying to do...

Page 534 of Lee M.R. book:recommends start @ 4.8 grains of UNIQUE for a 125 grain jacketed bullet.

Which in the 2nd next column for the A.Disk - to use cavity .49, which I lined up...

I run the ram up, drop the powder in, remove case from shell holder and head to the LEE scale.

It's very light, like 3/16ths of an inch from the zero indicator.

I say hmmm, maybe I didn't "zero" out the scale in the setup just right.
So I did it again, and again...

I get a "solid white line on the 0, a faint white line on the 1 and the 9.
Put the pan on and adjust the poise, being careful not to bump or move scale and not bump zero poise. scale should be zeroed.

Next, I move the grain window to 4, then the .1 poise to get a "solid" white line above the 8, with a faint white lines under the 9 & 7, right?...charge the case again, weigh and its light again!

Ive rechecked the AutoDisk, .49 is in, tuned the hopper to "on", heck I've even took it all down and removed powder and checked for lint, obstructions, whatever, a few times. I did notice if you go to "on" till the hopper stops moving it looks to me that it might of "overshot" the hole in the base, going back to "off" just a hair seems to line up the hopper hole and base hole better...I even filled that friggin hopper to max thinking it needed more head pressure...

So, wheres my problem, Autodisk not performing correctly, scale not performing correctly??? I'm blind and cant see the ittybitty white lines well enough.

See, I'm assuming if the book says to use the .49 cavity, then when I weigh, with the scale set to what I think is a "good" 4.8, it should zero out, right?



TIA, Tom :banghead::banghead::banghead:

 

[darwin-t]

It ain't you, it's the chart. Lee is VERY conservative with their charts. I have found that I needed disk openings 1 or 2 sizes bigger than the chart says to get the weight stated on the chart. I think they do this in case somebody uses the charts without weighing, so there won't be a chance of over charging.

It sounds like you've learned to read the scale correctly. Bump up to .53 and find the actual weight of the charge. That's easier than setting it on what you WANT to end up with and trying to get the charge to match it.

You may not get the exact weight you want - but you'll get close enough for gumminent work.

Let us know how things work out. I've found that setting the scale up at eye level makes it a LOT easier to read. I also use a ball point pen to move the doodad. That works better than my fat finger.

You set the scale on Zero and adjustied the nut to get it to read zero, didn't you?

 

[Red_Dog_Leader]

You set the scale on Zero and adjustied the nut to get it to read zero, didn't you?

Yep, did that.

Right now I'm about to do what you suggested, bump up and find actual...

Thanks, D for savin my sanity. Gezz setting up gears in rear ends was easier to pick up than this...

 

[Red_Dog_Leader]

Well. .53 was better, .57 is dead on...

 

[pinkymingeo]

You won't find that big a difference with other powders. The new Unique seems to measure very differently from the old in the autodisk.

 

[darwin-t]

Two sizes bigger. THAT'S what my experience has been, I edited my original response to "1 or 2" just to be safe.

I really like Unique, it meters well. I have also used Titegroup and Bullseye. They are faster and use smaller charges, but I like Unique best.

 

[darwin-t]

Pinkymingeo, did you mean that with other powders the chart won't be 2 sizes off? My experience has been the same for all three powders I've used - Bullseye, Titegroup and Unique. It's been pretty consistent.

 

[benedict1]

Win 231 will be very close to the chart, darwin. Most ball powders seem to be close; they also don't experience the variations in density from lot-to-lot that we often see with flake powders.

 

[darwin-t]

I stand corrected.

 

[Redhat]

I'm a beginner but I've been using W231 and it's always right on the button. I don' have the Lee scale, I use an RCBS 505...easier for me to read.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

The number on the hole doesn't tell you how much the charge will weigh. You have to use the chart that came with the Powder Measure to see which hole will give you the weight you are looking for. Also, you will get different weights from the same hole when charging different powders. They will meter differently because of the size of the flakes. If you don’t have the chart you can get a copy from the Lee site. http://www.leeprecision.com/cgi-data/instruct/AD2302.pdf

 

[rdhood]

+1

the OP explained this, though. I guess what he was pointing out is that the Lee charts appear to be conservative, and don't quite weight out as much as the chart says

 

[FullEffect1911]

But wait! There's more.

It's been in my limited experience that with the pro auto disk you need to weigh what comes out of there and go with that (as others have said so +1 to that).

However if you use say (arbitrary number) 1.00 cc with the double disk, then 1.00cc with the normal single disk, then 1.00cc with the micrometer adjustment, they will all weigh differently. I find the pro auto disk to be super consistent from charge to charge while reloading, but I wouldn't take what the chart says to be the word of law. Great starting point however.

If you haven't tried it, the micrometer adjustment add on is a great way to change charge weight without taking the top off. Not required, but saves some time.

 

[pinkymingeo]

Most powders, at least for me, don't require 2 sizes up on the autodisk. Just Unique. The Lee scale is a pain to deal with, and not easy to zero. If you move it a little on the bench, you need to zero again. Better yet, get a decent scale. I gave up on the Lee early on, and got a used RCBS 505 that's world's better.

 

[strat81]

I'll weigh in here with my experience (pun intended).

The auto-disk charts and Modern Reloading give disk numbers as a starting point. It is paramount that you weigh the charges. That being said, my auto disk throws very consistent charges (at least with Titegroup, Universal, and Power Pistol which are the only powders I've run through it). However, I generally weigh every tenth charge to make sure everything is working right.

My biggest frustration has been the adjustable charge bar. Maybe it's because I'm using smaller (less than 6.0 gr) charge weights, or maybe it's the powder I use. I can never get it to throw consistent charges. I suppose that if I was reloading precision ammo I'd use a different method of throwing powder than the charge bar.

I haven't used the double-disk kit, so I can't say for sure how well or consistent that is.

Lee products have been great to me. However, my impression of the company is that they are not geared towards precision shooters. That's not to say you can't reload very good, very accurate, very consistent ammo with Lee equipment, but you might have to throw in a few products from other companies or spend a little more time weighing charges, prepping cases, etc. They're kind of like the Honda Civic of reloading gear. Low price, good product, reliable, solid company, and will get you from point A to point B. However, it won't win you any drag races, tractor pulls, or transport your family of 8.

All of my stuff is Lee except for my scale (Frankford Arsenal), chamfer tool (RCBS, but I have the Lee one too), .223 sizing die (RCBS X-Die), and bullet puller (RCBS). When the time came for me to expand my setup from pistol to rifle, the vast majority of stuff I bought was Lee.

 

[jfh]

I'm developing 2" barrel loads right now

and using Lee equipment to do it. I want practice rounds for my 340 and 640 carry guns. I used to load mostly .45 ACP and 10mm, with some .40S&W, in production for my pistols, on a Pro 1000 and / or an early Loadmaster, but I had turrets for load development. I got out my reloading equipment after a ten-year hiatus and updated some of the gear--including a pro measure upgrade and a new pro measure.

I have adjustable charge bars on all the measures. Two are aftermarket items from about fifteen years ago; two are the new Lee ones. I've not used disks since I bought the first bar six months into reloading in '89 or so.

So far, I have only loaded 231 and Titegroup. Load ranges have run from 3.5 gr. to 5.4 gr. in .38Spl or .357Mag--recommended recipes from Win, Hodgdon, etc. Unlike strat81, all my charges so far are remarkably consistent. For titegroup, the variance is about +- .05 grain, and 231 varies by no more than .1 gr.

These weights are confirmed on either the FA digital or the Lee scale--usually the Lee scale. Unlike Pinkymingeo, my Lee scale seems to be fine--it's a new one, and the only trouble I have is that I have to take the arm off to adjust the weight accurately because of older eyes.

These charges were done on an updated Turret. Since the turret operation provides a 'settling,' I suspect that contributes to the consistency. I make a point of keeping the measures more than 50% full, which also helps.

Whenever I change charges, I weigh until I get two consistent charges, then reinsert the index rod and cycle the machine and weigh again. I use ten-round runs, and I weigh an 11th one to confirm the weight.

Jim H.

 

[FieroCDSP]

Lee even states somewhere (modern reloading, I think) that their measures end up a little below. Use the cavity that gives you the charge closest to what you're wanting. With flake powders (clays, Unique, etc) I give the Pro auto disc two taps on the side of the housing just above the disk, to settle the powder in the cavity. I went from a having a noticible variation with occasional severe undercharge, to a consistant charge with +/- .1 grain variation, which is perfectly acceptable for my practice loads. I still measure by hand for near-max or precision loads.

 

[BBQJOE]

Using both unique and w231 I always find a difference of .2gr one way or the other using Lees Auto disk.

I can live with it.

 

[rdhood]

+1 on the +/- .1 grain variation for the auto disc with W231. For plinking, that is plenty accurate with W231.

 

[kellyj00]

i'm loading red dot with the lee pro auto disc .46 cavity. I get CONSISTENTLY 4.3 grains of powder.

I can't get that close with a dipper! Seriously though, if you're starting at the minimum loads, then having a few tenths extra/short isn't going to affect your situation too much.

Hell, I've got some 45acp that I loaded 2 grains of titewad in that cycled just fine.

 

[brentfoto]

pinkymingeo: Most powders, at least for me, don't require 2 sizes up on the autodisk. Just Unique. The Lee scale is a pain to deal with, and not easy to zero. If you move it a little on the bench, you need to zero again. Better yet, get a decent scale. I gave up on the Lee early on, and got a used RCBS 505 that's world's better.
July 13th, 2007 06:25 AM

+1. I have two Lee Safety Powder Scales and they are quite accurate, but slow, and you have to average readings many times. You will know what a joy it is to work up/check loads when you purchase a really good balance beam like the Dillon Eliminator.

Check out my review of it on the Cabela's website:

http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/links/link.jsp;jsessionid=SXKOAV3CJ1XVOCWQNWRSCNIK0BW0IIWE?id=0032559215904a&type=product&cmCat=search&returnPage=search-results1.jsp&QueryText=Dillon+Eliminator+scale&N=4887&Ntk=Products&Ntx=mode+matchall&Nty=1&Ntt=Dillon+Eliminator+scale&noImage=0

 

[Zeke Menuar]

Chuck the manual.

Set your scale to the charge weight you want.

Pick a disk with a hole that is close to the volume you think you'll need.

Check it with the scale. You might have to do trial and error with the scale but that's the only way to be sure to get the correct charge.

I used this method to get a decent charge for H335. The Lee manual is way off.

ZM

 

[Red_Dog_Leader]

Chuck the manual.

Set your scale to the charge weight you want.

Pick a disk with a hole that is close to the volume you think you'll need.

Check it with the scale. You might have to do trial and error with the scale but that's the only way to be sure to get the correct charge.

I used this method to get a decent charge for H335. The Lee manual is way off.

ZM

ZM, thats my routine now.

Cross checking LEE scale with PACT also. With my eyes the PACT is a little better to see.

All though I'm finding out once I get that LEE beam in good light and wear good glasses to adjust the lines, I'ts pretty dang close to the PACT.....

 

[Stinger]

I wonder how often Lee updates their information about which disk to use? I'd guess only everytime a new book comes out, and they only have two, right?

 

[Zeke Menuar]

Lee doesn't list any data for Varget or RL-15 in their manual or data sheets for the disk measures.
I'm guessing it's been sometime since the disk charts have been revised.

ZM